Buying Advice Seeking advice on a first tractor

   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #1  

Emerson76

New member
Joined
Jul 20, 2017
Messages
9
Location
Jackson County, NC
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None
Greetings. I've been reading through these forums for awhile now, and a lot of them sure have been helpful.

I'm getting close to buying my first tractor, and I'm stuck. Hoping for some advice, especially from you folks who operate your machines in the mountains. I'm going to attempt to give you as much relevant information as I can, but let me know if you have any questions.

We bought my in-laws' home almost 2 years ago. Most of the property is wooded, and a lot of it will stay that way. My tractor will ideally help me with road maintenance, general landscaping/clearing chores, and firewood work. The yard itself isn't very big, and I don't mind using my old push mower to keep up with it, so I am planning on the tractor's only mowing duty to be rough brush mowing. It will eventually be a total of 2-3 acres of rough mowing.

Road Maintenance. There is a private road that we share with our neighbor, about .8 miles long, and 2/3 of it (the steepest part) is paved. The rest of it is gravel, and has some pretty serious washout. I can still get up and down it in a car, but I have to watch what I'm doing to keep the oil pan intact. This part of the road is probably 200-300 yards long. About half of it is actually relatively flat, and the other half has a moderate slope. The drainage ditch on one side of the road silts up, and I'll need to be able to re-form the ditch and remove excess silt.

General Landscaping/Clearing Chores. Most of the yard and wooded areas that I plan on reclaiming from the woods are sloped. Most of it isn't terribly steep, and the parts that are can be avoided in most cases. There are lots of rocks of varying size, many of which will have to be moved prior to operating a rotary cutter. Some of them are the size of cars, and will stay right where they are. I don't mind cutting around them if they're too big to move. There is also brush to mow and remove, and several downed trees in the wooded areas that will have to be removed, or possibly burned where they lay.

Firewood Work. I mainly want the tractor to help me drag pieces of trees out of the woods, and lift the rounds up to my log splitter. I had a back injury some time ago, and that bending and lifting just ain't as much fun as it used to be. I used to put up a lot more firewood for family members, but these days I'm only making what we need to heat our house, which is generally only 2 or 3 cords a year.

Eventually, part of the cleared area will become an orchard. The garden seems to get a little bigger every year, so eventually, I'd like to get a small rotary tiller to replace stand-alone tiller I currently wrestle.

I live in a pretty rural area, and tractor dealerships are few. By far, Kubota has the most extensive dealer network here. There's one about 30 minutes away, another about 50 minutes away, and a third about 70 minutes away. The closest John Deere tractor dealer is about 70 minutes away. The closest dealer to me is a small Massey Ferguson dealer in the county seat. The next closest Massey dealer is a long way off, and that worries me, because as tiny as the Massey dealer is, I doubt it will exist anymore after the current owner hangs it up. There are no other dealerships of any kind any closer than the ones I've mentioned. The used tractor market around here is tight. Not many machines, and people seem to want too much for them.

So, I'm mostly looking at Kubota. 4WD BX, B, and perhaps L series. I've studied the literature, gone to the dealerships, and stared at machines. Even tried out a BX in the (flat) parking lot. That's informative, I guess, but without much tractor experience, it doesn't really translate into my reality. I'm not as worried about chores taking awhile as I am about buying a fancy new machine that's too easy to tip over on hilly, uneven terrain. The ground clearance advantage of the B2301 over the BX machines sounds great for my clearing and bush hogging, but does that come with a real loss in stability? The L2501 is much heavier, which I would imagine would tend to help with stability on slopes, but I think it's got to be too big for my needs, and maneuverability in woods has to be less than with the B series. I've read on these forums that the BX will do just about anything that a bigger tractor will do, but it will take longer. That's fine with me, but I don't want to abuse the little thing.

