Tractor recomendation for my new farm

[bzb]

Hey - just looking for opinions. I have a new farm, pretty much a blank slate - just under 35 acres.

Here is what the land looks like aproximately; 23 acres field/pasture, 1/2 acre tank pond, 5 acres trees, 3 acres of pecan orchard, 2 acres maintained yard/driveway area (driveway is paved). That's about it give or take.

We will run some cattle (3-10 head) on the land at most. Ideally we'd like to grow enough hay to make it through the winter. We'll also run a few dozen meat goats and a few pigs.

My immediate needs are fencing and mowing - I do need to maintain the 23+acres of field, and would like to be able to do the yard as well, but there is a sprinkler and I think a heavier tractor wouldn't work.

I'm not tied to having something big enough to bail the hay, although I have found some bailers that run on low pto (slow maybe, but they're out there). I just want to be able to lift/load and take care of all of our needs on the farm. I'll probably be needing to move round bail around for feed - maybe.

I did visit a JD dealer and he steered me to the 5000e series of utility tractors. I'll visit a few more dealers this coming week I think.

At any rate, I was hoping to get some ideas from you all on the size I would need to take care of the property.

Thanks!

 

[Carykong]

welcome aboard. Goats,pigs,and cattle on 23 acres will place some real limits on the quanity of hay you can expect to grow. If you opt for more livestock,I would not bother with investing in hay bailing equipment. Your livestock will keep the pasture mowed. You may not need a utility tractor(50 horseplus) if you opt out of haymaking. Good luck and have fun with the new property.

 

[doall]

I don't think you will have enough room for hay fields and pasture land for grazing either, so a 30-40 horse tractor would probably keep your weight down for you. As far as pto speed its either 540 or 1000 on any tractor. A 40 horse tractor will run a square bailer ok, but you might consider a small ag. tractor for hay work. I guess the JD dealer is talking about the 5045 5065 tractors. That would be good for hay. Not too big not too small.

 

[TripleR]

For your needs, I would be looking at about a 35-40 HP machine with HST. I don't believe the 5000 has HST available, so that would put you in the 4000 Series. Kubota has these available in the L and MX I believe as do other manufacturers.

 

[wmonroe]

A machine in the 30-40 hp range should work well. I don't think you would have to give up hay bailing even if you went with a 30 hp tractor. Growing up my dad bailed hay with a Kubota B8200HST which is only rated at 19 pto hp. It wasn't super fast but it ran the bailer fine. That was just dropping the hay bales on the ground and then using the wagon and picking them up later. Just saying you don't need a 50+ hp tractor to bale hay.

 

[TripleR]

Just to throw this out there, HP is certainly not going to be your only consideration. There are many older geared units out there that will do an awful lot of work due to their weight and construction. Many on here do an awful lot of work with older equipment. My brothers use elusively our old 730 Case built in the 60's and a couple of 600 Series Fords that were built in the 50's.

I like the newer models, but have an old MF375 that is a real work horse, well so long as you don't needs lights or working gauges, but that is a different story. Our renters use John Deere 8000 Series tractors with the exception of an old Case 1486 that is still reliable though pretty worn.

 

[NorthernChilli]

What about the mowing/conditioning of the hay ? What would be the PTO HP requirement for that part ?

And when wanting to renew the pasture, how heavy and how many HP would be needed to pull a plough (3 furrows as to not spend a month ploughing with a single bottom one)?

Thinking about the HP required for the equipment is one of the things to consider, but I'm just wondering about pulling the baler and a 8x20, 10 feet tall bale wagon full of hay... Are compact tractors heavy and bulky enough to do that safely on light and moderate slopes?

Phil

 

[bzb]

Thanks for the great info! Realistically we'll probably only have a few cattle and a dozen goats - the pigs will be in a pen. We're learning and certainly do want to do what we can to have enough hay for the winter for what we have - so that will limit what we raise - we want an even mix. We'll probably seed and fertilize some pasture for hay so we can make it through the winter - but maybe just letting them graze will do the trick.

