Comparison John Deere 4000 series ?'s

/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #1  

magicheater

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central Wisconsin
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Kubota B7800, B26 TLB
As I understand it the 4120, 4320, 4520 & 4720 have the same frame and the same engine with the only difference being software for the horsepower increases. Engine displacement, hydraulic pump size and 3PT lift are the same for all 4 models. If that is the only difference then that is some pretty expensive software!
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #2  
As I understand it the 4120, 4320, 4520 & 4720 have the same frame and the same engine with the only difference being software for the horsepower increases. Engine displacement, hydraulic pump size and 3PT lift are the same for all 4 models. If that is the only difference then that is some pretty expensive software!

That is very common with tractors of all sizes and brands, heavy trucks and construction equip. also and has been for a long time. Sometimes the only difference is programming, sometimes that and a turbo or different turbo, sometimes those plus larger coolers or intercoolers. Diesel engines are very easy to change the power output in yet keep the engine running smooth. Yet you pay a large amount for the added Hp.

Sometimes the same engine is in 2 different frames with several different power ratings.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #3  
Yep, the programming is different and expensive!!

However, after a review of the Nebraska Test results and some basic detective work.... (look up the parts listing for the different models for the turbo charger and the fuel pump) - it looks like there's some hardward differences to go along with the software differences!

A pump; a blower and some code! There ya go...

AKfish
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #4  
Another difference is the availability of e-PTO on the 4520 and 4720. I'm not sure if the 4120 or 4320 can be retrofitted to have the e-PTO or not; perhaps there are differences in the transmission castings.

Vince
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #5  
Another difference is the availability of e-PTO on the 4520 and 4720. I'm not sure if the 4120 or 4320 can be retrofitted to have the e-PTO or not; perhaps there are differences in the transmission castings.

Vince

Sometimes the term e-pto can be confusing.

As far as I know all of them have the ePTO as in electric PTO.

2009 and newer I believe had the optional economy PTO. I believe it was optional. My 2008 4520 cab does not have the economy PTO.

4120 came standard with Power Reverser but could have the optional e-hyrdro trans.

Cab version were available in the 4320 and bigger.

D.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #6  
You're right Darin, I should be more specific; I was in fact talking about the economy PTO.
Can you add it to your 4520?
Those who have it seem to like it a lot.
Vince
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #7  
I believe economy PTO is only offered on the 4520 and 4720 models. I recently went thru the Deere configurator with the dealer for my new 2010 4320 and don't recall ePTO as an available option. However, the RPM meter is marked with ePTO (believe around 1700 rpm's) even though the tractor does not have the feature.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #8  
You've got to love marketing. There are lots of little things that change in addition to HP. The economy PTO is one of them. On the 4720 the air cushion seat is "standard" instead of optional.

I would guess that the engines have different sizes of some components that are "bolted on" to the main block. I can see differences in turbo sizes, fuel pumps, injectors, and things like that which, in conjunction with software, make the power differences. Don't bother telling me if I've got the details wrong :laughing:! The point here is it seems really unlikely that the engines are exactly the same in all of the lineup, and it is really only a software change.

And of course the cab is only available in the top 3 sizes. Now that (and a lot of these other things) is not all 100% marking driven. The AC on the cab takes power from the engine, so there is some logic to having it available on only the higher HP models. I'm sure the engine differences/changes are also commensurate with the HP.

I think the economy PTO is in the same boat. Offering it only in the higher HP models lets you command a higher price. But it also makes sense that as the PTO HP increases, there will be more times when you might use a lower HP attachment and the E-PTO makes sense. My sickle bar mower is very happy on the E-PTO. I'm not feeding it too much power, tractor runs at lower RPM, uses less fuel. Then, when I have the MX6 rotary cutter on and am in heavy grass, I need the full HP of the machine.

Years ago, I ordered large french fries at a fast food place. Got small. Pointed out the error. The worker dumped the small fries into a large fry container. Talked with manager who apologized and fixed the problem. So even marketing guys are smart enough to have acceptable reasons for all the models and different offerings. It's not much different than some of the car lines that are "good - better - best". Trying to figure out if the pricing and features are "fair", or engage in some silly game of just buying the tractor with the worst margin thinking it's the best value will just eat you up. Manufactures are far better at this game than you or I will ever be. So just look at the features, cost, and get what you need and can afford.

