Backhoe Top n Tilt with 447 Backhoe

[jba3520]

I'm planning to add the Top and Tilt to my 3520 and was wondering how difficult it will be when I remove it to put on the Backhoe. Is there more brackets and such to remove or is it just pulling some pins and removing the cylinders?

 

[elginfarm]

jba 3520,
Before you spend the money for the top n tilt consider the fact that since you already have the power beyond to control the backhoe you might just want to add a couple of control valves,some hoses and cylinders. I have power beyond and added A third SCV on my 4400, but after talking with an "old timer" he told me just what I'm telling you.
I'm sure there are a lot of more experienced and knowledgeable guys out there that can give you good advice in this matter and correct me if I am wrong. But I think I am right. Fellas??
Good Luck.
Eldon

 

[kennyd]

jba 3520,
Before you spend the money for the top n tilt consider the fact that since you already have the power beyond to control the backhoe you might just want to add a couple of control valves,some hoses and cylinders. I have power beyond and added A third SCV on my 4400, but after talking with an "old timer" he told me just what I'm telling you.
I'm sure there are a lot of more experienced and knowledgeable guys out there that can give you good advice in this matter and correct me if I am wrong. But I think I am right. Fellas??
Good Luck.
Eldon

TnT is just a control valve and two cylinders

'm planning to add the Top and Tilt to my 3520 and was wondering how difficult it will be when I remove it to put on the Backhoe. Is there more brackets and such to remove or is it just pulling some pins and removing the cylinders?

It should be just a matter of pulling pins just like you have to do now to remove your 3PH prior to attaching the backhoe. You will also have 4 hoses to disconnect.

 

[DK35vince]

Top and tilt cylinder are no problem to remove.
Pop the quick couplers and the hoses are off. Remove the pins and the cylinders are off..

 

[jdbower]

If you're not careful with placement you may have to remove the control valve as well. Not much room on my little 2520 so I'll probably have to do that, but it's also not a huge effort to do so. You can see how I did it here.

I only got the hydraulic toplink, I didn't get the "Tilt" part on the side arm so I only have one set of hoses for mine.

 

[GreenMtns]

I'm planning to add the Top and Tilt to my 3520 and was wondering how difficult it will be when I remove it to put on the Backhoe. Is there more brackets and such to remove or is it just pulling some pins and removing the cylinders?

A word of caution here. Before you purchase the John Deere side "tilt" cylinder check the size of the barrel. It is very large. Why, I don't know. You can view it at the Deere web site under build your own 3520. Scroll down to the top and tilt and then click on view it.

I do know of one JD 3520 near me that was setup with the JD cylinder and it would not work because of the large barrel interfering with something. JD took the cylinder back and the owner ended up with the CCM side cylinder. It is about the size of the top cylinder and has a check valve to keep it from drifting. It works very well.

I have that set up on my JD with the diverter valve. With JD's setup you push a button and the flow changes from the loader to the rear SVC's. At first I thought it was a little strange but since you can only use the front or the rear but not both at the same time it works very well.

To remove it is as stated above, 4 quick disconnects for the hoses. Pull the pins from the top and bottom and they are off. 1 minute tops. Very easy.

Pict's would be good when you get it done.

Al

 

[jba3520]

Thanks guys, I am planning to install the diverter at the same time so the current joystick control will be used. It sounds as though I'll be OK, I was mainly concerned about any residual brackets that are part of the TNT.

Al, it would be good to know what the side cylinder was interfering with. Was it a particular attachment or something on the tractor itself? My usage will be mostly with a boxblade so hopefully this will not be a problem.

 

[elroy4455]

The John deere Top and Tilt kit is not compatable with the 447 or 448 backhoe due to the backhoe brackets. The Tilt cylinder will contact the backhoe bracket when the 3pt hitch is in the top 2/3 travel. There is an aftermarket company which sells Top and Tilt kits with a smaller bore cylinder. The smaller cylinder will still hit the backhoe mounting bracket if the 3pt hitch is in the up position and the 3pt hitch arms swing to the right. Good luck.

Link for aftermarket T&T kit:

Hydraulic top link, Top-N-Tilt, Side link

 

[SFish]

I have a 447 hoe and a Gearmore Top and Tilt on a 3320. It plugs into the Power Beyond and there are no problems with clearance. Changing it out for the hoe is the same as removing the standard 3 point arms and link, just heavier. When I take it off I just remove the control valve from its adjustable mount (loosen two bolts and it slides out) and don't even unplug the the cylinders, I just unplug the controller in-out lines from the Power Beyond unit.

