Trailer tongue leveling and brake controller questions

[s219]

So I started hauling my Kubota B2920 on a 16' landscape trailer a couple weeks ago, and it's going well. However, I want to fine tune a few things and was hoping folks here could weigh in.

First is the angle of the trailer tongue. I have a drawbar that gives 3/4" rise or 2" drop (from what I can tell, this is the least range I can buy). Right now, it's mounted for 3/4" rise. With both an empty trailer and loaded trailer, the tongue always angles up towards the ball (note: this is with the proper 10% tongue weight per a scale).

I want to try flipping the drawbar to the 2" drop, but my measurements suggest it will be very close to level unloaded, with the chance of angling downward (very slightly) when loaded with tractor.

Based on that, am I better off with a good bit of upward angle as it is now, or a slight amount of downward angle I'd get if I flip the drawbar?

Second, I setup my brake controller (Tekonsha Prodigy) as directed by the instructions, and a setting of 6.0V works great for the empty trailer. This brakes to just before lockup at 25mph. While driving around, the braking works great on this setting when empty -- feels natural, with no additional push or pull imposed on the vehicle itself.

With the tractor loaded, I could tell I needed a higher voltage. I went as high as 8.5V and never got the brakes to lockup at 25mph. However, that setting, and settings down to about 7.5V, are obviously too high while driving. They cause the trailer to over-brake the vehicle and makes the rear end of the vehicle squat. Dialing down to a setting of 7.0V feels about perfect with the tractor loaded -- nice and natural.

Does that seem reasonable? Per the instructions, I was thinking I should be finding the "lockup imminent" voltage with the tractor loaded, and back off from that, but I never got that high since the voltage levels were obviously too strong for normal driving.

Thanks!

 

[dodge man]

Sounds like you have your brake controller setup fine to me. It seems like there was some debate on another thread on weather your trailer should lock up the brakes with a load or not. It seemed like most people, myself included didn't think you should really be able to lock up your brakes on your trailer with a load on it.

As far as the drop of your hitch, unless your hauling a really heavy load, I'm not sure it matter that much. You should be able to find a larger variety of hitch drops, I know I have seen them that are more or less zero drop or rise.

 

[JB4310]

So I started hauling my Kubota B2920 on a 16' landscape trailer a couple weeks ago, and it's going well. However, I want to fine tune a few things and was hoping folks here could weigh in.

First is the angle of the trailer tongue. I have a drawbar that gives 3/4" rise or 2" drop (from what I can tell, this is the least range I can buy). Right now, it's mounted for 3/4" rise. With both an empty trailer and loaded trailer, the tongue always angles up towards the ball (note: this is with the proper 10% tongue weight per a scale).

I want to try flipping the drawbar to the 2" drop, but my measurements suggest it will be very close to level unloaded, with the chance of angling downward (very slightly) when loaded with tractor.

Based on that, am I better off with a good bit of upward angle as it is now, or a slight amount of downward angle I'd get if I flip the drawbar?

Second, I setup my brake controller (Tekonsha Prodigy) as directed by the instructions, and a setting of 6.0V works great for the empty trailer. This brakes to just before lockup at 25mph. While driving around, the braking works great on this setting when empty -- feels natural, with no additional push or pull imposed on the vehicle itself.

With the tractor loaded, I could tell I needed a higher voltage. I went as high as 8.5V and never got the brakes to lockup at 25mph. However, that setting, and settings down to about 7.5V, are obviously too high while driving. They cause the trailer to over-brake the vehicle and makes the rear end of the vehicle squat. Dialing down to a setting of 7.0V feels about perfect with the tractor loaded -- nice and natural.

Does that seem reasonable? Per the instructions, I was thinking I should be finding the "lockup imminent" voltage with the tractor loaded, and back off from that, but I never got that high since the voltage levels were obviously too strong for normal driving.

Thanks!

For the tongue angle, try it flipped, sounds like it would be better if it looks off one way dropping 2 inches might be just right, Loaded or empty should not change the angle much. Otherwise you will have to get a different insert. My 2 trailers have the adjustable couplers, where I can raise or lower the coupler for the perfect level set.

On the brake controller, I fine tune mine on the go, I use less power when empty and increase when loaded. I think that's pretty common practice.

JB

 

[Diamondpilot]

Your controller seems fine. As you noted you need to get your trailer as near to level loaded as possible. 1 or 2 inches is not going to be a big deal if its off a little.

Chris

 

[rasimmo]

as others have said the brakes sound about right to me. I don't want mine locking up with a load either.
For the leveling you may look at an adjustable hitch. I have the B&W tow & stow which works good for me, but there are several options.