I think you could cut about half of the Deere product out of the lineup and it would still be just great. It seems like having horsepower available in 10% increments as you move through the line is too small of an increment. Can you really tell the difference between a 25 and a 27.5 HP tractor? Or in the 4000 series, between 60 and 66 HP? I'm sure some can, but bet most can't.

Marketing types are like the people who kind/stupid enough to introduce themselves and say they are "basically honest". You know there is something not quite right going on, but there is just enough of a good reason behind what they say that you can't call them on it.

At any rate, I doubt the only difference in the 4000 series is the small fry bag was dumped into the large fry container. People are stupid, but not that stupid, and we're talkin' tractor owners here who are clearly a cut above the grade, yes :D?

Pete
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s
  • Thread Starter
#9  
Thanx to all for adding the "beyond appearances" info. Just another reason TBN is a great site, the collective intelligence coupled with experience rivals Google at times!
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #10  
Magiccheater,
Don't know much about the technical differences betweenthe 4000 series but can tell you that their is a very apparent difference between a 43hp and a 60hp unit. While both may be capable of moving the same loads the lower hp tractor feels like you left the parking brake on.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #11  
There you go. The 43 to 60 HP is a 40% increase, and you can clearly feel it. I've not used a 4720, but would imagine that it would be much harder to feel a 10% increase. Probably harder still for me to tell :eek:. That size of a jump (from the 4320 to 4520) is atypical for the Deere lineup.

If I remember correctly, jenkinsph had used a 4720 prior to purchasing his 4520.

Reference my earlier post, it's amazing how often the french fry incident has clarified my thinking on all sorts of things... :)

Pete
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #12  
There you go. The 43 to 60 HP is a 40% increase, and you can clearly feel it. I've not used a 4720, but would imagine that it would be much harder to feel a 10% increase. Probably harder still for me to tell :eek:. That size of a jump (from the 4320 to 4520) is atypical for the Deere lineup.

If I remember correctly, jenkinsph had used a 4720 prior to purchasing his 4520.

Reference my earlier post, it's amazing how often the french fry incident has clarified my thinking on all sorts of things... :)

Pete

I had a 4720 open station and replaced it with a 2008 4520 cab.

I can't tell any difference in the power. I decided to save the $3K or so delta.

With that being said - I didn't know the air ride seat was standard on the 4720. If i had know that - I would have bought a 4720 cab. Oh well - the 4520 is a fine tractor. I am going to go row up 130 rounds bales with it now.

D.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #13  
When I got my 4520 I got the air ride seat for $600 more. I couldn't see the extra delta $2.2K or so for the 6 more HP. I'm really glad I got the seat :).

ddivinia, tnx for feedback on can't tell power difference. I am always amazed to hear what you are doing with your machine. All the hay fields here are uncut since it's been raining every few days since mid May.

Pete
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #14  
When I got my 4520 I got the air ride seat for $600 more. I couldn't see the extra delta $2.2K or so for the 6 more HP. I'm really glad I got the seat :).

ddivinia, tnx for feedback on can't tell power difference. I am always amazed to hear what you are doing with your machine. All the hay fields here are uncut since it's been raining every few days since mid May.

Pete

The air ride seat is a must.

I really like this 4520 tractor.

I plan on baling some square bales with it.

D.
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #15  
And for those who wonder: My step-son is a mech at a deere dealer, I asked about adding a E(conomy)pto to my existing 4520. He did the research, the math and said the cheap solution would be sell existing and buy new. Ouch!
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #16  
Thanks Cidertom.
If you get a chance, would you ask your step-son about retrofitting a mid-PTO to a 4520?
I ordered without and doubt that I'll ever want one, but am curious to know, just in case some whiz-bang new attachment comes along that I 'need.'

Vince
 
/ John Deere 4000 series ?'s #17  
Thanks Cidertom.
If you get a chance, would you ask your step-son about retrofitting a mid-PTO to a 4520?
I ordered without and doubt that I'll ever want one, but am curious to know, just in case some whiz-bang new attachment comes along that I 'need.'

Vince

i always thought it would be cool to have a rotary brush on the front of my 4520 to clean off the driveway, etc. The mid mount PTO kit is pretty expensive.

D.
 
 
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