My thinking, which has become pretty much circular, is this: BX will be a whole lot more help than I have now, and I'll figure out how to make its limited FEL lift strength get the jobs done. That's my solution. But wait... the B2301 is only a tiny bit more expensive, and it has some definite advantages in terms of lift strength and ground clearance, and I bet that 3-range transmission will help with my terrain. That's the way I'll go. But wait... the L2501 is 1000 pounds or so heavier, and so should be more stable and plenty strong. But I'm not working with THAT much acreage, and some of the areas I'm working in are pretty tight. And the L2501 is more expensive than my budget will comfortably accommodate. Once the clearing is done and the road is squared back up, that machine will just be overkill for maintaining what I have, and the maneuverability won't be what the BX or B will give me. So back to the BX....

Any suggestions? I'd be particularly interested in the perspectives of those of you who run B's an BX's in mountainous areas. Thanks.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #2  
Reading through your post I kept thinking "he should get an L". My neighbor has a BX with a backhoe and although it's handy, it's light weight with minimal ground clearance and the small wheels fall into every hole in the ground. Pulling rocks out of the ground with the backhoe, it just drags the tractor around because it doesn't have enough weight.

The road grading, logging, tilling, moving of rocks, and steep terrain favor a machine with more weight and stability. To be honest, I'm not very familiar with the B line of Kubota's. I just think that if you're going to do it, do it right, and get something that's going to accomplish all your tasks. The L's aren't very big once you get it home and get used to it.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#3  
Thanks, Tractorable. My favorite of the local Kubota dealers told me he thought the L would be best for me too. And the small wheels being a problem with holes in the ground is something I hadn't thought of, but can definitely see that being an issue at my place. There are already holes, and as I remove rocks, there will inevitably be even more holes. Maybe I can find a little more cash to put in the tractor fund.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #4  
I suggest an L2501/HST if that fits in the budget. It has a 100.4 cubic inch engine, generating 25-horsepower. This is a larger displacement engine, generating more torque in a wider range than the 'B's and does not have the complex Tier IV emission controls of tractors +26-horsepower. At 2,623 pounds, bare tractor, it will be more stable than the others when you lift logs with the FEL.

As you probably know, having the dealer fill the rear tires 3/4 with liquid lowers the center of gravity of the tractor, also improving stability on hills.

If you are really concerned about stability, wheel spacers are available for about $300 which will increase the width 4". Four inches makes a considerable difference. (However, starting with a wider L2501, rather than a narrower 'B' should be your first decision.)
LINK: Bro-Tek

The L2501 is 55" wide with R1/ag tires, probably 59" wide with R4/industrial tires. I suggest you buy a stick of 1-1/4" diameter, Schedule 40 PVC pipe, then cut it to 59". Walk around your work area, storage area, woodland and gates and see if L2501 59" width "fits". Operationally, you will adapt to this size tractor in about eight hours.

You will certainly want an FEL (front end loader), which works best with 4-WD and R4/industrial tires, which support the weight of a filled loader, being wider and of 6-ply construction.

For your woods work and road work I suggest a Ratchet Rake bucket attachment, about my favorite tractor tool. Nothing better for tearing out brush, great for prizing out imbedded rocks, light grading and moving small amounts of dirt; pretty good in the garden.
VIDEO: RATCHET RAKE - YouTube

Two driveway implements to consider are a Box Blade (for dirt) and/or a Land Plane Grading Scraper. (for gravel)
 

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   / Seeking advice on a first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#5  
Thanks for the input, jeff9366. That does bring up a point that's important to me: staying under the Tier IV emission controls. I'm low-tech, and I prefer more primitive machines, by and large. Heck, if Ford 8N's came in 4WD, that's what I'd probably want... but I know I need 4WD. I'd probably also appreciate the HST over gears (though I prefer manual transmissions in cars and trucks), and I know my wife would do better with HST.

Definitely getting a FEL. I will also make sure to get the rear tires filled. Those wheel spacers are an interesting idea too.

The great thing about getting my tractor now, as opposed to a couple more years down the road, is that I will build my gates and storage to accommodate the tractor, instead of having to find a tractor that will fit the spaces. Most of that stuff doesn't exist yet.

