Tires TIRES FOR DAD

[thcri]

I am sure if I dig deep enough I may find my answer in this forum someplace but will take the easier route.

My dad has a Ford 861 tractor that has Ag tires on it. He uses it mostly for moving docks and boats on a sand beach. The tractor over the years has become a pain for him because of the steering and the lack of traction.

He has found a used Ford 1720 that has AG tires on it. It is 4 wheel drive though. His concern is he wanted turf tires because they will work better on the sand. His old tractor was always stuck, but it was two wheel drive.

My assumption is the 4 wheel alone should make a major difference. This tractor has a really good price on it and I hate to see him let it go because of the AG tires. At the price I would think he could afford a set of turf's if so.

Has anyone had any experience with sand and AG tires?

Murph

 

[Casimir]

Murph -
That is a tough call. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif I don't have any direct experience with turfs and sand, but I use turfs in mud, snow and the woods. They generally provide a wider "footprint," and if they are not filled, you could lower the tire pressure to minimum, which is usually about 10-12 psi, which would help them to float on top of the sand and not dig in.

However, the "paddle" effect of Ag tires would sometimes be helpful, I would think. I know in mud and snow, I sometimes wish I had Ag tires instead of turf. Keeping the tire pressure at minimum would also help them to stay on top, rather than digging in. A lot of sand buggies use what they call Paddle tires, but they are usually wide, low pressure tires, with bars or paddles to aid in traction - similar to the "bar turf" tires offered on the BX series Kubotas.

The 1720 is a good tractor, and the 4WD will make a big difference. I would be inclined to try it with the Ag tires, and the tire pressure as low as you can go without danger of the tires slipping on the rims before putting out the money for turfs.

Good luck on your decision. Keep us posted on how it works.

 

[thcri]

Casimir,

The big problem with the Ag is the fact that they do dig and dig down. I really think with the 4 wheel he would tend to keep himself up on top of the sand more. He actually is ok with the old heavy two wheel drive once he starts moving, it is just getting going. Lock the differential and have it in 4 wheel and I reallly think he would be ok.

Murph

 

[kcbarnes]

Just a thought, could you change the direction of the tire so it would be more of a scoop than a self clean in the normal direction? I have no experience with tractors on sand but would be a cheap thing to try.

 

[rdbrumfield]

The ag tires will do him just fine. When he replaces the front if he has rims that are compatable, us a good traction pickup tire. It will give good traction in sand and better flotation. Wouldn't worry about the back at all.

 

[thcri]

I do know that backing up he does have better traction. That is a thought, just turn the tires around.

Murph

 

[Casimir]

Murph -
That is true. Once spinning, the Ag tires will dig faster than turfs would. One other point, though - if the 1720 has a hydrostatic transmission, he may find it easier to get moving without spinning the rear tires. The hydro allows you to ease the power into the wheels. With a gear transmission and clutch, you eventually reach a point where either the tires spin or you kill the engine. Shifting to a higher gear sometimes helps. Low gear, or Low Range in a Hydro sometimes puts too much power to the wheels too quickly, and once they start spinning, more power just makes them dig faster. Ideally, you want to stay just above the point where the tires spin for maximum traction in snow or sand.

As you said, if the price on the 1720 is good enough, perhaps changing to turfs would be an option, but you will probably have to buy wider rims, as well as the tires. I would still try the Ags (perhaps also try them reversed) before I put out the money for the turfs - but I was too cheap to buy a used set of ag tires and rims for $300 when I bought my 1520. Now I wish I had them, but I still don't have the ability to switch back and forth easily between the ags and turfs. My old back just won't take it any more /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif. Getting old is hell, but I don't like the alternative any better /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.

 

[thcri]

Casimir,

You are absolutely right!! Especially with that old tractor. My dad is just worried that it won't work and he is no further ahead than he was before. Even though he can buy another set of tires.

And when it comes right down to it I think he has more trouble with the steering on the old beast. It has a loader on it also and with the tires sunk in the sand you just can't turn the steering wheel.

Murph

 

[Casimir]

He will absolutely love the power steering on the 1720 /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif - Only problem is it is possible to turn so tight you have to straighten the front wheels out some to keep them from sliding sideways -- 'least I do in mud with my 1520 /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

 

[thcri]

That's where I just love my supersteer. You turn them wheels really tight and the outside wheel starts powering and the front axle even turns to the direction your turning. It is tough getting use to using your FEL but great for mowing.

Murph

 

[Casimir]

<font color="green"> Envy!! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif </font> I really wanted a TC29D, but I got the 1520 with a 4n1 bucket and a couple other implements for about half what the TC29D with FEL would have cost -- and no payments /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif.

 

[thcri]

Yep.

I got no payments for one year also. When I was buying no dealer told me about the 1500's or the 1700's. I didn't know they even existed anymore? I don't see them on New Holland's web page either.

Murph

 

[Casimir]

Mine was used - 1995 model w/ 700 hours. That's why I got a couple of implements with it. I have put over 150 hrs on it in a little less than a year, with no problems, just a 100 hr service. Paint is a little rough, since the previous owner did not park it under cover, but it runs great and has lots of power for it's size. I am sure your dad will like the 1720 if it is in good shape.

 

[Soundguy]

Just one thing to keep in mind. The idea of using turf tires as 'flotation' to go over the top of the sand, is only good for unencumbered travel without respect to traction/weight/ horsepower. If you are pulling a heavy load, you will find the turfs are going to perform like slicks....

Try an inbetween like an r4 industrial tire... benefits of an ag with a bit less agressive paddles.

I've been in road construction for years... my stepdad has been doing road const. since army eng. core back in nam doing emergency runways, etc.

Not a single peice of heavy equipment ( except rollers ) that we have use has come from the dealer with anything but an r-1 or r-4 style tire... ( paddle tread or industrial tread ).....

4wd is going to help bunches, especially with wieght on the front.

That 1720, if still with stock r-1's is a baby brother to my 1920.. almost exactly the same except size.... My stock r-1's have only gotten me stuck once... and it was a wet lake bed/bod/muck...2' deep... I high centered...

As for that 861... are you running filled tires? any front weight? Also, does the front steering have lots of play? If so, he should be able to adjust it... I think the 8n / naa/ 600/800 series all use a similar style steering gear box with steering adjustments on it to tighten it up.

good luck

Soundguy

 

[thcri]

Sound Guy,

He has a loader on the tractor which has made the steering pretty tuff even for a tough guy. If your moving the steering is ok. As far as adjustments, my dad worked on Ford tractors as a mechanic for 25 years and that tractor is in good shape. I always said he could them old Ford's apart and put them back together blind folded.

But with the loader on, the front wheels tend to sink in the sand and then you can't move the steering wheel, and the back ones you just have to be really careful to not allow any spinning or they will dig in also. I think he should try the Ag's and see what happens.

Murph