TC-25D Won't Crank - I Need Some Help Please

[TC25Dave]

TC-25D Won't Crank - I Need Some Help Please

New Holland Yr 2000 Model TC25D with HST. Have had a couple of intermittent failures to crank (before I last replaced battery) which seemingly healed themselves. Solenoid now silent with no start when key fully turned to the right.

• Slow charged 18 mo. old battery (indicated fully charged)– terminals freshly cleaned and tight – actually load tests at slightly over 10 volts. Removed battery ground wire to frame and sand papered just to ensure solid ground.
• Headlights and instrument panel lights all operative with ignition switch on.
• Key turn seems to properly engage glow plug and result in normal pre-heat functionality.
• Hazard lights work with key removed.
• Main 30a and all fuses in fuse box visibly good.
• Test light illuminates/confirms power from battery to single solenoid main lug – all solenoid/starter connections clean and tight.
• Parking brake light illuminates when brakes set/handle activated.
• PTO and Mid-PTO levers activate PTO ON Indicator when engaged, turn off warning light when set in “OFF” position. Moved through ranges several times before return to “OFF” positions.
• HST range lever moved throughout ranges and reset to either (tried both) of the two (2) NEUTRAL positions.
• No seat safety switch installed on this model.
• Checked good connection on dual wire push in plug PTO safety switch (PTO ON warning light off if both wires connected or if switch is bypassed with solid copper jumper; warning light on if one or both wires disconnected).
• Both PTOs, HST range and parking brake safety switches appear visually clean and seem to operate panel indicator lights as operationally expected.
• HST pedal moved throughout forward and reverse ranges and returned to (Middle) presumed “NEUTRAL” with HST Range lever set to “NEUTRAL” position; All PTO levers in “OFF” position; Parking brake engaged; Clutch pedal fully depressed; ignition key turned fully to right – result is no solenoid noise/no starter turnover.
• No visible rodent chews or damage on any wiring.
• Tapped solenoid body with hammer while attempting to crank, silent – no response.
• Front loader bucket attached with lower blade edge angled down on the ground

Is it likely that these OEM safety switches would operate dash warning lights without adequate current to properly function?

Does anyone know appropriate DMM readings/ranges for each of the safety switches?

Is there a sequential series in which safety switches should be tested using DMM?

If I bypass solenoid and start tractor, will key still shut this diesel engine down?

Is there a testing procedure for this kind of problem in a Shop Repair manual?

Any suggestions on where to get a wiring diagram and/or repair manual for this model? (concerned about downloading some kind of computer virus or getting scammed from websites/sellers I don’t know anything about).

I greatly appreciate any help or advice – I’m obviously not a good mechanic – thanks for your time and expertise.

Very respectfully yours,

TC25Dave - newby

 

[RustyA]

Fully charged battery should test for 12.6 volts. Very likely your battery has a bad cell and solenoid needs 12v. Lights will illuminate with the 10.5 volts your 5 good cells are putting out. Trying jumpstarting with another vehicle to take your battery out of the equation.

 

[TC25Dave]

I will try that and report back with results - many thanks for your suggestion!

 

[dlctcg]

I would definitely check that battery...

Below is from one of my previous post.... It should explain how to test your cables. Hope this is a help: (see below)


Starting Problems:

NH Have a few known gremlins that can pop-up: (these are the things I would be checking first.)
1) Battery Cables both positive & ground (description below)
2) Check for a lose / or chaffed ground wire
3) Ignition Switch -
4) Voltage at the Starter Solenoid -



Cable Test:
Older New Holland battery cables often corrode inside the terminal (or in the cable itself) where it is sometimes impossible to see; not sure if was an issue with your particular yr / model... You will often have voltage so everything seems good. (gauges & all are working). So you will have voltage but they will not supply the required Amperage.

You can test if there is an issue with your existing battery cables pretty simply.

Remove the negative battery cable & then take a negative jumper cable wire and place it on the bare negative post of your tractor battery. Connect the other end to a solid clean ground of the tractor (bare metal location). Try starting the tractor & see if that makes a difference...

If that doesn't change anything you can do the same process on the positive post. Disconnect the Negative jumper from the Battery terminal. Then using your positive jumper cable attach one end to where the positive battery cable connects to the starter (connect this end first), and the other end to the positive battery post (last). Make sure the jumper cable is not able to arc to near by metal. Now reconnect the Negative jumper cable to the battery & try starting the tractor again & see if that changes anything...

Doing this process you basically bypassed the battery cables on the machine, and then can troubleshoot from there. I wouldn't put any more parts on it till I checked the factory cables...


Ignition Switch:
These are also prone to issues & can cause the issue your describing. (I'll see if I can find a testing procedure).... but check to see if you have voltage at the starter solenoid when the key is turned to start..