 

[Dmace]

Turn the hitch to drop it, I find a trailer pulls straighter when angled slightly down towards the truck than when it's angled up (hitch higher than trailer). Level is the target but not always easy.

As far as braking, you'll always have to adjust the gain going from empty to loaded. I like my brakes setup to just before lockup and if you can't lock them up when stopped and loaded then you dont know how well your brakes are working.

 

[s219]

Thanks for the great feedback guys, I appreciate it!

 

[JB4310]

Both my dumper and my flatbed have this type of adjustable tongue/ coupler.

Easy to set up to get the trailer as level as possible and easy to replace the coupler or swap between ball and pintle.

I wouldn't invest in an expensive 5 ton or up trailer that didn't have this feature.

JB

 

[s219]

I got my drawbar flipped tonight, and the trailer looks real good now. But it was quite a spectacle getting the work done. For whatever reason, I could not get the ball loosened from my original drawbar. In fact, I actually tore my vise off my workbench cranking on it with a long wrench. That threw me backward onto the hood of my wife's car, and sent a chainsaw on a nearby shelf flying in on top of me (thankfully it was in a scabbard). Talk about nuts. After that, I decided to just buy a new drawbar and ball -- I'll fight with the old one another day once I get my vise remounted. The new drawbar dropped me an additional 1/2" compared to the old one, and now things look just about perfect when loaded up.

 

[jejeosborne]

First of all congratulations for choosing a very good aftermarket brake controller. I owned that exact model after first trying the cheaper timer based units. Realize that the maximum gain you are setting will be what is sent to the trailer during an emergency stop. Any reduction for comfort will increase your stopping distance in an emergency event. Look to the right of the letter "C" on your display. If there is a decimal point to the right, your boost is turned on. There are three levels of boost which basically tells the controller what level to start at during a braking event. Try turning that off or lowering the boost value and you should see a big difference. Sounds to me that the boost is on because I kept my controller maxed out when I had a loaded trailer and still made comfortable stops.


Here is a link to the manual describing this setting:
http://www.tekonsha.com/content/downloads/installation/N90885.pdf

Jeff

 

[jejeosborne]

I got my drawbar flipped tonight, and the trailer looks real good now. But it was quite a spectacle getting the work done. For whatever reason, I could not get the ball loosened from my original drawbar. In fact, I actually tore my vise off my workbench cranking on it with a long wrench. That threw me backward onto the hood of my wife's car, and sent a chainsaw on a nearby shelf flying in on top of me (thankfully it was in a scabbard). Talk about nuts. After that, I decided to just buy a new drawbar and ball -- I'll fight with the old one another day once I get my vise remounted. The new drawbar dropped me an additional 1/2" compared to the old one, and now things look just about perfect when loaded up.

Please post a video reinactment for our pleasure. Glad you weren't injured or the car damaged.

Those lockwashers do bite into the nut very well. I have a very large vise and a big ***** wrench and it is still tough.

 

[JB4310]

I got my drawbar flipped tonight, and the trailer looks real good now. But it was quite a spectacle getting the work done. For whatever reason, I could not get the ball loosened from my original drawbar. In fact, I actually tore my vise off my workbench cranking on it with a long wrench. That threw me backward onto the hood of my wife's car, and sent a chainsaw on a nearby shelf flying in on top of me (thankfully it was in a scabbard). Talk about nuts. After that, I decided to just buy a new drawbar and ball -- I'll fight with the old one another day once I get my vise remounted. The new drawbar dropped me an additional 1/2" compared to the old one, and now things look just about perfect when loaded up.

Yup, something about trailer hitch components, when they get stuck they stay frozen. I know a guy that worked all day getting an insert out of the receiver tube. I've had balls I couldn't break free, even with a monster vise and 4 foot wrench. Heat til they're red hot will do it, but that's not good for their metallurgy.

JB

 

[speedy2]

I have no problem changing balls on my hitch, I leave it on the vehicle and with a socket to fit and a breakover handle you have the whole truck to be your vice. Speedy2

 

[Gene :^)]

I bought one of these... http://www.maxbrake.com/

None of the time based or inertia brake controllers compare. Neither do surge brakes. I will never go back.

 

[jwstewar]

I have no problem changing balls on my hitch, I leave it on the vehicle and with a socket to fit and a breakover handle you have the whole truck to be your vice. Speedy2

I second this.This is what I usually do.

I think on both of my vehicles I've got my voltage set at 6.0 on the brake controller (as recommended by prodigy). When towing my utility trailer empty I use no boost. With a load I will go to boost level 1 or 2 depending on the load. With the stock trailer empty I will run it at boost level 1, with load I will go to boost level 2. When I tow the camper (with the truck only, I won't use the 'burb on this) I take it to boost level 3. Quick and easy and I can adjust it on the fly. No skidding tires and I can actually feel the trailers "holding their own" so I think it is working pretty well.

