Starlink

[buckeyefarmer]

Thanks plowhog. Good info. I think I’ll just keep my regular home SL order ( since I can’t seem to cancel it) , and have it and RV one. I’ll probably just stop RV one when home system comes. Good to know gotta swap both dish and router.

 

[Fallon]

I just had a nice long conversation with several Starlink security engineers here at DEFcon today.

There are no technical differences between a static system & RV system. The static accounts just get priority if there are bandwidth limitations. The RV systems or static systems that have mobility enabled will work in locations other than their home location.

Interestingly any Starlink station will go active & send out packets to the network. The satellites will even route them. It's just the ground station that won't route them out to the Internet.

Engineers like to hang out on Reddit & have heard lots of complaints about lack of Ethernet. Next one is likely to have integrated Ethernet again. The AP unit is weatherproof & they couldn't easily get a stock ethernet plug tp seal well so went with the propitary plug they could seal.

The AP unit just runs a customized version of OpenWRT. It's a normal AP with extra PoE juice & and a TPM chip for authentication. The dish itself spits out standard ethernet packets over the cable back to the AP.

 

[ponytug]

Great info! Thank you!!

 

[plowhog]

I’ll probably just stop RV one when home system comes.

That was the key for me ordering the RV model-- the ability to pause service. If that wasn't possible I probably would not have ordered it.

btw, 260mbps this morning via Starlink- in Nevada, just before 4am. I've seen 260 here before, also early morning. 260mbps seems tip top speed-- so it might represent a hardware/equipment limit.

In CA, top speed is typically 1/3 of that. I used remote desktop and checked the CA speed this morning-- ranging from mid-80's to 91. That's actually very good for the CA system; also, you have to factor any mbps overhead the remote desktop is taking so it's actually a little better than indicated.

 

[LittleBill21]

Interestingly any Starlink station will go active & send out packets to the network. The satellites will even route them. It's just the ground station that won't route them out to the Internet.

Can you explain this a bit better?

 

[newbury]

From testing with Fast.com I think some devices are self limiting as to speed...

In a side by side the Moto is always 40 and the old Apple 6S always 200 to 240...

This is one reason I don't think paying for gig speed is a benefit many would realize unless many users at the same time?
th
For myself and a lot of my neighbors we have found optimal locations in our homes for cell wifi hotspots...

Moving 20 feet across the room can be night and day as in no service to 2 bars...

All is not lost as there continues to be incremental improvement because only a few years back we had no bars.

Different chips for different ships.
My 2019 Dell laptop won't due over 50Mbps up/down on WiFi and 10 ft from the router with no obstruction, My 2020 Android phone routinely reports 100+ Mbps.
Seems some laptops have chips that are not built for over 50 Mbps.
The same laptop gets over 100 Mbps when connected directly to the router with Cat 6.

 

[LittleBill21]

My 2019 Dell laptop won't due over 50Mbps up/down on WiFi and 10 ft from the router with no obstruction

i own about 10 dell laptops, almost all of them if they are ac based, will do over 600mbit. you have a problem.

 

[BigBlue1]

While I was waiting for bootup, I looked around at the new questions and answers on the SL app. Now, in response to the question as to whether there are any data caps, the answer is "not at this time."

The data cap answer is somewhat alarming to me-- I'm pretty sure it used to say "No." I hope there are no rude data cap "surprises" in the future ....

It has said "not at this time" since the very beginning. They've left themselves open to whatever changes they choose to do.

 

[plowhog]

It has said "not at this time" since the very beginning.

Starlink's web page describing its own service levels is still active. Each says "No Data Caps."

Regardless, it looks like SL is already rolling out some data caps ....

Starlink Imposing High-Speed Data Caps in France (But Monthly Cost Will Drop)

Under the new policy, users in France may experience slower speeds once they exceed a 250GB data download limit, according to a message SpaceX sent to customers.

www.pcmag.com

 

[ponytug]

Don't you wonder why just France?

 

[BigBlue1]

Starlink's web page describing its own service levels is still active. Each says "No Data Caps."

Regardless, it looks like SL is already rolling out some data caps ....

Starlink Imposing High-Speed Data Caps in France (But Monthly Cost Will Drop)

Under the new policy, users in France may experience slower speeds once they exceed a 250GB data download limit, according to a message SpaceX sent to customers.

www.pcmag.com

View attachment 758399

That wording isn't in conflict. For the US they do not currently have data caps. Which means they don't have caps *at this time*. Nothing has ever said there will never be caps, and that additional wording of "at this time" frees them from some interpretation that there will never be caps. And remember, the US Starlink page has info related to the US. It is not intended to speak for all possible regions.

