Shopping advice CTL vs TLB

[two_bit_score]

I suggest you look into purchasing with an open mind meaning keeping your options open, look for the best bang for your buck. I would not decide today what to buy rather see what is available and get a feel for the market.

jenkinsph, it's good to see you posting. You were one of the first to give me advice on a grapple when I joined TBN back in 2008. You and a guy named IslandTractor were posting a lot back then. I tried to soak up as much as I could but Ive still got a ways to go. Good to see you posting and hope to see you chime in more on these threads.

 

[D&D]

Those machines are like $200k. Why would anyone want one at that price when you could buy a new skid steer and mini x cheaper?

You can pick up a 6 series for ~125k. They are more functional combining the best of both. It is a CTL and an excavator.

 

[D&D]

Very helpful @jenkinsph This is how I'm thinking about it. Looking for used in an area near me with an open mind.


The trade off seems to be flexibility of PTO/3PH and precision vs. power, weight, and hydraulic flow. But it sounds like you have all the hydraulic power you need with the lighter machines.

Plenty to think about. Thanks for the advice.

some misconceptions here. Some of the larger tlb’s the hoe is removable, however it’s more on a model by model scale. 30 minutes to switch from hoe to 3 point lift, not gonna happen. No aux pto, one would have to be fabed up if really needed.
I’m not a fan of the Cat 4 series, they’re too heavy and the wheel base is too short. IME, they are easy to swamp. JD 4 and up series are pretty heavy for woods work too.
This leads down to the JD 3 series and Case 580’s (4wd, absolutely extendahoe a +) being ok choices for the tasks given. Parts support for both brands is usually very good. Now finding one with a front q/a, front remote hydraulics, hyd thumb and stick hyd remotes? Not very good odds. I would expect to spend between 5-10K to add all of them. She’ll be a heckuva helper then.

 

[matt777]

Thanks @D&D for the summary. This is what I have narrowed it down to as well. If I expect to spend 5-10k on upgrades, looking for a used machine, what would you suggest I aim to spend for the equipment? @rScotty suggests 50% of new, and find a seller by networking, not public listings.

New, a 310 seems to be about $150k, which would put it at $75k for a good used one, but I see a lot of public listings for $35-50k, but these often have higher hours. Amazing to see a few from '90s or even '80s.

@rScotty, possibly prices have increased in recent years, and a 2015 310 would have only been about $100k new.

So at this point I'm just narrowing down a strategy for age/hours/price range, and how to find a seller.

 

[rScotty]

Thanks @D&D for the summary. This is what I have narrowed it down to as well. If I expect to spend 5-10k on upgrades, looking for a used machine, what would you suggest I aim to spend for the equipment? @rScotty suggests 50% of new, and find a seller by networking, not public listings.

New, a 310 seems to be about $150k, which would put it at $75k for a good used one, but I see a lot of public listings for $35-50k, but these often have higher hours. Amazing to see a few from '90s or even '80s.

@rScotty, possibly prices have increased in recent years, and a 2015 310 would have only been about $100k new.

So at this point I'm just narrowing down a strategy for age/hours/price range, and how to find a seller.

When I bought our 310SG in 2014, new basic JD 310s were going for about $120K. Ten year old machines with over 5000 hours -some well over - were going for around $35 to $40K and most were beat. There were also a number of machines with 2900 to 4000 hours because apparently that is when the big contractors trade theirs in. Those were at the dealer for around $55 to $65K depending on whatevers.

The big option is a thumb. Nobody is going to add an extenda-hoe... nor should they. A thumb and the hydraulic control is about $12K last I checked a few years ago. Remote hydraulics are half that again. Throw in a QA, oil & filter change and new batteries (2) and you've just spent $20K.
That is why you don't add other options right away. Use it a few years to see if it is a good one. If so, you can add options then. Did I say get a thumb regardless?? It's your only back.

Right after buying ours, I was also offered a mid-90s JD310E 4wd, extenda-hoe, & cab for $65K. 600 hrs. That model was the last of manual 4 speed & foot clutch models without any emissions or engine computer. The Deere dealer was selling it for an ex-employee who kept it - garaged- at his mountain home. If I had known then what I do now.... But the other lesson is that unicorns do exist.