Starter Solenoid:
Make sure you have 12V at the starter solenoid when you turn the key to START...

If you see voltage only sometime I'm thinking it either a spotty ground or Ignition switch.

If you are see voltage Each time you turn the key to the START position but it is less than 12V this will definitely cause an inconsistent starting issue. This circuit shares the voltage source with the glow plug timer (& I believe passes through some of the safety switches). Overtime the wiring & connection get dirty / lose there ability to pass the voltage. You can modify the current wiring & add a dedicated relay for supplying direct power to the starter solenoid via the same circuits. I did this on our TC40D & it made a big difference for our machine... but I would first diagnosis the issue

 

[Wasmeneh]

My Ford 1920 wouldn't start the other day tried to jump start it with a k own good battery. Turns out the bad battery was still making it fail to start. Got a new battery and all is good.
If yours won't jump start the battery may still be your problem.

 

[TC25Dave]

Tried jumping from a running F150 pickup - still nothing.

 

[TC25Dave]

I would definitely check that battery...

Below is from one of my previous post.... It should explain how to test your cables. Hope this is a help: (see below)


Starting Problems:

NH Have a few known gremlins that can pop-up: (these are the things I would be checking first.)
1) Battery Cables both positive & ground (description below)
2) Check for a lose / or chaffed ground wire
3) Ignition Switch -
4) Voltage at the Starter Solenoid -



Cable Test:
Older New Holland battery cables often corrode inside the terminal (or in the cable itself) where it is sometimes impossible to see; not sure if was an issue with your particular yr / model... You will often have voltage so everything seems good. (gauges & all are working). So you will have voltage but they will not supply the required Amperage.

You can test if there is an issue with your existing battery cables pretty simply.

Remove the negative battery cable & then take a negative jumper cable wire and place it on the bare negative post of your tractor battery. Connect the other end to a solid clean ground of the tractor (bare metal location). Try starting the tractor & see if that makes a difference...

If that doesn't change anything you can do the same process on the positive post. Disconnect the Negative jumper from the Battery terminal. Then using your positive jumper cable attach one end to where the positive battery cable connects to the starter (connect this end first), and the other end to the positive battery post (last). Make sure the jumper cable is not able to arc to near by metal. Now reconnect the Negative jumper cable to the battery & try starting the tractor again & see if that changes anything...

Doing this process you basically bypassed the battery cables on the machine, and then can troubleshoot from there. I wouldn't put any more parts on it till I checked the factory cables...


Ignition Switch:
These are also prone to issues & can cause the issue your describing. (I'll see if I can find a testing procedure).... but check to see if you have voltage at the starter solenoid when the key is turned to start..

Starter Solenoid:
Make sure you have 12V at the starter solenoid when you turn the key to START...

If you see voltage only sometime I'm thinking it either a spotty ground or Ignition switch.

If you are see voltage Each time you turn the key to the START position but it is less than 12V this will definitely cause an inconsistent starting issue. This circuit shares the voltage source with the glow plug timer (& I believe passes through some of the safety switches). Overtime the wiring & connection get dirty / lose there ability to pass the voltage. You can modify the current wiring & add a dedicated relay for supplying direct power to the starter solenoid via the same circuits. I did this on our TC40D & it made a big difference for our machine... but I would first diagnosis the issue

I'm an old guy and about give out after a day of fussin' with it. Excellent suggestions as these are definitely the OEM battery cables devilishly appearing to be good from the outside - just the kind of place gremlins love to lurk. I will try and round up a set of helping hands and continue chasing the problem - hopefully tomorrow. I will report back with results from those efforts - many thanks for your insightful help!

 

[TC25Dave]

My Ford 1920 wouldn't start the other day tried to jump start it with a k own good battery. Turns out the bad battery was still making it fail to start. Got a new battery and all is good.
If yours won't jump start the battery may still be your problem.

Wife got a new car a few months ago - If cable swaps suggested by dlctctg don't help. I will follow your suggestion next and report back. Thanks for sharing the benefit of your "been there couldn't believe what happened!" experience - would not have thought of this otherwise.

 

[lman]

If the tractor was always stored inside, it's unlikely to be corroded cables. If it was left outside at some time there is likely some corrosion to the cables. Where are you located? Humidity could get your cables.

 

[TC25Dave]

If the tractor was always stored inside, it's unlikely to be corroded cables. If it was left outside at some time there is likely some corrosion to the cables. Where are you located? Humidity could get your cables.

Stored inside much of its' life, but has been outside under a tarp for a few years now. Just outside Memphis, so humidity could well be a factor. I hope to continue testing with everyone's great suggestions - gonna try and find another set of eyes and hands to help keep me honest (and able to walk)! So glad I found this discussion forum!