Anybody want to advocate the B2301/2601 or the BX2380/2680? I have to admit that the L2501 turns me on more, but the price tag on the smaller ones is obviously easier to manage.

Just looked at the Ratchet Rake. That looks HANDY!
 
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   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #6  
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #7  
The only issue I could see with the L2501 is its ability to power a 5ft bush hog. What's the PTO horsepower? Maybe 19-20? It is a large displacement engine for its horsepower so maybe it has plenty of torque to power one.

Can some one chime in on the L2501's ability to power a 5ft bush hog?
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #8  
Thanks for the input, jeff9366. That does bring up a point that's important to me: staying under the Tier IV emission controls. I'm low-tech, and I prefer more primitive machines, by and large. Heck, if Ford 8N's came in 4WD, that's what I'd probably want... but I know I need 4WD. I'd probably also appreciate the HST over gears (though I prefer manual transmissions in cars and trucks), and I know my wife would do better with HST.

Definitely getting a FEL. I will also make sure to get the rear tires filled. Those wheel spacers are an interesting idea too.

The great thing about getting my tractor now, as opposed to a couple more years down the road, is that I will build my gates and storage to accommodate the tractor, instead of having to find a tractor that will fit the spaces. Most of that stuff doesn't exist yet.

Anybody want to advocate the B2301/2601 or the BX2380/2680? I have to admit that the L2501 turns me on more, but the price tag on the smaller ones is obviously easier to manage.

Just looked at the Ratchet Rake. That looks HANDY!

Mmm A model N in 4 wheel drive...


How about a Ford 3910 or 3930 with loader used , strong tractors with a low center of gravity and lots of low end torque to _ and a whole lot more tractor than a B Kubota and for a lot less money,

but it won't have a warranty or be new.

Here is an old vid of 1 for sale,

Ford tractor 391 4x4 for sale - YouTube



would have dug a lot better with some weight on the 3 point

Just something to consider if you aren't opposed to a good used tractor.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#9  
Mmm A model N in 4 wheel drive...


How about a Ford 3910 or 3930 with loader used , strong tractors with a low center of gravity and lots of low end torque to _ and a whole lot more tractor than a B Kubota and for a lot less money,

but it won't have a warranty or be new.

Here is an old vid of 1 for sale,

Ford tractor 391 4x4 for sale - YouTube



would have dug a lot better with some weight on the 3 point

Just something to consider if you aren't opposed to a good used tractor.

Nice tractor. I'm not at all opposed to a used machine. A new one will be a used machine five minutes after I take delivery of it anyway. That Ford would do it for me just fine, I think, and I'll keep my eyes peeled for one.

The trouble around here is that there aren't many used tractors for sale. People just tend to keep them forever. For example, even if I hit "include nearby areas" on Craigslist in my local area, there are zero 4WD Ford tractors.

I also do not have a trailer, nor a truck, big enough to tow much of a tractor (4 cylinder Tacoma), so buying used can be tricky. This will also be my first tractor, and I don't have any experience working on diesels, so that's probably a factor.
 
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   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #10  
After reading the links in post 6 and doing some additional research it appears that most folks with L2501's are content with its 19hp PTO and 70lb/ft of torque to push a 5ft rotary cutter.

The reason I questioned it is because last week I almost stalled out my 1952 8N multiple times pushing through thick grass uphill with a 5ft Bush Hog Squealer. I resolved the issue by turning around and mowing downhill, haha.

The 8N has 20cu/in more displacement, 20lb/ft more torque, and 2 more hp than the L2501, and weighs about the same. However, the 8N is geared high and you can't keep the throttle up and go slow enough even in first gear when cutting through thick grass.

HST would solve that, obviously.
 
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   / Seeking advice on a first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#11  
This is pretty amazing to me. It's hard for me to even imagine cutting a 5 foot wide swath through the brush while remaining seated.

My current solution is me and my Redmax BC4401DW brush cutter, which has been a pretty awesome machine. However, it does leave me pretty exposed to the copperheads, yellow jackets, and poison ivy in that mess down there, and it does also leave me pretty wiped out after some hours operating it.