BTW, if you find your tongue is still a bit low with the 2" drop, I used to use a hitch on my S10 with a 2" drop and a ball with a 1" rise. Worked perfect for my need at that time.

 

[JB4310]

I have no problem changing balls on my hitch, I leave it on the vehicle and with a socket to fit and a breakover handle you have the whole truck to be your vice. Speedy2

I have seen some so bad, like they were welded. if you beat them that hard you could damage your receiver, break the socket or wrench.

JB

 

[dstig1]

Yup, something about trailer hitch components, when they get stuck they stay frozen. I know a guy that worked all day getting an insert out of the receiver tube. I've had balls I couldn't break free, even with a monster vise and 4 foot wrench. Heat til they're red hot will do it, but that's not good for their metallurgy.

JB

I came out of my garage one day listening to my next door neighbor trying again and again to start their old Taurus in the driveway. It was their High school kids car they had picked up used. After a few minutes of listening to endless cranking, I went over to offer help. First thing I did was ask them to pop the trunk as that is where the fuel pump cutoff switch is in that Ford (all Fords have them). Sure enough it was popped up so I reset it. They couldn't figure out how, but it started right up then. I said it takes some kind of an impact. Then the light went on. The Dad was beating the daylights out of the hitch that was rusted solid into the receiver to get it out (unsuccessfully). So I saved them a tow/mechanic trip and they learned something... Yeah they can weld in there pretty good. He left it alone after that.

 

[Raspy]

S219,

It sounds like your brakes are not strong enough to lock up even at full voltage, but plenty strong to add a lot of breaking force. I had that situation on one of mine and decided I needed more for mountain towing, so I changed to 5200 lb axles and brakes from the 3500 lb setup I had. What a difference! It may not be a good idea to lock the trailer brakes, but it's also good to have reserve power, if needed, on long downgrades where fading can occur.

Locking up on a curve would be the worst thing, but in icy conditions that could happen even with weak brakes. Too bad we don't have anti-lock trailer brakes. I suppose, if you only have brakes on one axle in a tandem setup, the lockup issue would be less important, but the braking would be less too.

I changed to a Brakesmart controller and will never go back to the inertial or de-celerometer design. But even those need adjusting with varying loads and different trailers. I always set mine so the trailer is pulling slightly back on the truck. It aids stability and reminds me it's working

 

[jejeosborne]

I second this.This is what I usually do.

I think on both of my vehicles I've got my voltage set at 6.0 on the brake controller (as recommended by prodigy). When towing my utility trailer empty I use no boost. With a load I will go to boost level 1 or 2 depending on the load. With the stock trailer empty I will run it at boost level 1, with load I will go to boost level 2. When I tow the camper (with the truck only, I won't use the 'burb on this) I take it to boost level 3. Quick and easy and I can adjust it on the fly. No skidding tires and I can actually feel the trailers "holding their own" so I think it is working pretty well.

BTW, if you find your tongue is still a bit low with the 2" drop, I used to use a hitch on my S10 with a 2" drop and a ball with a 1" rise. Worked perfect for my need at that time.

Just want to mention that prodigy doesn't recommend a setting of 6.0. The output should be adjusted based on the weight of the trailer, road conditions, etc. For example, they should be readjusted if it starts to rain. For safety you want to try to set them right below the point of lockup. None of my current 3 trailers will lock up the brakes even at full gain when loaded so I set them at 10 when the roads are dry. I post a copy earlier of the manual. Might want to revisit it. Please don't take this the wrong way, just trying to be helpful.
Jeff

 

[jejeosborne]

S219,

It sounds like your brakes are not strong enough to lock up even at full voltage, but plenty strong to add a lot of breaking force. I had that situation on one of mine and decided I needed more for mountain towing, so I changed to 5200 lb axles and brakes from the 3500 lb setup I had. What a difference! It may not be a good idea to lock the trailer brakes, but it's also good to have reserve power, if needed, on long downgrades where fading can occur.

Locking up on a curve would be the worst thing, but in icy conditions that could happen even with weak brakes. Too bad we don't have anti-lock trailer brakes. I suppose, if you only have brakes on one axle in a tandem setup, the lockup issue would be less important, but the braking would be less too.

I agree. 3500 lb axles have a 10" brake drum. You get a 12" on the 5200 lb axle. Smart move for the mountains but your suspension might be too stiff unless you used your old springs. Antilock brakes are available but expensive.