I think JD was steering us towards the higher model for speed of jobs as much as moving hay. Who wants to spend a week mowing every few months? But maybe with some changes in our fencing we can get the animals to be doing that work for us.

Jason

 

[Soundguy]

Hey - just looking for opinions. I have a new farm, pretty much a blank slate - just under 35 acres.

Here is what the land looks like aproximately; 23 acres field/pasture, 1/2 acre tank pond, 5 acres trees, 3 acres of pecan orchard, 2 acres maintained yard/driveway area (driveway is paved). That's about it give or take.

We will run some cattle (3-10 head) on the land at most. Ideally we'd like to grow enough hay to make it through the winter. We'll also run a few dozen meat goats and a few pigs.

My immediate needs are fencing and mowing - I do need to maintain the 23+acres of field, and would like to be able to do the yard as well, but there is a sprinkler and I think a heavier tractor wouldn't work.

!

sounds like you have 23ac of grass available to cut hay from.. AND are planning on pigs, goats and cows. pigs won't take up much.. goats and cows will need forage. 3 cows and 4 goats will mow down 10ac easilly.. that leaves you with say.. 14.. figure getting 13 cut out of that.

were you thinking sqaure bales or round bales... that will make a difference on the tractor. if square.. then perhaps something in the 45 to 50hp range.. and if rounds.. more hp and preferably a loader.

if the land is flat and well drained, then 2wd will get you by.. if hilly or steep.. or wet.. get 4wd.

post back some more details.

soundguy

 

[pitt_md]

I have about the same set up as you but i have horses and 30 acres. I run a Kubota MX5000 (50hp) utility tractor. I do grow my own hay but I contract out the bailing. To be honest I would not want anything smaller than what I have to do everything that I do. Tractor and loader weigh about 5000 lbs though so i dont know if that would be to much for your lawn sprinkler.

 

[dmay]

If you have 3-10 cattle and a few dozen goats grazing on 23 acres you will probably find they keep it mowed down quite nicely. I doubt you would be able to get any hay baled. To try you would have to cross fence to keep animals off the hay land. So lets say you split your field and have 11+ acres to hay. Depending on your hay growth you might get a few hundred bales. I doubt enough to get your animals throw a winter. All depends on how many animals but I say consider not contemplating hay production and just leave the pasture for grazing.

You state immediate needs are fencing and mowing. I assume you mean to auger fence posts and then mowing 2 acres of yard and pasture. Really this could be done with a 25+hp tractor with a 3pt auger, RFM, RRC and a landscape rake or harrow for pasture maintenance.

 

[bzb]

Thanks soundguy.

Here is a map - that might help a bit.

We're aiming for self sufficient as much as we can at this point - so the farm helps pay for itself, we're just figuring out some things now - what we like, don't like so when we don't have a regular 9-5 job we'll have most of the basics under our belt - I know that things always change and this is a challenge, but we sure do have fun doing this.

Maybe we'll just have someone come in and do the hay - but that is a cost, or a portion of the hay. I'm sure with the size of area we're talking now it would not be worth it to own our own equipment, so probably a tractor that can get the round bales around well enough. Although that's another subject - what we should use to feed as with as few animals that we have part of the round bale would probably go to waste.

Our immediate needs are fencing and mowing, and without the fencing putting our animals out to pasture isn't going to happen.

The three steer we have now will go to the butcher in March probably unless we can't get the fencing done and they need to go earlier - but we've considered a few heifers to keep a small sustainable herd of a few cows (we'll use someone elses bull or ai if we can).

We'll also have some large gardens for vegetables - quite a bit of corn, garlic, etc. but nothing that would cover acres at this point.

Thanks again,
Jason

 

[bzb]

The option for the lawn mowing was a lighter tractor, but even the finish mower is expensive enough to consider alternatives... the JD guy was suggesting a zero turn... nice, but also expensive. If the tractor we get meets most needs and the lawn isn't one of them I can probably live with that.

My concern with turning them out now is the johnson grass, but I'm researching that - I think they'd be ok - it isn't damaged or look wilty - a little yellow maybe, just a little though.

Jason

 

[Jerry/MT]

Thanks soundguy.

Here is a map - that might help a bit.