It does sound like folks are satisfied with the L2501's PTO strength for a 5' rotary cutter (5 FEET!?!?). Truth be told, I could drop it back to a 4' rotary cutter, and I reckon it would still take a lot to wipe the grin off my face. Even if I had to cut it three times, I'd still be ahead.

I really appreciate the advice I've gotten here so far, and I can use all I can get. This is just what I've needed. Thanks, guys.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #12  
I think Jeff has you pointed in the right direction here. Your description mentions moving rocks of various sizes and bringing logs out of the woods for firewood and general cleanup. That's heavy work and you want something large and heavy enough to stand up to rugged work like that, so it's really more than a BX or B is ideally suited for. Moreover, the greater weight, larger tires and larger overall dimensions will lend a measure of safety in handling heavy or bulky objects on uneven terrain.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #13  
This is pretty amazing to me. It's hard for me to even imagine cutting a 5 foot wide swath through the brush while remaining seated.

My current solution is me and my Redmax BC4401DW brush cutter, which has been a pretty awesome machine. However, it does leave me pretty exposed to the copperheads, yellow jackets, and poison ivy in that mess down there, and it does also leave me pretty wiped out after some hours operating it.

It does sound like folks are satisfied with the L2501's PTO strength for a 5' rotary cutter (5 FEET!?!?). Truth be told, I could drop it back to a 4' rotary cutter, and I reckon it would still take a lot to wipe the grin off my face. Even if I had to cut it three times, I'd still be ahead.

I really appreciate the advice I've gotten here so far, and I can use all I can get. This is just what I've needed. Thanks, guys.

A light to medium duty 5ft rotary cutter would be a good fit for the L2501 and would cover your wheel tracks. Just be sure to get the HST for infinite speed control and ease of use.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #14  
I had a John Deere 850 - 25hp, 19 PTO hp, and could cut any brush and high grass that I wanted to with it.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #15  
I have a L2501DT and it handles a 5' mower fine. Never occurred to me it would be an issue.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #17  
Emerson76,

I read your opening post 3 times before responding because others are hearing things you said that I didn't read. . . so I read it and read it and read it again :)

I own a SCUT (a Massey gc1715 and I love it). I have steep slopes and sidehills. But I see your pro and cons on a what you think of SCUTs. Personally it seems a bX2680 would offer many things for you . . . But not the ground clearance I think you would benefit from.

At the same token an L model doesn't seem like it fits your long term needs - it fits more your very short term needs and then ?????? Adding a 1000 pounds more tractor doesn't help your slope issues . . . But a better "footprint per pound" does. So a B size frame with modest wheel spacers added gives you both a nimbleness but better ground clearance and better footprint per pound. Ask youself - do you want an engine to give you useful power with implements or one you require to lug that extra 1,000 pounds up the hill ?

Now in reading your post several times I didn't see you say you wanted to take logs - you said take out parts of trees that are bad or for modest firewood. . . But let's be honest. . . 2 or 3 cords of firewood per year is not some big undertaking for any of the tractor sizes you are considering. My 82 year old dad did 10 cords each and every year with far less equipment.

My point is that no tractor size does everything. So I think you want something that does the highest percentage of your goals well, efficiently and without barriers.

Most will suggest you get an L model, and I'd suggest you consider a B model because of its combined strengths for your stated needs.

Here's an example. Sheetrockers come in all shapes and sizes but big bulky guys aren't the favored choices even though the idea of "big is always better" might be "assumed". Small little Hercules built guys aren't either. You want a "reasonably" tall lanky tawny guy for sheetrocking because they have both leverage and maneuverability in equal combination.

You don't need big bulk muscles for sheetrocking or for completing the list of goals in your first post for a tractor . . and an L model is big bulk muscles that could come in handy in the very beginning and soon are too short on maneuverability or efficiency to handle hills and slopes. My Massey scut goes places compact owners have told me they wouldn't feel real comfortable on with their units. But a BX or my Massey are a little short on the ground clearance you likely will regularly desire.

