Cold weather starting and running help please!

[Mark_G]

This is my first Fall and winter as a tractor owner, and today was the first time I ever had trouble starting my CK30. It was 35 f or so out, and I let the glow plug light turn off before I started to crank. Lots of white smoke but it wouldn't catch. After several attempts it started to try to catch for a bit and then it finally fired up.

I have a few questions:
- How long should I let it crank if it doesn't catch? Should I try for some length of time (say 10 seconds etc) then let it rest a few seconds and try again? I don't want to over tax the starter etc....
- What can I do to help it start? Any particularly good block heaters etc? I'm sure it will be much colder here in the future.
- How long should it idol when it does fire to warm up? Just the standard 5 minutes?
- should I increase the engine RPM to help it warm up or keep it at low idol?
- Is it OK to drive it if the temp gauge doesn't show a temperature reading after the 5 min warm up time, if there is little or no additional load?
- how warm does it need to be to plow, as its only a matter of time....

Thanks all!

Mark

 

[JoelD]

In theory, at 35 F, you should not need more than one glowlug cycle to get her to fire up.

My LK3054XS will fire, in that temp after 1 to 1.5 minutes application of glow plugs.

With that said, when starting my dozer, in below freezing weather, and she has no glow plugs, I'll crank for 5 to 10 seconds and stop, crank for 5 to 10 seconds and stop and do this as I warm the cyls. and after 5 to 10 tries, she'll fire, blow out some white smoke, clear and run smooth. I see no need to crank the weee out of the starter. And I never, never, never use starter fluid on my diesel machines.

I am installing a water heater in my lower radiator hose, I've been told plug her in an hour or two prior to start and she'll start like it's summer. I also like the idea of warm fluids rather than cold fluids at start up.

Hopefully some folks with your machine will chime in.

On my little Kubota, I used to use almost full throttle at cold start, not sure how much throttle you used?

On my Kioti, I use low throtle when starting in any temp, same on the dozer.

I use the 5 minute warm up rule, typically to get my hydraulic fluid warmed up.

Sorry I could not be of more help.

 

[jimb1724]

Mark

most importantly, make sure you have some anti-gel additive mixed in your fuel. even if your gas station has the winter mix, i still add a fairly strong shot of additive to the fuel. the additive also helps with horsepower and lubrication. i had a big problem during my first winter with the tractor.... i didn't use the additivie and the fuel gelled in the tank, filter and lines... of course it been several days of temps at near zero and below. live and learn...

my machine is kept in an unheated garage, so in winter i usually cycle the glow plugs two times and then engage the starter. when it catches, i hold the key a little to keep the glow plug light on for a few more seconds until the engine starts to smooth out..... it will take a little practice, but you will work out a plan that works for your machine.... good luck.

 

[JoelD]

I did the same on my Kubota, as soon as she caught, I'd flip the glow plugs back on. Made a huge difference. I had forgotten about that.

Good point on the additive, I did not add last year and never had a problem, but I will to be sure I'm safe.

Joel

 

[Gittyup]

I start mine by giving it just a little throttle (getting pretty good at knowing where 1500 rpms is on the throttle arm), and wait on the glow plug light to go out. Usually starts right up on first try. I wouldn't grind too much on the starter (5 - 10 seconds at most). Cycling the glow plugs twice is a good idea if you are having trouble with the one-cycle approach.

When it's real cold (below 40), I always let mine warm up, initially at 1500 rpms, until the temperature gauge gets close to center before putting a load on her. This can take up to 10 minutes or more if it's really cold. About half way through this time I'll start exercising the loader (no load) to help get the hydraulic fluid warming faster. In warmer weather, I may drive it after only about a minute or so, but I still wait before putting a load on her.

I also keep mine on a battery tender all winter. I find this helps extend battery life by a couple of years and you are assured that the battery is ready when you are.

I haven't used the antigel agents yet. Probably gonna burn me one of these days. I do, however, keep the tank full to reduce the chances of condensation in the tank, and I buy from a place that sells lots of diesel so it's always fresh.

 

[Patches]

My 3054xs has been a "hard cold start" from the get go. The lower hose heater is, essentially, a must. That being said, between the heater, a little throttle, and glow plugs, I can get it started without the old shake and misfire. I also flip the plugs back on after it fires and hold them for a couple seconds;really makes a difference

 

[IXLR8]

My CK30 either starts instantly... or no amount of cranking is going to start it. I cycle the glow plugs once, crank for 5 seconds, if not running... repeat. Throttle is typically set to idle for starting at all times. Even down to 0dF, I have not had to do this more than 3 times. Below 0dF... I am not going out to try to start it!!

 

[novi408]

Mark

my machine is kept in an unheated garage, so in winter i usually cycle the glow plugs two times and then engage the starter. when it catches, i hold the key a little to keep the glow plug light on for a few more seconds until the engine starts to smooth out..... it will take a little practice, but you will work out a plan that works for your machine.... good luck.