We're aiming for self sufficient as much as we can at this point - so the farm helps pay for itself, we're just figuring out some things now - what we like, don't like so when we don't have a regular 9-5 job we'll have most of the basics under our belt - I know that things always change and this is a challenge, but we sure do have fun doing this.

Maybe we'll just have someone come in and do the hay - but that is a cost, or a portion of the hay. I'm sure with the size of area we're talking now it would not be worth it to own our own equipment, so probably a tractor that can get the round bales around well enough. Although that's another subject - what we should use to feed as with as few animals that we have part of the round bale would probably go to waste.

Our immediate needs are fencing and mowing, and without the fencing putting our animals out to pasture isn't going to happen.

The three steer we have now will go to the butcher in March probably unless we can't get the fencing done and they need to go earlier - but we've considered a few heifers to keep a small sustainable herd of a few cows (we'll use someone elses bull or ai if we can).

We'll also have some large gardens for vegetables - quite a bit of corn, garlic, etc. but nothing that would cover acres at this point.

Thanks again,
Jason

Seeing your properrty helps me underwstand what you are trying to do. I was certified as an Extension Livestock Advisor when I lived in Washington state. It's a voluntary position and we were trained to help the local county extension agent deal with small landholders and we were certified to do this after being trained by Washington State University.

The first question I'd ask you is what type of soil do you have and how is it rated for agricultural prduction. This info is generally available from NCRS in their soil map publications. Just looking at your picture I'd guess you might have several different soil types on your place.
Next what is the condition of the pastures that you have available? Are they weedy and in poor condition? Or are they productive with good forage species that are productive in your area of the country? What is the average rainfall in your area? Will it sustain pastures during the summer grazing season? At what stocking rate? How much hay is required to maintain an animal unit during the non-grazing season? Once you have the answers to these questions, you'll be able to estimate the carrying capacity of your ground and how many acres will be required to produce forage for winter feed. That will determine, initially, the number of grazing animals you will be able to stock your place with and produce the forage you need for winter feed.

If you're pastures are in poor shape, avoid stocking them until you get them in good condition. If they are weedy, you might considering grazing goats to diminsh the weeds though an integrated weed management plan using herbicides AND grazing will get you there faster.

As far as tractors are concerned, it depends on whether you will cut rake and bale your own hay, or whether you will have it done custom. Small square balers take less horsepower but require more hand labor to handle or more specialized equipment to get the bales off the field. Round bales need a bigger tractor to bale and handle but less labor over all. If you live in a place with very cold winters, having small bales that you can feed from a pick up will get you through those days where the tractor won't start or if you are down and out with the flu and your wife has to feed but is not a good hand with a tractor and a loader.
In general, figure out the horsepower required for the work you think you want to do now and then add 10-20% more horsepower for those jobs you will find out that you want to do AFTER you bought the tractor. If you end up doing round bales, you'll need a front end loader and most likely 4WD drive so you can stack, handle, and feed round bales in the mud of winter. (I always said I'd never feed large rounds because if the tractor doesn't start, the cows don't eat. I found out realitively quickly that you pay a premium for small squares in our country. Since I have some of my hay put up by a custom farmer and buy the rest to save buying all that expensive equipment, I feed large rounds and I wish I had 4WD! I also have a block heater to make sure the tractor will start.)

Haymaking will generally size the utility tractor horsepower for a non-farming situation and if you didn't make round bales, a 40-50 hp 4WD machine with a FEL will be the optimum, in my opinion, and still give you the option of making small squares. The 4WD drive is a good option with the FEL since 2WD tractors, unless they are in the 70-100 hp size, don't generally have the strongest of front axles for utility loader work.

I hope you find this helpful.

 

[Dr_Zinj]

I'm betting you don't have a whole lot of organic material in the soil there. If you can do the irrigation, you might want to plant clover and till it under for a few years to build it up. And if you can get the city to dump leaves and grass that will also go a long way to building up the soil.

 

[LostInTheWoods]

Seeing your properrty helps me underwstand what you are trying to do. I was certified as an Extension Livestock Advisor when I lived in Washington state. It's a voluntary position and we were trained to help the local county extension agent deal with small landholders and we were certified to do this after being trained by Washington State University.

