skid steer or compact?????

[LoneCowboy]

So, we're expanding the business (aka putting yet more money into it ) and adding manure removal. We've done a couple already and purchased a dump trailer and added height to it (manure doesn't weigh all that much). For the first couple we rented a skid steer and well, a skid steer is awesomely fast for loading and getting into and out of tight spaces. For the last couple we just loaded up my MF1433 with FEL and did it that way, pretty slow, but it worked, we made money.

So, we were going to just buy a skid steer and go with that, but lately since we've gotten the cabbed TN75DA, we've noticed how really nice it is to have a cab. (and we've had an incredible run of bad luck with both tractors being down some days and having to push jobs, people hate that). So, it occured to me yesterday, what if we got a smaller cabbed compact (currently look NH TC45DA, but ignore the NH for now and think general) that we could use for both manure removal and as the 2nd tractor and relegate the open platform MF to backup duty and jobs where it's well suited.

Cost for either is about the same.

Skid Steer: very fast to load, small, easily fits in dump trailer, no cab, only useful for manure loading or getting a materials handling job (not our main business, but it happens once in a while). Good for leveling, putting in arena's, etc, but again, no gauranteed work. Manaure business is still small at this point. SS's can tear up the ground if you aren't careful.

Compact cabbed tractor: slower to load manure (although we'd probably get a hydrostatic drive, which should speed it up). Slightly more money, more useful as back up to existing tractors and the cab is much more capable when mowing. Easier on the ground than a SS.

Thoughts????????

 

[Z-Michigan]

We know a nearby business that does nothing but manure handling and uses a compact tractor with good results. Major considerations for them were weight (able to pull with a 1/2 ton pickup and not overloading trailers that aren't that big) and getting into tight areas. I think only the former is a plus for the compact tractor.

Have you thought about getting a skidsteer with a cab and getting a front mower, power rake and tiller? I would imagine that would be a good ticket for doing a variety of tasks in pastures/paddocks too small for the tractors to be very maneuverable. I sure wish I had a skid steer in addition to my tractor.

 

[Slacker]

Peope use skidsteers to bush hog in this area (front mount, hyrdo drive). It could be a backup to the backup for bushhogging. You got a rifle rack in that NH cab?

 

[VABlue]

I'd agree with those guys - get a cabbed skid steer with the pertinent attachments. Not as good at brush hogging, but a capable backup nonetheless. Especially in tight areas. If you're looking to grow the business, diversifying is the way to go. Why put all of your eggs into one basket?

 

[art]

Focus is the key here! I'd stick with the tractor as all attachments could go from one to the other and Skid steers would mean a whole new line-up of attachments other then the loader for flexibility. That is unless the profits are that good.

 

[LoneCowboy]

Just a FYI, getting a skid steer with a cab requires you to go to a pretty big (6') skid steer (NH 180+)
Yes, you can get a cab in smaller ones
WITHOUT A/C
Hmmm, no thanks, I don't need a sauna today.
And big skid steers are
a. bigger
b. significantly more money.

 

[BarryinMN]

I bought a narrow frame low hour Deere SS this year 33hp.

Has it's own set of small attachments that allows me to do small scale things much faster even load loose materials in the gator box. 1st task is rock picking, it is slower than my ag tractor but I can see the rock bucket edge & leave the topsoil in the field.

It turns out to have the same 3 cyl Yanmar engine as the gator & lawnmower.

Made the irritating hydro whine noise go away by adding a roof mount radio with headset.

 

[mjarrels]

All the dairy farms around here use to have smaller utility "barnyard" tractors and now all use skid steers.

marl

 

[_RaT_]

After operating skidsteers for years, I would probably never purchase one once I drove a tracksteer. No comparison. Far less ground disturbance, stability, traction and the ability to work in areas that would stop a skid steer in seconds. The ground loading is usually less then 5 psi. The next closest thing to a skid steer will be a tractor with HST.

 

[familyman]

RaT beat me to it.
A mini trackloader looks like the way to go. ASV and Cat use the same undercarriage, which is claimed to have the lightest footprint in the industry. These all-rubber units are not supposed to last long in rocky soils (ie., real dirt work) but might fit the bill for you. I've read (here) that sitework contractors are not liking the short lifespan of these rubber tracks (due to use in rocky conditions) and many are hitting the used market cheap. Maybe give the manure biz time to grow, then re-evaluate your needs? I've run skidsteers on my jobsites and implement swaps are rediculously fast, and so are the machines. If it weren't for the cost (no disposable income laying around), I'd swap to skid/tracksteer myself now.
How big is a stall? That could limit your choices. What kind of turning/turnaround space is there in the horse barns?
By the way, what do you do with the manure?

