What a Joke

[Diamondpilot]

Did not know that. I don't think I ever saw where it was assembled when I had that 2500 Hemi I traded for my F-250 PSD.

Chris

 

[KAB]

I have a new 2007 Tundra Double Can version. It is rated to pull 10,300 and that is the trailer only not including the truck weight. I pull a 30 foot goose neck trailer that is 6000 lbs empty, my trailer gross weight is actually in the 11,000 plus category. I traded in a 2004 F250 crew cab with the 5.4 gas. This Toyota will run circles around the F250. I am talking gas engines here. If my Ford would have had the diesel I probably would have kept it.

Don't say too much bad about the Tundra until you have owned one. I feel there is absolutely no comparison to any other half ton and I have had Ford's and Chevy's in the past. I look at the Tundra as being somewhere between a half and a three quarter ton. It only needs heavier tires and a little more spring. The brakes, rear end, transmission and engine are there now.

If you are towing that much weight on a regular basis please let us know after 30,000 to 50,000 miles how it is doing.

The frame is no where near any 3/4 ton and from the hands on comparisons that I have done it is not all that impressive.

Yes, it has a large ring gear but still uses a semi-floating rear axle instead of a full floating rear axle.

The transmission has not proven itself over time (inc. heavy use). It has proven to have problems duing the initial release (supposedly fixed).

Yes, performance is rather impressive, but at a cost of fuel economy. (There have been cam issues, but claimed to now be fixed). They had an opportunity to get some incredible fuel economy ratings but came up short even when equipped with a 6 speed tranny. (GM does better with 4sp.) Using a high axle ratio (4.33 or 4.51 not in the mood to look it up right now) gives great acceleration but kills fuel economy.

Comparing the Toy 5.7 to a Ford 5.4 is a bad comparison. Yes, Ford should have kept a 351 then we could have a real comparison. At the same time I would not compare the Ford V10 to the Toy V8.

Also, please be careful with the tailgate. It has got to be the lightest tailgate that I have ever seen. Who in their right mind would put an almost full width access panel across the inside. It effectively removes all strenght from the top (back) edge of the gate when it is in the down position. If you don't have a bed liner have somebody walk across the gate (200# person) and watch it flex.

If you are like the average person who buys a 1/2 ton truck as a daily driver and tows a few times a year then this post will not apply to you. You bought a decent truck, are sending profits to Japan, and contributing to reason that US companies are laying people off.

If you do use it as a truck to tow that much weight, I wish you the best of luck, but please let the rest of us know when and where you are towing so we can stay away from that area. (That applies to anybody using a 1/2 ton to tow that much weight.)

Kurt

 

[Z-Michigan]

BTWodge 3/4 & 1 tons are assembled in Mexico and have been since about 2000 give or take a year.

Builder beat me to it. Accurate and unfortunate. Nonetheless we are quite happy with our Ram 2500/Cummins.

 

[whitetiger]

YouTube - Ford F150 vs Toyota Tundra - Frame Strength
This video kind of tells the story of the wanna-be toy pickup frame.
I only know 2 guys that bought into the toy truck BS, one says his 07 is a nice car but it's no truck & the other is very happy since he traded his 07 toy back in and now has a 08 F150.

 

[Kahuna]

The Tundra is 75% to 80% American parts with all the major components coming from the US. Most of the electrical is from Japan. Sure, some of the profits may go overseas but that is with every make. Believe it or not, we are in a global economy.

There are more American parts in Toyota than in any Chrysler product. I had my hands on a chart here about a month ago that listed the top 10 vehicles sold in the US that had the most domestic parts. The list was model specific as some vehicles have more American parts while some have more foreign parts. The Ford F150 was number one for having the most American parts with 80 some percent. The Chevy trucks were also in the 10 top ten. The Tundra was number 10. This list included cars too. Of the top 10 vehicles (cars and trucks) sold in the US that use the most US parts, Toyota had the top three spots (it was the Tundra and two car models). There was not one Chrysler on the list.

