WiFi to underground pump house

[lhfarm]

I've searched on extending WiFi, but not sure I've found a solution (end-to-end) for my situation. My underground pump house is located downhill and in the woods from the house and detached garage. The garage is slightly further away, but would be easier to mount an external antenna, if required. The cable modem and wireless router in the house is located in the basement media closet. The garage (about 100' from the house) has an access point installed. The signal from both the router and the AP are very limited out in the yard.

In the small block pump house (4'x4' or so) is my booster pump, my driveway alert control box and a number of X-10 devices that I use to control those two items. I have other X-10 devices controlling the heat lamps. I've never measured the line of sight distance between the house or garage, but assume 200' or so. My goal is to eventually place a special purpose computer there to handle some of the automation (playing with a Raspberry Pi at the moment). I've done a quick test with a set of power line Ethernet adapters, but didn't get a connection, most likely do to interference (although X-10 does work there).

So I'd like to extend the WiFi signal to the pump house. It is probably another 500' from the pump house to the end of our drive. Not interested in having the neighbors picking up the signal. The access point in the garage has external antennas (it is an older Linksys model). I don't want to build my own antenna, but assume that I might find something simple and inexpensive. I'd like to limit what I need in the pump house to the small computer with a USB WiFi adapter.

Any advice on specific pieces of equipment to use or alternative suggestions for what I'm trying to accomplish appreciated.

Thanks,

 

[Jimbrown]

You need one or a couple of these.

Ubiquiti Networks - NanoStation

 

[hutchman]

If you have neighbors chances are their 2.4GHz activity will step on yours since there are only 3 non-overlapping channels in that band so it makes it difficult to do directional long distance stuff.

Your best bet is going to the 802.11a band (5GHz). It has 11 unique channels so you can find one nobody is on. I almost never see anything in that band around me ... I have links that go over 1/4 mile.

If you go to a site like L-Com (they bought out Hyperlink-tek) you can find all manner of directional antennas from panel to parabolic and the pigtails to go from your radio to LMR 400 cable with N connectors.

Since you mentioned Linksys, you could check out OpenWRT's compatible hardware page and see if it will run on your current boxes.

I have Raspberry Pi and all the beagleboards/bones etc. There is software you can use on them but you would have to find a USB WiFi device that has external antenna connectors on it and they are super tiny and very fragile. The connectors don't hold up to too many insertions etc.

I think the 1/4 mile link I mentioned cost $500 in material.

 

[hutchman]

... Oh, and you need to research WDS mode since it sounds like you will have several hoops vs just one point to point link.

Example:

Atheros and MAC80211 WDS to implement a wireless network bridge [OpenWrt Wiki]

With Ubiquiti gear:

https://www.gowifi.co.nz/userguides/ubiquiti-wds-bridge-setup.pdf

 

[aczlan]

... Oh, and you need to research WDS mode since it sounds like you will have several hoops vs just one point to point link.
Example:
Atheros and MAC80211 WDS to implement a wireless network bridge [OpenWrt Wiki]

Or just buy a Ubiquity Nanostation Loco M2 ($52 each on Amazon) and mount one in the pumphouse to pickup the signal from the garage. If needed, mount another in the house or garage to send a signal to the pumphouse.
We have a pair of them in a 600ish foot link and they have been very reliable for the last 3 years.

Aaron Z

 

[TravisD]

Have you considered powerline networking? Since the X10 presumably works, you should be able to run a powerline network.

 

[hutchman]

Have you considered powerline networking? Since the X10 presumably works, you should be able to run a powerline network.

OP said:

"I've done a quick test with a set of power line Ethernet adapters, but didn't get a connection, most likely do to interference (although X-10 does work there)."

 

[joecoin]

Ubiquiti will set you free!

 

[buckeyefarmer]

what x10 device do you use for the heat lamp? I need something like that for my Dad.

Ubiquiti looks nice. I've had good success with power line adapters to remote barns.