 

[LoneCowboy]

for the first 250 tons, i've got a guy who wants it to spread on his, so that's easy
After that I take it to the local rock/dirt place who basically turn it into compost. You have to pay, but not much.

Guys, tracked skid steers are BIG money
We're comparing 25/30k machines of the same ilk.
Believe it or not, I'm not made of money.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Believe it or not, I'm not made of money.

Well, if you woulda a took that $400......

I tried a skid steer on the farm for a couple years, (used Bobcat) but always prefered a small utility tractor with a rear blade and front end loader for handling manure. But then again, I'm ANCIENT according to our "Dougster". The way I look at it, use what you have until it just doesn't work. It may be slower, but it's PAID FOR. I used a 3000 Ford gasser with a gravity dump bucket Kelley loader mostly. Talk about slow!

 

[dynasim]

I am not so sure that a hst 45 hp tractor(in particular, the NH, which has the stick mounted dual speed control) would be much slower than a skidsteer. It is less maneuverable, but not much slower. Also, tractors have better reach, and more traction(in my opinion) than skidsteers, which can be important for manure hauling(in the abscence of concrete pads).

The price of a TC45DA+loader+cab is about 30K.


Chris

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Stay with the compact for now, you can still use all your current implements. If the 2 of you are going to continue to be working, then the 3rd tractor sure makes sense. Always have a backup, then you continue to provide good on time service. You could go with a power shuttle, then you don't have to use the clutch, but you still have the gears for your other work.

Just more stuff too think about.

 

[_RaT_]

I am not so sure that a hst 45 hp tractor(in particular, the NH, which has the stick mounted dual speed control) would be much slower than a skidsteer. It is less maneuverable, but not much slower. Also, tractors have better reach, and more traction(in my opinion) than skidsteers, which can be important for manure hauling(in the abscence of concrete pads).

The price of a TC45DA+loader+cab is about 30K.


Chris

Chris, I am quite sure it would blow it away. When it comes to moving material, there simply is very little comparision between a skidsteer and a compact or for that matter, a non compact. Don't get me wrong, I loved all my compacts, but I surely know the difference.

 

[dynasim]

I was that the skid steer advantages for manure(low density/easy to pickup) loading on the backs of spreaders/trucks aren't nearly as great as they are for moving dirt around.

It is very likely I am wrong. I did it 20 years ago with a gear tractor in 12" deep slop and viscous mud, and equipment capability has probably changed.

Chris

 

[hosejockey2002]

The tracked skid loaders are very fast, powerful and quite versatile with the attachments you can get for them, but then you are dealing with an undercarriage that, like a dozer has a relatively short lifespan (1000 hr. range) that is pretty expensive to renew. You mentioned a HST tractor being faster for loader work. If you are doing lots of loader work, HST is the way to go. I just switched from gear to HST and I can't beleive how much faster the machine is.

 

[_RaT_]

I was that the skid steer advantages for manure(low density/easy to pickup) loading on the backs of spreaders/trucks aren't nearly as great as they are for moving dirt around.

It is very likely I am wrong. I did it 20 years ago with a gear tractor in 12" deep slop and viscous mud, and equipment capability has probably changed.

Chris

Chris, skid steers have really changed. For one, they are all pilot control now.

 

[mikeyd]

I have a rubber tracked Bobcat and a L5030 tractor with FEL. The skidsteer will run circles around the tractor for bucket work. IMO there is no comparison. You don't have to get the dozer tracks for the skidsteer, you can get the all rubber tracks that go over the tires like I have. Very little ground impact and they last longer than the dozer tracks. I have the goodyear system, although there are other manufactures.

 

[candersen10]

I have a John Deere CT332 which is the biggest tracked skid-steer in the business, as well as a TN75 with a loader, and a Kubota 4630 with a loader. The Deere will lift 4 times the amount of the TN75/Kubota, and will maneuver far better. If I were you, I would look for a used wheeled skid-steer, preferably a Deere(best lifting capacity of the machines) or older bobcat (the newer ones are supposed to be less reliable). Stay away from tracks unless you really need alot of stability and traction, also, don't even look at any used Caterpillar or ASV with tracks. I had a CAT 257 which is one of their smaller tracked machines and it was a very poor deal. The tracks are simply too expensive to replace. Before my CAT I had a Bobcat 763 which I purchased for 16 grand, used for three years, and sold for 15 grand. If you want to do alot of loader work, especially in smaller enclosed areas, nothing beats a skid-steer.