The first question I'd ask you is what type of soil do you have and how is it rated for agricultural prduction. This info is generally available from NCRS in their soil map publications. Just looking at your picture I'd guess you might have several different soil types on your place.
Next what is the condition of the pastures that you have available? Are they weedy and in poor condition? Or are they productive with good forage species that are productive in your area of the country? What is the average rainfall in your area? Will it sustain pastures during the summer grazing season? At what stocking rate? How much hay is required to maintain an animal unit during the non-grazing season? Once you have the answers to these questions, you'll be able to estimate the carrying capacity of your ground and how many acres will be required to produce forage for winter feed. That will determine, initially, the number of grazing animals you will be able to stock your place with and produce the forage you need for winter feed.

If you're pastures are in poor shape, avoid stocking them until you get them in good condition. If they are weedy, you might considering grazing goats to diminsh the weeds though an integrated weed management plan using herbicides AND grazing will get you there faster.

As far as tractors are concerned, it depends on whether you will cut rake and bale your own hay, or whether you will have it done custom. Small square balers take less horsepower but require more hand labor to handle or more specialized equipment to get the bales off the field. Round bales need a bigger tractor to bale and handle but less labor over all. If you live in a place with very cold winters, having small bales that you can feed from a pick up will get you through those days where the tractor won't start or if you are down and out with the flu and your wife has to feed but is not a good hand with a tractor and a loader.
In general, figure out the horsepower required for the work you think you want to do now and then add 10-20% more horsepower for those jobs you will find out that you want to do AFTER you bought the tractor. If you end up doing round bales, you'll need a front end loader and most likely 4WD drive so you can stack, handle, and feed round bales in the mud of winter. (I always said I'd never feed large rounds because if the tractor doesn't start, the cows don't eat. I found out realitively quickly that you pay a premium for small squares in our country. Since I have some of my hay put up by a custom farmer and buy the rest to save buying all that expensive equipment, I feed large rounds and I wish I had 4WD! I also have a block heater to make sure the tractor will start.)

Haymaking will generally size the utility tractor horsepower for a non-farming situation and if you didn't make round bales, a 40-50 hp 4WD machine with a FEL will be the optimum, in my opinion, and still give you the option of making small squares. The 4WD drive is a good option with the FEL since 2WD tractors, unless they are in the 70-100 hp size, don't generally have the strongest of front axles for utility loader work.

I hope you find this helpful.

Dude, you're awesome. I have no interest in hay or livestock, but still enjoyed the thought and time you put into this response.:thumbsup:

 

[RPW]

I'm in a very similar position. 38ac but mine is a blank slate as the only thing on the property is the perimeter fence and a working windmill for my stock needs. I've got a 5103 and several implements and it works great. I also picked up a very used but working skid steer for the smaller tasks. I think that a tractor with ~50HP puts you in a good range. For mowing etc. HST is nice but definitely not required. A good 6 - 7 ft shedder (rotory cut mower) will keep the pasture maintained. I will be keeping my 6 horses on the property and plan on dividing mine up into 2 10ac pastures and the rest in hay. I also "might" have one or two head of cattle for the freezer but I don't want to over extend my grazing.

Good luck.

 

[MarkV]

Dude, you're awesome. I have no interest in hay or livestock, but still enjoyed the thought and time you put into this response.:thumbsup:

+1 :thumbsup::thumbsup:

MarkV

 

[MarkV]

Bzd, this has been an interesting thread, welcome to the forum. If this has been mentioned I'm sorry. I would contact your local county extension agent. This is what they do and they know your area better than any of us. I also think I would start taking soil tests of your proposed hay fields. It can take several years to get soil to the right PH balance and nutrient levels to grow the good hay and vegetables. Both are too labor intensive to have bad yields.

Good luck and keep us updated.

MarkV

 

[Jerry/MT]

Dude, you're awesome. I have no interest in hay or livestock, but still enjoyed the thought and time you put into this response.:thumbsup:

Thanks for the kind words.