 

[plowhog]

Compared to HughesNet, I'm pleased with SL. But there is no denying changes are underway with many not beneficial to users. User comments from recently data-capped users in France fear SL is on their way to becoming just another run-of-the-mill sat company with high fees and crappy service. I don't agree with that-- I now have multiple SL systems and have encouraged neighbors to buy in as well.

However, even SL cheerleaders have to admit SL has little customer service and provides near zero information on system or policy changes. One example I am personally familiar with is their "RV" service. The SL service description in effect when I purchased an RV system showed 10-20mb upload speeds. That table has since been updated, with no notice or fanfare, to lower speeds down to as slow as 1mb. (1mb, really?) Of course there was never a contractual commitment to provide that speed. But if ATT advertised 1g speed and only provided 1/10th of that, there would be a lot of howling.

I cut SL a lot of slack for being an innovative startup. Where I don't cut any slack is not having customer support commensurate with a global internet product. As an invested customer, I believe that is going to bite them and backfire as time goes on ... although I hope to be proven wrong on that.

Here are the two tables I referred to:

 

[Fallon]

Can you explain this a bit better?

Any starlink dish will connect to the network & update itself no matter what as long as it's powered on & can see sky. Doesn't matter if it's off a contract or what. Interesting quirk is it will pass user packets & traffic over the satelite. It blocks traffic for accounts that aren't active at the ground station, or PoP. Not much practical normal users can do with that info. But my hacker brain is grinding away trying out to figure out possible implications.

 

[LittleBill21]

Any starlink dish will connect to the network & update itself no matter what as long as it's powered on & can see sky. Doesn't matter if it's off a contract or what. Interesting quirk is it will pass user packets & traffic over the satelite. It blocks traffic for accounts that aren't active at the ground station, or PoP. Not much practical normal users can do with that info. But my hacker brain is grinding away trying out to figure out possible implications.

ah thanks, that is a bit interesting.

 

[ponytug]

Any starlink dish will connect to the network & update itself no matter what as long as it's powered on & can see sky. Doesn't matter if it's off a contract or what. Interesting quirk is it will pass user packets & traffic over the satelite. It blocks traffic for accounts that aren't active at the ground station, or PoP. Not much practical normal users can do with that info. But my hacker brain is grinding away trying out to figure out possible implications.

Yes, that's where I went when you posted it initially. Not the most robust/secure arrangement.

 

[Fallon]

Yes, that's where I went when you posted it initially. Not the most robust/secure arrangement.

Not sure on that. It does keep all dishes up to date so they won't try to use any obsolete signaling or protocols & interfere with newer stuff. You could in theory flood out 1 way traffic that would get dropped. But you can just jam things with RF noise anyway.

I didn't delve that deep into the ramifications of that with the Starlink security engineer. But did have a great enlightening conversation with him about a lot of Starlink architecture & stuff in general.

 

[sodamo]

Data cap in France but at a reduced cost. Thought provoking. Not sure, but at this point no caps, full price works for me.

I do get a chuckle re Customer Service comments.

My initial ‘broadband’ here (2-3mbps) was a local hook up via Ubiquiti pico/nano to the local telecom/cable. While the service provider was responsive that was only for his equipment, not the source.

When I first switched the LTE broadband, again the provide only offered help involving the equipment/sim supplied by them. Anything on the AT&T side was out of reach.

Still pleased with my SL RV, still hoping the convert to full residential at some point. I do think I’m seeing less drops, both in terms of frequency and total time, but almost a non issue compared to my previous services.

I guess if SL CS would just respond in a timely manner “We see you have a problem, will followup” many complaints would go away. It’s the not knowing.

 

[WoodChuckDad]

The place that says cancel isn’t a link. There is no way to cancel. Very frustrating. There is no way to contact them.

Are you cancelling because the RV system is sufficient?

 

[buckeyefarmer]

Since I can’t figure out how to cancel, I will keep the home order, then stop my RV one once it comes. It is $25 less expensive every month.
So far RV has been working fine, I now have my home network on it, and added a mesh unit.

 

[cqaigy2]

Just happened to look over at the dish this morning.