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sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800

   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #81  
To me it just sounds like bad engineering, it's just slamming into engagement. If there's an orifice that can be changed to soften the engagement I'd install one small enough to work correctly, even if I had to make it myself.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #82  
I don't know, I'm having a hard time believing that Kubota would put something out like this (unless a defect). Kubota is really good with hydraulics.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #83  
What sort of remotes do you have on this?
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800
  • Thread Starter
#84  
I second the idea of starting the pto with the cutter on the ground. Not in tall grass, but on a nice flat surface. The wheels being anchored to the ground by the cutter's weight will absorb a lot of the jolt you are feeling.

Good thought. I will try it. It makes sense that it would help to dampen the shaking of the mower itself.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800
  • Thread Starter
#86  
Probably not the problem here, but......
Can the two pieces of the PTO shaft be put together wrong? That is, are the two universals 90 degrees out of phase with each other?
Seeing how the vibration stops once up to speed, and most pto shafts can't put together incorrectly, this is probably not the problem, but something to keep in mind on PTO vibration problems.

No, the PTO shaft was okay except that the original shaft was too short, not proper overlap. New one will be in action this weekend.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #88  
Three sets but none are in use yet.

That you KNOW of. The reason I'm asking is because if you've got a full detent valve and it's engaged your hydraulics will be quite messed up. I bumped mine the other day and was trying to figure out why my tractor was really struggling. The positioning of the lever isn't real clear-cut. I doubt that this is your issue, but I thought it wouldn't hurt (sometimes the easiest explanations get overlooked).

On the suggestion of having your cutter on the ground... I'd never thought to start one up OFF the ground. Yeah, that tail will waggle and jump like crazy. But, there's still this issue of why you get such a nasty engagement sound and why, if the cutter is off the ground that the engine stalls (I am not sure if I would even want to try do duplicate this on either of my tractors).
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800
  • Thread Starter
#89  
Interesting thought about the remotes--that I KNOW of. I'll try to eliminate that variable. I have a pressure gauge I can use to check to see if there is any pressure on any of the remote outlets. As to starting the mower, I don't start rotary mowers with the tail wheel off the ground. I usually start them with the front of the mower raised enough that the mower and PTO shaft are close to being level with the ground but with the tail wheel on the ground.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #90  
I've seen some shake pretty violent when the pto is engaged that had the electric engagement, but never seen or had one stall. I'd be having the dealer Checking it out, they can test the hydraulic pressures on the pto clutch to make sure they are in spec along with finding out why it is stalling, I'm thinking a saftey switch is at fault for that if all else checks out. I too would be interested in seeing a video of yours to see just how it's starting up.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #91  
I believe this thread is actually going to go over the #100 mark. Somehow. With not resolution. None even in sight...... :)
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #92  
I believe this thread is actually going to go over the #100 mark. Somehow. With not resolution. None even in sight...... :)

Being new to the "web forum" format I've been trying to figure out the psychology/sociology of why some threads go on for a long time with no new information OR major tangent.

This only happens occasionally as far as I can tell but I can't figure out what is peculiar to the threads where it does (like this one).

It happens on many topics and involvement of the OP does not appear to be a determinant. :confused3:
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #93  
Being new to the "web forum" format I've been trying to figure out the psychology/sociology of why some threads go on for a long time with no new information OR major tangent.

This only happens occasionally as far as I can tell but I can't figure out what is peculiar to the threads where it does (like this one).

It happens on many topics and involvement of the OP does not appear to be a determinant. :confused3:

Luke, if you figure it out, start a thread about it.....
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #94  
Being new to the "web forum" format I've been trying to figure out the psychology/sociology of why some threads go on for a long time with no new information OR major tangent.

This only happens occasionally as far as I can tell but I can't figure out what is peculiar to the threads where it does (like this one).

It happens on many topics and involvement of the OP does not appear to be a determinant. :confused3:

Luke, if you figure it out, start a thread about it.....

Oh man, I'm there.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800
  • Thread Starter
#95  
Progress. First a learning: It was suggested earlier in this thread that I engage the PTO at an rpm level above idle. Per the rpm gauge on the MX, idle is at 800 rpms. As I was fueling the tractor today and edging it back and forth at idle rpms to get it closer to the fuel tank, I changed the HST pedal pretty quickly from reverse to forward and the tractor shut down. I hadn't noticed it before but obviously this tractor is sensitive to sudden and different hydraulic loads. I greased the new PTO shaft and joints and put it on the mower. I have more than 15" overlap with this new shaft. I removed the mower from the tractor, checked everything, hooked it back up making sure the 3PH connections were like they should be. Then I took the tractor and mower outside to a clear level spot, lowered the mower to the ground (another suggestion earlier in this thread), and engaged the PTO with the engine at idle. It worked. Shook a good bit but less than before. I shut everything down, cranked back up and engaged the PTO again. This time the mower shook a lot and the tractor shut off. So I started over but this time I inched the rpms up to 900. There was definitely a different tone from the engine. Engaged the PTO again and it worked fine, with actually less shaking. I shut everything down and tried the sequence again, this time at 1,000 rpms. The mower got started okay but it seemed to shake a little more, didn't start up as smoothly, as engaging at 900 rpms. So I did some mowing and during the course of the mowing shut down the mower and restarted probably 7-8 times, each time with the mower on the ground on a clear level spot, and each time at 900 rpms. The engagement worked each time, and usually shook some but was more or less like I have been used to with having used rotary mowers for over 30 years. So the changes were a new and longer PTO shaft with very good overlap, starting with the mower on the ground to dampen the shaking some, and engaging the PTO at 900 rpms versus 800. My conclusion is that maybe no single one of the changes would have solved the problem but all contributed and the MX5800 and mower are working together. And varying the rpms just from 800 to 900 seems to have helped a lot. Just a 12.5% change. And it was interesting that moving up to 1,000 rpms didn't work as well as 900 rpms. I still plan on taking off the blades to make sure they aren't bent, but I think I am good to go now in the sense that I know that the tractor and mower can work well together. And the mower just hums along at the full 540 PTO rpms, which is 2,650 engine rpms for the tractor.

Thanks to everyone who contributed thoughts. As I learn more I will report back.
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #96  
Dang it,,,, we may not make #100..... ;)
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #98  
Sure we will... see? ... almost there now..:D

Where's Murph when you need him!!!! :)

P.S. Glad you are getting resolution on your PTO problem!!!!! :thumbsup:
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #99  
Here I is!
 
   / sudden and violent PTO engagement with new Kubota MX5800 #100  
What do you need?
 

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