It is correct that I would not pull those type heavy loads on an everyday basis, I think one would be a fool to think a gas engine would hold up over time, unless possibly it was the V10. I was tired of the 5.4 gas F250 not having any pulling power, as a matter of fact it seemed like it would barely pull itself and I was getting a consistent 11-12 mpg. The day I went truck shopping to trade it off I was looking for a late model F250 diesel. I just happened to drive by a Toyota dealer and took a test drive, that was all it took. I know I was only an occasional heavy trailer puller so I was more concerned about everyday performance rather than regular heavy pulling power. If I pulled all the time I would have opted for the diesel.

As far as economy, none of them are worth a darn for all the technology in the drive train. First of all a 4x4 is going to get a mile or two less than a 2 wheel drive so I have that going against me. However, I was getting 11-12 mpg with the 5.4 Ford (F250) and Tundra is in the 15-17 mpg range with a lot more snap. People with the 4x4 F150 and Silverado around here are pretty consistent in the 15 mpg range as well. The 2 wheel drive Silverado can sometimes get 17-18 according to my son who bought a new one.

I am not looking to get in an argument with anyone because I know how some people can get emotional about their trucks. I have always been a big fan of the Ford and GM products and never considered a foreign made vehicle. But that's just it, they are no longer a foreign made vehicle. To me this Tundra seems as American as any full size truck only with a different logo.

 

[Builder]

I am not looking to get in an argument with anyone because I know how some people can get emotional about their trucks. I have always been a big fan of the Ford and GM products and never considered a foreign made vehicle. But that's just it, they are no longer a foreign made vehicle. To me this Tundra seems as American as any full size truck only with a different logo.

It seems like you made the right decision for you and that's what counts. The only place I think you're going wrong is that profits leave the USA and go overseas when you buy foreign. If you buy an American truck, the profits stay here and help the American companies get stronger.

The US gov't has a different corp income tax structure for GM & Ford than it does for companies that build here, but have their headquarters overseas. Those companies pay lower corp taxes and IMO, have an unfair advantage. That's a big problem I have with the US gov't, not Toyota or Nissan, etc.. The US car companies have to import cheaper parts to stay competitive since they're operating on lower profit margins. Take a look at the primaries in MI today. Look what they're discussing...the future of Detroit & Flint MI as the remaining epicenter of US auto business. It's walking up the hangman's ladder to the gallows right now. Do we want to save it? Our votes count.

I can no longer have a problem with buying foreign. I have no choice. Unfortunately, my house is filled with foreign electronics, toys for my kids, appliances, tools, etc.

 

[Kahuna]

Your point is well taken.

 

[Builder]

Your point is well taken.

Thanks. I'm not trying to lay guilt on you, but I really think a lot of Americans just don't realize the playing field isn't level and US gov't over-regulation, unfair US corp tax structures, and huge "legacy costs" from the UAW make it tough for American car companies to compete.

You gotta vote if you want that to change.

 

[Bird]

Folks, let's please remember that politics is a prohibited topic on Tractorbynet.

 

[Patches]

The Toyota is NOT rated to pull a 10,000 lb trailer, its a 10,000 lb combination. Since the truck weighs 6000 lbs itself when loaded with fuel and passengers, you can only haul a 4000 lb trailer with a Tundra.

GM rates its towing differently. No industry standard. Some manufacturers give max TRAILER weight with the truck at empty gas tank and just driver load.

The Tundra does not have enough brakes to stop ITSELF very well, much less with a trailer. Something your RECALL notices should have pointed out.

The trailer in those fancy ads was aluminum and EMPTY.

