No glow plugs - heater

[Jay4200]

My L4200's glow plug function just decided to die - appropriately as this is the first time in the 6 years I've owned the tractor that I am using it in the winter to run a snow blower. I've started it down to 20-25F this season so far w/o problem BUT my worry is those 0 degree mornings (like coming this weekend). My barn isn't heated, and always seems to be 10 degrees colder than outside, for some reason .

Until I fix the glow plug issue, I was planning on just draping a sheet over the front of the tractor and cranking up a 1500W ceramic heater/fan that blows heat under it. There is no fire hazard, so don't worry about that. I figure 15 minutes of that should have the motor toasty. Any comments?

JayC

 

[Craig Clayton]

I guess you have seen all the other posts about the glow plugs. The portable heater should work. I have had good luck using a 800 watt car interior warm up heater. I just came in from 5 F and I use my lower rad hose heater at 300 watts for 1 hr min 2 Hr max and I did not even use the glow plugs. I rolled it to start and it started like it was a summers day. They also magnetic 300 watt heaters.
As you will notice I have suggested smaller wattage heaters than 1500 W which will work provided you keep track of it.
Craig Clayton

 

[jimmysisson]

I figure 15 minutes of that should have the motor toasty. Any comments? JayC

15 minutes in a cold barn on cold cast iron should get the block from 10 degrees to 12 degrees. If that's enough, you should start. There might be a slight warming of the air cleaner/passageways to help you out.
I would think a couple of hours might help more.
Jim

 

[Willl]

I gota agree with Jimmy here, it'll need more than 15 minutes.

 

[Ductape]

Plugging in a block heater would be easier.

 

[PILOON]

I have been caught in a similar situation and had a magnetic heater on hand (garage sale find).
I found it to be totally useless even leaving it on overnight.
IMHO a hair drier blowing into the intake would be better.
I just needed to wait a few days to get a new block heater and fortunately it did not snow in the meantime.
I can tell you that at -25 changing a block heater is no fun, but I got'er done!

 

[Jay4200]

Plugging in a block heater would be easier.

Not exactly. When you don't have a block heater, plugging it in is close to impossible .

This heater-start is happening in two days.

JayC

 

[Jay4200]

15 minutes in a cold barn on cold cast iron should get the block from 10 degrees to 12 degrees. If that's enough, you should start. There might be a slight warming of the air cleaner/passageways to help you out.
I would think a couple of hours might help more.
Jim

Maybe. I'll bet its 100F under that sheet in 15 minutes though...

JayC

 

[jonyyuma]

I like the hair-dryer in the intake, if all else has failed. I don't have block heater. Jy.

 

[wvpolekat]

Maybe. I'll bet its 100F under that sheet in 15 minutes though...

JayC

That doesn't mean the engine is anywhere near that. You still have to put enough BTUs into the large chunk of cast iron to raise the temp, as well as all the oil and coolant. It is a lot of mass to heat up, and it will still be shedding heat via the bellhousing, transmission and anything else not under your cover.

I would bet that it would take at least 1 hour to warm it up an appreciable amount. Remember, your 1500 watts of heat are having to heat they air, which is then heating the tractor. Air is a lousy method to conduct heat this way.

 

[Argosy]

I also don't think the heater will do much for hours. If there's any place you can set it to heat the intake without melting wiring or tubing that would be a lot faster.

What caused the glow plug failure? With them all dead I think of a common failure like a relay or the ignition switch. If that's it you can jump from the battery to the wire that feeds the glow plugs.

For only a time or two it doesn't have to be any fancier than a heavy enough piece of jumper wire. Hold one against the starter cable terminal and stick the other into the connector of the relay socket going to the glow plugs or a glow plug contact if they're exposed.

 

[Ford tractor]

Probably the glow plug relay. Pretty cheap and quick to swap out. The actual plugs are pretty robust.

It could also be as simple as a mouse bit a wire or the plug is loose. Check the simple stuff first.

 

[LBrown59]

I gota agree with Jimmy here, it'll need more than 15 minutes.

I will third that.

 

[JB4310]

This works in 10 minutes!

 

[Jay4200]

Probably the glow plug relay. Pretty cheap and quick to swap out. The actual plugs are pretty robust.

It could also be as simple as a mouse bit a wire or the plug is loose. Check the simple stuff first.

No doubt - it might just be a loose connection - I did remove/reconnect them to access my brake adjustment bar a few months ago. If it is a relay failure, I'll likely replace it with a solid-state device. If it is a controller failure, I'll either build a new one or just put in a push-button bypass.

The problem is that they are nestled under the dash, and dash removal is a PITA, especially when it's in the single digits. I'm just looking for a stop-gap measure to use in the meantime until I have time to attack it. I've started my tractor down to ~20F, and it starts OK w/o the glow plugs (maybe 10 seconds of cranking), but I think I might have some trouble if it is closer to zero.

JayC

 

[Will_C]

I did not have a block heater on my BX 2200, and I did the same thing as JB 4310-I pointed the kerosene space heater at the tractor in an unheated garage, and the tractor spun over and started up like it was summer after 15-20 minutes.

I don't recommend it, but I watched my father start a small fire under a bulldozer on a logging job! That got a dozer that would not even turn over to start in about a 1/2 hour.

Will

 

[drawbar]

I use a 1500 watt heater to fire up a older tractor no cover.just put on a cinder block for 30-40min fired right up.saved my starter and batt.need longer than 15

 

[Kays Supply]

I have a one lung diesel on a piece of equipment. No glow plug. If I have to leave it in the cold, I take a 1500 watt heat gun and point it into the air box. I have to crank it for a while but it has always started that way. A jumper cable to the battery helps spin it better and that helps even more.

 

[Jay4200]

I use a 1500 watt heater to fire up a older tractor no cover.just put on a cinder block for 30-40min fired right up.saved my starter and batt.need longer than 15

That's what I'm talking about. There IS a lot of cast iron, but cast iron has crappy thermal mass anyway. I don't think shooting warm air into the intake will do anything. Once the motor is running, the intake air remains ice cold for the duration. I know that it is cylinder wall temp that causes a gas engine to require choking. I have no clue why diesels start hard in the cold - but I'd have to assume that it is a similar situation to gas motors and is actually cylinder wall temp that makes the difference.

It never ceases to amaze me, given the thousands of degrees that occur during normal operating conditions in a cylinder, that engines care about ambient temperature changes of tens of degrees.

It's still all speculation though - it was somewhere in the vicinity of 15F at best on Sat morning when I used my tractor last. No glow plugs - about a 10 second crank, then coughed and snorted a couple of times on the first few revolutions, but basically started OK.

JayC

 

[JB4310]

I don't think shooting warm air into the intake will do anything. Once the motor is running, the intake air remains ice cold for the duration.


JayC

Warm intake air makes a huge difference for starting a cold diesel, don't know all the science behind it but...

On the Cummins truck engines there is a heater grid in the intake that preheats air for starting and warming up, you will see the lights dim as it cycles on and off, there's also a fuel heater as well.

Idealy you would have a block heater for the engine mass and some type way to heat both air and fuel.
On a tractor you get by with a 110 volt AC block heater and glow plugs. the glow plugs will warm the combustion air a little and help fire off the cold diesel.

The warm air into the intake would definetly help and could be the difference between starting or not as long as fuel system is not frozen, you could leave the dryer on after it starts for a while to help keep it going.

JB.