I did the exact same thing on my CK20S last night. It seemed to work pretty well. Puffed some white smoke, rattled for a few seconds and then smoothed out. Temp was probably around 30F, maybe a little less.

 

[Mark_G]

Thanks all for the advise. How do you keep the glow plugs on? On my CK30 the plugs light illuminates at the key position just before ignition. I don't see how to keep the glow plugs heated while its starting/running.

Thanks,

Mark

 

[JoelD]

Just after engaging the starter can you flip back to glowplug?

Would not think that would cut your fuel flow.

Joel

 

[Patches]

The pre-heat position is different on the 3054's. Their preheat is a left turn from the "off" position and the CK"s is a right, just before "start".I would think you would have to be very careful not to engage the starter when attempting this on a 30;maybe if you turned the key back just enough to de-energize the starter, as opposed to releasing the key completely

 

[Lloyd_E]

This is what I woke up to this morning... (25f degrees) a n'easter rolled by last night and dumped about 10-12".

I filled tractor and attached blower yesterday to be ready...
Cycled glow plugs twice, set revs to 1500 to warm up - started up no problem!!!!

Did the main lane, driveway - both mine and neighbours - in just under three hours.

Learned a lot and had a lot of fun.

Lloyd

 

[Steve_Miller]

Come'on Lloyd we need some action shots.
I went out about six this morning and it was ice pellets, then turn briefly to fine drizzle then back to snow. When I went out we had 12-14", by time I went in (about two hours) it had settled down to about 10". Wet, heavy and sticky at the bottom, the worst conditions to get, wet, heavy, sticky and to cap it all off the ground is still not froze so I will have some sods to place when it melts. I plowed it all with the blade and the wing and didn't have to blow any rocks. Sorry, camera packed it in about a month ago and a new one is on the Christmas list. Did you guys get all snow?

Steve

 

[Lloyd_E]

Steve...

Ya, the whole time I thought the 'wife should be taking action shots.. plus I was too warm to venture out side... the cab!

The lower 3-4" was wet with the top being fluffy... Set the rpm around 2000 and went through it all. I adjusted the blower angle - initial passes still left about 2 inch base of snow with blower set at its lowest on 3pt hitch.

We got all snow and lost power for about 6 hours - during a blue sky sunny break.
Fired up the generator and later feed the NSP guys pizza - we run a propane range!
It was their first meal after 6 hours....

Secondary road is still not open - chip seal, as off 9:30 tonight.

Sleep well..

It will warm up this week to create a mess!

PS: American/Canadian Farmers Almanac is bang on...December will be like the last two days... only weekly!!!!!!

 

[Egon]

Morning Lloyd. Nice pictures.

We awoke to the same conditions but my tractor is much smaller and was buried deeper. No power outages. Got the driveway cleared and went around the corner to clean off the ridge left by the Town snow plow for a fellow I know.

Ended up home a few hours later with the offer of my choice of a bottle Scotch or Rum, a fresh cup of coffee and the wherewithal for some of Czechoslovakia's malted produce. [Prokop take note!]

Now for next weeks rain event!

 

[Lloyd_E]

Egon,

The power outage was due to an old transformer that finally kicked the bucket. It kicked out this morning too. NSpower showed up mid-afternoon and replaced the transformer. They actually put a new one on a different pole that is much more convenient to get at. The old unit was tucked behind our house and difficult to get at...would mean removing some trees and ruining the lawn. I have no idea why they placed it there in the first place.

So life is back to normal and we await the rains and warm weather to arrive this week... can you say 'spring' again!

 

[4shorts]

Hey Lloyd. Great photo's. I bet you enjoyed the new tractor in that stuff. Did the blower work well in it? We haven't had any snow over on this end of the rock yet. Yesterday we were out putting up our Christmas lights and it was plus 11 degrees. Hope we see some snow soon so I can get out and play in it as well. Stay well over there. Paul

 

[Lloyd_E]

4shorts,

Worked like a charm. I did the lane - 1200' - two passes to clear plus another two to widen to about 14'; did two neighbours driveways as well - all under 3 hours. I also did a road through the pasture and around the perimeter of fence to access manure pile.

As previously mentioned - set the rpm to around 2000 - went through heavy wet snow as well as dry fluffy stuff no problem.

One thing I do recommend - thanks TBN - is to clean after each use. This helps prevents ice forming on unit.

It was -10c this morning and it started up no problem. The cab did get warm - enough to remove a few layers.

It will warm up to +10c by end of week plus rain mid week - going to be a real mess.

Be patient you will get your snow soon...

take care..

lloyd

 

[Lloyd_E]

Mark_G,

How did you make out? Is the tractor warming up for ya?
I may try the cardboard trick in front of the radiator.

Also, sorry for stealing the thread...


Lloyd

 

[mrutkaus]

Last year same thing, CK30 hard to start in the 20's and 30's F.

Added some white Power Service additive and it solved the problem almost immediately.

Mike