The truck is rated to tow 10,300lbs;The GCWR(gross combined weight rating)meaning truck-trailer-and trailer load is 16,000lbs as per the Toyota manual. I am totally impressed with this ONE HALF TON's towing ability.I don't need a 3/4 or 1 ton, with the accompanying harsh ride, for my towing purposes.I never tow anything over 8500/9000 and it does that very well, thank you

 

[wushaw]

The truck is rated to tow 10,300lbs;The GCWR(gross combined weight rating)meaning truck-trailer-and trailer load is 16,000lbs as per the Toyota manual. I am totally impressed with this ONE HALF TON's towing ability.I don't need a 3/4 or 1 ton, with the accompanying harsh ride, for my towing purposes.I never tow anything over 8500/9000 and it does that very well, thank you

This is the whole reason most want a half ton...comfort with the ability to tow a little something on occassion.

 

[hench861]

I have driven every 1/2 ton except the new Toyota while towing and not. I have driven a 2005 1/2 ton Toyota. I have also owned a 3/4 ton Hemi Dodge, 3500 Duramax, and 3 F-250/F-350 Powerstrokes, and by far the best towing GAS truck of them all was the Nissan Titan. I was amazed at how it out performed my F-150 and I am a die hard Ford guy. One thing that was weird was the way they had the drive train set up. The only rear end gears they offered were a 2.94 and a 3.35. The 2.94 was equal to a 3.73 in other trucks and the 3.35 was equal to a 4.10.

Last May I was in the market for a new 1/2 ton truck for the wife. Wanted 4 doors, leather, sat radio, 4 wheel drive, sun roof, you get the picture. She drove them all from GM, Ford, Nissan, Toyota, and Dodge. She narrowed it down to Ford, Nissan, and Toyota. I did the dealing and the Ford dealer won by a good margin. Nissan and Toyota was way proud of the offerings they had. I can't wait for them to get into the Diesel market.

Chris

toyota is in the dealings with cat i heard this from a dealer in batavia ny

 

[Builder]

toyota is in the dealings with cat i heard this from a dealer in batavia ny

Every stupid kid that sells trucks likes to fantasize that the truck brand he sells with have a "Cat diesel" in it.

My bet is on Hino, since Toyota owns Hino and they make a great diesel already.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

The last I heard Toyota had pushed back their plans for a diesel and that Cat was out of the question. As builder said, Hino is the most likely option but the rumors of a Cat diesel is always going to be there even if it is only a dream.

I do know this, in the US which truck will sell better. A Toyota with a Cat diesel or a Toyota with a Hino diesel

 

[froggy]

Was listening to "Wheels with Ed Wallace" on KLIF this morning and he indicated that Toyota was going to put a diesel in the new model of the Toyota Sequoia once it comes in the Spring.

 

[schmism]

What i dont get is the hangup on what its called.

we are to compare trucks with a "1/2 ton" designation? what about a .5T f150 from 1980 to a f150 from 2008. .5T is .5T but the specs (allowable towing, tare) etc varry widely even within the same manufactures veichial over time.

So if thats the case, who's to say a 2008 Tundra is a .5T truck? shure its got that label on it, but then again, what does that mean?

start comparing brake sizes, wheel base size, curb weights, HP/Torque #'s and then see were it falls into the pack.

frames are an intresting discussion. you could make one that is super stiff, you'd feel every tinny bump in the road. and youd likely suffer signifcant injuries when you crash it. one thats a bit more flexible is likely to ride smother, and give more in an accident.

personally i need a full size to tow with this year. i wont buy a new (anything).... but in a few years, youll see me sporting a couple year old tundra with a diesel in it.

 

[powerstroke444e]

lets hook one to a 600 bu gravity wagon & see how it does

 

[Builder]

frames are an intresting discussion. you could make one that is super stiff, you'd feel every tinny bump in the road. and youd likely suffer signifcant injuries when you crash it. one thats a bit more flexible is likely to ride smother, and give more in an accident.

personally i need a full size to tow with this year. i wont buy a new (anything).... but in a few years, youll see me sporting a couple year old tundra with a diesel in it.