 

[zzvyb6]

I ran a 500' Ethernet cable from my U-Verse AP out to a $5 garage sale Netgear WRN-1000 router sitting on a fence post near an electric plug for the water tank heater. Bought the spool of cable on eBay, with connectors. I have plenty of N speed bandwidth for cameras and entertainment out at the barn Smart TV and Chromecast. SSID is "Michigan State Police". Secured WPA AES encrypted. I don't care who sees it.

I liked it so much I got another 1 (also $5) and run it in the house instead of the 2Wire460 wireless G radio. This setup eliminates all the ping pong you get from repeaters.

 

[RobA]

Ubiquiti will set you free!

I'm curious... tried to google it and see what they do but got a bit confused. What do they provide?

 

[Pixguy]

I'm curious... tried to google it and see what they do but got a bit confused. What do they provide?

Or just buy a Ubiquity Nanostation Loco M2 ($52 each on Amazon) and mount one in the pumphouse to pickup the signal from the garage. If needed, mount another in the house or garage to send a signal to the pumphouse. We have a pair of them in a 600ish foot link and they have been very reliable for the last 3 years. Aaron Z

Click on Aaron's Amazon link and it'll bring you to Amazons site and it will explain it better. Read the reviews as well.

 

[lhfarm]

what x10 device do you use for the heat lamp? I need something like that for my Dad.

Ubiquiti looks nice. I've had good success with power line adapters to remote barns.

I'm using this Minotaur Engineering VT1 X10 Variable Temperature Sensor with a Powerflash and an appliance module. Sort of bulky but it works. I mounted 3 outlet boxes on a board with a plug. Attached that to the pump house wall. The heat lamps (I have two) are plugged into the appliance module. I use HomeSeer automation software and I get an email when the lamps turn on/off. Not necessary, but I like to know what is going on. I installed this last year and it worked well in one of the coldest winters we have had around here.

The Minotaur device doesn't report the actual temperature. That is one of the reasons I'm wanting to get Ethernet to the pump house. I'm going ad a temperature reporting device. I'm using power line adapters to my barn, which is 450' from the garage. I tried the pair that work great in the barn in the pump house and didn't get a signal. Could be a number of things, but I thought I'd post here for other ideas, which I' getting.

 

[aczlan]

I'm using power line adapters to my barn, which is 450' from the garage. I tried the pair that work great in the barn in the pump house and didn't get a signal. Could be a number of things, but I thought I'd post here for other ideas, which I' getting.

Were you on the same leg in the barn as in the pumphouse? IIRC, the X10 signal needs to be on the same phase to work well and I imagine that powerline networking would need to be as well.
Is the wellhouse power fed from the house or the garage? You might try adding an outlet right next to the panel that feeds the wellhouse and plug one end in there.

Aaron Z

 

[lhfarm]

Were you on the same leg in the barn as in the pumphouse? IIRC, the X10 signal needs to be on the same phase to work well and I imagine that powerline networking would need to be as well.
Is the wellhouse power fed from the house or the garage? You might try adding an outlet right next to the panel that feeds the wellhouse and plug one end in there.

Aaron Z

Meter is at the barn. There are 200 amp panels in the house, garage and barn. The pump house is on a house circuit. I have a phase coupler for the X-10 on that panel and I control devices in the garage and the barn. I had to find the "right" outlet in the garage for the power line adapter to work to the barn. When I tested to the pump house, I plugged the first unit into an outlet right off the panel. There is a shut off for this circuit about half way to the pump house next to a small pond. I got a signal at that outlet. I just tried one outlet in the pump house. It was down stream from a couple of power supplies and that might have been the problem.

I have, of course, waited until cold weather to start messing with this. It is a pain to lift the roof off the pump house, and I don't like to keep it open long in the cold. But I'm having fun thinking/learning and making a list for Santa to bring.

 

[lhfarm]

I ran a 500' Ethernet cable from my U-Verse AP out to a $5 garage sale Netgear WRN-1000 router sitting on a fence post near an electric plug for the water tank heater. Bought the spool of cable on eBay, with connectors. I have plenty of N speed bandwidth for cameras and entertainment out at the barn Smart TV and Chromecast. SSID is "Michigan State Police". Secured WPA AES encrypted. I don't care who sees it.