Older 2wd models such as the 310Ds and 310Es can be found for under $20K - sometimes well under. On those, condition is everything. With NEW rear tires, a heavy TLB like the 310D can be used in our soil. They do slide around, and can be dangerous going downhill. But for the price it becomes $$ vs risk.

Case 580s are 5 to 10 grand less expensive than JDs, and nothing wrong with them. They do tend to be oriented more toward owner maintainability. Maybe that hurts the price, though I'd call it a bonus.
rScotty

 

[D&D]

Thanks @D&D for the summary. This is what I have narrowed it down to as well. If I expect to spend 5-10k on upgrades, looking for a used machine, what would you suggest I aim to spend for the equipment? @rScotty suggests 50% of new, and find a seller by networking, not public listings.

New, a 310 seems to be about $150k, which would put it at $75k for a good used one, but I see a lot of public listings for $35-50k, but these often have higher hours. Amazing to see a few from '90s or even '80s.

@rScotty, possibly prices have increased in recent years, and a 2015 310 would have only been about $100k new.

So at this point I'm just narrowing down a strategy for age/hours/price range, and how to find a seller.

Scotty pretty much nailed it, I was saying 5-10 for me to do the upgrades and I would source most all of my hydraulic valves and hardware from scrap yard finds. The 580’s may be more “farmer“ oriented, never really thought of it that way . They are decent, well built though. Look around your area and see which one might get better parts and labor (if needed) support. I would be happy with either brand.
Price really depends on how much you will really use it and how long you really plan to keep it. A mechanics special or ready to work are 2 different animals. We have work stuff that is expected to perform 100%, right now and drop big bucks when it isn’t because downtime is not paying the bills. We also have “farm” stuff that isn’t depended on daily but really handy to have around. All of them use lots of grease and fuel. I’d expect from what you think you want to spend a minimum of 35 on a decent machine.
Maybe rent one for a month and see how it really works out vs expectations.

‘Just because you made me look , I found what I said you probably wouldn’t Hours are high, 2014 DEERE 310SK For Sale in Phillipston, Massachusetts

 

[4570Man]

Thanks @D&D for the summary. This is what I have narrowed it down to as well. If I expect to spend 5-10k on upgrades, looking for a used machine, what would you suggest I aim to spend for the equipment? @rScotty suggests 50% of new, and find a seller by networking, not public listings.

New, a 310 seems to be about $150k, which would put it at $75k for a good used one, but I see a lot of public listings for $35-50k, but these often have higher hours. Amazing to see a few from '90s or even '80s.

@rScotty, possibly prices have increased in recent years, and a 2015 310 would have only been about $100k new.

So at this point I'm just narrowing down a strategy for age/hours/price range, and how to find a seller.

I can’t see paying $75k for a backhoe. They’re an appealing solution at 20k but if you want to spend 75 throw in a few more coins for a skid steer and mini x and you’ll be way better off. I paid $40 or maybe 44k for the first 75-2 skid steer I had and 35k for the mini x that I still have. Both machines have cabs with heat/ac, the skid steer has a quick connect bucket obviously and a power latch on the coupler. The mini x has a quick attach bucket and a hydraulic thumb. The backhoe I had was lacking all of those options that makes a substantial difference in the work that can be done.

 

[matt777]

Very helpful discussion @D&D, @rScotty

At this point I'm probably going to "know it when I see it", after all this useful advice. And I might as well introduce myself to the local shops. At least I have a good idea what I'm looking for so it's worth taking my contact info.

The Phillipston, Mass. listing raises another point I hoped to cover: How far from home should I be looking? I imagine I would pay $5 - 10k to get someone to transport a machine from Mass, unlikely to be worth it.

 

[D&D]

Very helpful discussion @D&D, @rScotty

At this point I'm probably going to "know it when I see it", after all this useful advice. And I might as well introduce myself to the local shops. At least I have a good idea what I'm looking for so it's worth taking my contact info.

The Phillipston, Mass. listing raises another point I hoped to cover: How far from home should I be looking? I imagine I would pay $5 - 10k to get someone to transport a machine from Mass, unlikely to be worth it.

If freight was a budget concern, what’s the average rate per mile now. So, at say $3/per and my budget is 3k - my personal fuel gives me about a 750-800 mile radius? Really depends on you. Are you comfortable assessing the equipment yourself or pay for a pre-purchase inspection? Maintenance records, oil samples ? For me, large purchases I want to touch, feel and try before I commit.