Steve

 

[jba3520]

My dealer knows I have the 447 hoe and ordered the TNT for me. I wonder if they have changed it or my dealer just doesn't know about this.

Steve, can I ask how much you paid for the Gearmore TNT? Also what size cylinder did you get for the tilt? I would not get the kit for power beyond since I'll have the diverter, but I may be canceling my order for the TNT and ordering elsewhere.

 

[SFish]

Hi JBA:

There are three Gearmore numbers on the Top & Tilt - #T3X8 18, 30WD08-125, 644749. I don't know what these numbers designate. It cost $1,700 (with the controller valve module) and I don't know what the cylinder size is, but the OD for both is 3.5". My dealer (Rainbow Ag in Ukiah, CA) sell a lot of Gearmore equipment. They told me that you get more for the cost. The Top & Tilt and 72" box blade are certainly very sturdy.

On my rig, I don't see how there could be a clearance problem with any reasonabe cylinder. If you have the 447 hoe you already have the Power Beyond kit (required for the hoe), but I don't know what the cost differential would be between the Gearmore valves and a set of diverters. I did not use diverters from the loader valves for the Top & Tilt because I already have one for a grapple attached to the loader bucket. I can see how using the loader control for adjusting the box blade (via diverter) could be very ergonomic, however the Gearmore valves are not bad. They are mounted on a tube that is, in turn, mounted to the ROPs on the right side. It is easy to adjust (up and down, tilt, and slide back out of the way) and remove. One thing to consider with diverters is dressing hoses so they are out of the way when the hoe is on. With my set up I just unplug from the Power Beyond, so there are no extra hoses on the tractor when the backhoe is on.

Steve

 

[GreenMtns]

Thanks guys, I am planning to install the diverter at the same time so the current joystick control will be used. It sounds as though I'll be OK, I was mainly concerned about any residual brackets that are part of the TNT.

With the JD diverter valve There wont be any brackets to get in the way. I'll attach a clickable picture of the back of my 3520 and you can see where the hoses will plug in. The dirverter SVC's are on the right side.




As Elroy4455 said any cylinder will hit the backhoe bracket if it is in the full raised position and swings to the right. Pretty easy to prevent that from happening.

I think given the amount of money one will spend to do this right, I would most certainly be sure to get cylinders with check valves so the settings will not change over time.
You would not want to find that after grading a while the right side of the blade or box blade had drifted down and was digging in more than you thought.

Do a search for check valves in the hydraulic forum or search for check valves with postings by MadReferee. He was very informative about all things hydraulic.

 

[jba3520]

Does anyone here have an open station 3x20 with diverter valve and power beyond installed? Possibly with pictures?

I appreciate all your responses and I know you are trying to help. After reading these comments though and talking to two different dealers I'm more confused than ever. My original concern was how difficult the TNT would be to remove versus what I do now to install my backhoe. But now I'm led to believe by one dealer that it will take me 1-2 hours to remove hoses and bracketry. I was assuming as some have already said here that I could just disconnect 4 hoses, pull pins and remove the cylinders.

Al, I appreciate the picture you attached but this is for a cab which has a different setup. Also, where on the JD web site can you "view" the TNT? the only place I can get any graphics is the exploded view in the parts catalog. Whan I do a "Build your own" and click on the TNT it doesn't show me a picture, just the part number. I would really like to see a picture of it. Preferably with power beyond and the subframe mounts for the backhoe, but I'll take what I can get.

I am amazed at the lack of knowledge the dealers have about what will work together. I have ordered the TNT kit and diverter from my dealer which assured me they would be fine with the backhoe. But when I called and questioned him about the clearance issues he wasn't quite so sure. That's when I called the other dealer and they called me back after they said they called JD and he's the one that is telling me 1-2 hours to make the change.

This is getting painful.

Blades

 

[SFish]

JBA:

The hydraulics should all have quick disconnect fittings so this doesn't take but a minute or so. The Top and Tilt cylinders just stand in for non hydraulic links, so they take about the same amount of time to install or uninstall as the mechanical ones. Here are pics from my rig. I will check and repost if they are too pixelated. My diverter for the grapple is mounted on the loader mast and just diverts the bucket tilt lines to the grapple at the press of a button.

Steve

 

[jba3520]

Thanks Steve, that's what I'm thinking. It should be no big deal and relatively quick and painless. I also appreciate the picture and if I decide to go the non-JD route I will check out the Gearmore units. At the moment though I have the JD on order and would really like to see a picture of the JD setup.

Blades