A stiff frame lower ride quality can be compensated for by increasing the length of the leaf springs, use of gas shocks and better quality tires, cab mounts, seats, etc.. Although a flexible frame has a nicer ride, a flexible frame cannot really get compensation for being flimsy. A stiffer frames lesser crashworthiness can be compensated for with front frame sections that are specially built to absorb energy.

Just curious- you say you'll "be sporting a couple year old Tundra with a diesel in it".
Well, what if the Tundra diesel is a major flop, like the T-100 was? What if a GM, Ford or Dodge diesel is building a superior truck? What then?

Is Toyota the "inevitable one" even before it's put one mile on the road in real world use with a diesel under the hood?

 

[jcmseven]

To me, I am not sure what difference it makes if Toyota says it can tow a 10,000 pound trailer. All the current half ton makers are looking to enhance sales by luring buyers into thinking they are getting "close to a 3/4 ton" without the necessary comprimises of increased size, weight and perhaps lower fuel economy. Most of those that post on this forum would not consider a Tundra for heavy duty daily towing, but if one were taking the travel trailer to the beach for example or similar duties, a Tundra or most half tons would do fine. Although you might occasionally see 1/2 tons overloaded, these are likely the same people trying to pull 40,000 pounds with a 3/4 ton--they are going to be unsafe no matter what they own. I think Toyota makes an excellent truck. They do offer some older technology mixed with the new, but for a first true foray into this type truck they have done pretty well. They also have bolstered competition between the other brands. I would personally like to see an end to comments spread within the forum about specific brands, i.e., "Built Ford tough, until it breaks." that occasionally pop up. I realize that we like our respective brands and are very loyal to them, but to assess a reputable brand in this way is unfortunate. My Ford is--to some's chagrin--at 20,000 without an implosion. No problems to report as of yet; tows and rides great; doesn't squat pulling up to 11,000 pounds on a receiver hitch. No codes, no blows, no trannie problems either. I keep waiting for the axe to fall; but I am thinking it might not; go figure. In any event, one thing said poster and I do agree upon is the unfortunate exodus of production overseas. It does not sound like it is going to change anytime soon with our current tax structure (this is not a political--merely financial--observation).

John M

 

[Builder]

To me, I am not sure what difference it makes if Toyota says it can tow a 10,000 pound trailer. All the current half ton makers are looking to enhance sales by luring buyers into thinking they are getting "close to a 3/4 ton" without the necessary comprimises of increased size, weight and perhaps lower fuel economy. Most of those that post on this forum would not consider a Tundra for heavy duty daily towing, but if one were taking the travel trailer to the beach for example or similar duties, a Tundra or most half tons would do fine. Although you might occasionally see 1/2 tons overloaded, these are likely the same people trying to pull 40,000 pounds with a 3/4 ton--they are going to be unsafe no matter what they own. I think Toyota makes an excellent truck. They do offer some older technology mixed with the new, but for a first true foray into this type truck they have done pretty well. They also have bolstered competition between the other brands. I would personally like to see an end to comments spread within the forum about specific brands, i.e., "Built Ford tough, until it breaks." that occasionally pop up. I realize that we like our respective brands and are very loyal to them, but to assess a reputable brand in this way is unfortunate. My Ford is--to some's chagrin--at 20,000 without an implosion. No problems to report as of yet; tows and rides great; doesn't squat pulling up to 11,000 pounds on a receiver hitch. No codes, no blows, no trannie problems either. I keep waiting for the axe to fall; but I am thinking it might not; go figure. In any event, one thing said poster and I do agree upon is the unfortunate exodus of production overseas. It does not sound like it is going to change anytime soon with our current tax structure (this is not a political--merely financial--observation).

John M

John,

Just a bit of advice, 20,000 miles isn't really even broken in yet. See what happens after 100K

I've owned over a dozen Fords used in commercial applications-plowing, construction, dumps, etc. Most were good, but they do break at the worst possible times.