I liked it so much I got another 1 (also $5) and run it in the house instead of the 2Wire460 wireless G radio. This setup eliminates all the ping pong you get from repeaters.

That is amazing. I ran Cat5e the 450' to the barn, but couldn't get Ethernet coming out of a powered switch in the garage. I suspect I could get it to work, but for now, the power line adapters are working fine for my needs there. But glad to hear of your success at 500'!

 

[aczlan]

One note, the limit for ethernet is ~330 feet. You might get a little more in ideal circumstances but its pushing it.

Aaron Z

 

[HeLa]

Or just buy a Ubiquity Nanostation Loco M2 ($52 each on Amazon) and mount one in the pumphouse to pickup the signal from the garage. If needed, mount another in the house or garage to send a signal to the pumphouse.
We have a pair of them in a 600ish foot link and they have been very reliable for the last 3 years.

Aaron Z

these are the way to go! we installed a set of similar products from amped wireless years back, before knowing of ubiquiti, to provide internet access between two houses at my in-laws'. these are the same idea, considerably less expensive, and well-rated by users.

 

[techman]

You can get some extra distance by using shielded CAT6e cable. You should hit 500'

paul

 

[boggen]

power line adapters, i never had much luck with the stuff. to much interference within the power lines themselves. to make it worth while. and any time some sort of motor (vacuum cleaner, saw, drill, etc...) was plugged into 110v and ran. power line adapters would completely disconnect. kinda wondering as soon as pump for well kicks on if you loose power line adapters. and then comes back after pump shuts off.

WIFI = still needing a direct line of sight. over long distances. some folks have used a metal soup can, and *forget what else* for a DIY external antenna for a router / access point / bridge. soup can at each location, more focus the single directly at each other. but if anything gets in between the 2 soup cans, ya loose internet access. if a wind or like bumps them ya loose internet access. the single / channel / SSID ran between the two over longer distance, is not really use able for anything, a cell phone or like might see the SSID for the wifi. but does not have a powerful enough antenna to make it back. and in that neighbors might see your wifi with a long distance point to point antennas. but not able to connect.

============
my suggestion is to drop a cat5 or cat5e or cat6 hard wire cable down into the ground. little more costly and time consuming to put in, but distances you are asking to run between everything and to get internet access were you want it... stay away from local stores, and get wholesaler for pricing internet cat5 cable out. you can pickup 50, 100, 200, 250, 300, 500, 1000, plus foot rolls fairly cheap. the ends are only a few bucks for a dozen or so. the tool for crimping the ends on, a cheapie works.

============
other words to above. if you are able to take your cell phone / tablet / laptop out to the well pit, and get access from current wifi, you should be able to just pick up a "repeater / bridge" or most new routers in the 25 bucks or higher range has "access point, bridge, repeater" option. and just plug it into an outlet in the pump pit and extend your wifi no problems. how ever if a cell phone / tablet / laptop is not able to get wifi access from router in shed or house.... ya either looking at a better "point to point" setup "can get rather costly and needs direct line of site for wifi over long distances" or needing to put in a hard wire cat5 or like for internet access at the well pit.

==========
i prefer a hard wire cat 5 cable between all my routers. to much interference wifi, i picked up 500 foot roll, that let me do a double run between house and shed A, and between shed A and Shed B. so if one cable goes down, i have a second hopefully working cable there. the extra i had left, i made some extra runs in house between the 2 routers there, and some shorter cables, to have on hand for some network printers that do not have wifi built into them. i also used same cat5 cable to install some additional hard line telephone outlets. granted telephone cable itself being 2 or 4 wires is cheaper. but had some extra left over and just went with it.

the bigger issue, is when i have had to do a "hard reset" on a router, loosing passwords / settings of the router. ya most routers / access points you can set it up so you access there admin features over wifi, but that is after you initially connected it to a computer via a cat5 cable. hard wire to each router... lets me do a hard reset, and within a couple minutes re-configure it back to were it was. without dragging cables out, etc...