Finally is the issue of money. Don't buy a tractor and then have no money for implements which is what you stated would be an issue with an L. And don't buy too small and constantly "make do" with it. My Scut is a little dynamo of power for my uses - its not weak and I do alot of things with it in all seasons - that would be compromised if I had a bigger size. In other words get a units that fits your needs and you can "hold your head high" using it ALMOST ALL THE TIME.

I'd suggest a B sized frame and a 25 HP engine (whatever size doesn't need tier 4 Issues so 25.9999 HP or whatever lol. Make it convenient and comfortable to own.

Just my 2 cents.

Also as an aside. Many kubota dealers in our area added Massey when they got the chance lol. My dealer used to be just Kubota and now he carries the full line of each. :)
 
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   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #18  
Just looked at the Ratchet Rake. That looks HANDY!

Ratchet Rake LINK: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/375397-ratchet-rake-today.html

You can order a Ratchet Rake from the T-B-N STORE, button at top of this page. TSC sells the Ratchet Rake too but the stores are erratic with inventory.



As you are in North Carolina, you should become familiar with everytfhingattachments.com, a T-B-N advertiser. ETA's videos are the best. I have purchased fire implements from them. You can pick up at the factory if desired, with advance notice. They will credit you a few $$ for saving them freight.
Tractor Attachments - Quality Attachments for Sale Online - Everything Attachments
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor
  • Thread Starter
#19  
AxleHub,

Thanks for the comments. I think you make some good points. I do tend to think of the work I need to do in two phases: the first phase being to reestablish the property, fix the road, and rid myself of a lot of accumulated deadfall; the second phase being to maintain the property. Running the rotary cutter, keeping the road maintained, removing fallen or dead trees, etc. Phase 2 will require less of a machine than phase 1 might benefit from.

My father-in-law did his best with the property, but he didn't have a tractor, he was a full-time college professor, and he weighs about 125 pounds or so. Even hiring help, things got away from him. He and my mother-in-law were also content with more woods and a smaller yard, especially as they got older. I want to beat the forest back in every direction, plant more long-term food crops, like apple trees and blueberry bushes, have a larger garden, and give those snakes a lot less cover than they currently have (I killed 6 copperheads in my yard last summer).

You're right about the trees and firewood. I didn't say that I aim to remove entire logs. I can take them in smaller pieces than, say, a 12' log. That said, I do dream of someday building a wood shop/small barn, and timber framing it with some of the many poplar trees on the property. A good friend of mine found a used set of Gransfors Bruks log construction tools (broad axes, adzes, and a froe), and gave them to me for my birthday this year. That just about requires me to do something with them, right? A tractor would be necessary to skid the logs, but the log building is a far-off dream that I may never get around to, which is why I didn't even mention it in my initial post.

Any size tractor would be more than adequate for my firewood work. It's hardly a chore anymore. Moving and lifting the larger rounds up onto my log splitter is the extent of my tractor needs there, and I only need that help because of my back injury.

I see you have a Massey GC 1715. I actually went and looked at the Massey GC1720. Even drove one around the parking lot. I really liked it. I actually preferred it to the Kubota BX23S. But my Massey dealer is really small, his price was more than the Kubota, and Kubota's 0% financing is pretty attractive. At the beginning of my search, I was dead set on having a backhoe with my tractor, to help me dig out the drainage ditches and culvert entrances on the road, but backhoes are really expensive attachments. I've made my peace with just saving up digging jobs and renting a mini excavator occasionally instead. The ground clearance on the SCUTs worries me for my applications. Otherwise, I like them.

I'll go back to the Kubota dealer tomorrow morning and look closely at the B's and L's again, after getting all this advice from this forum. I'm sure I'll see things I haven't seen before, just because I didn't know to look.

Thanks for the input. I'll keep you posted.
 
   / Seeking advice on a first tractor #20  
Remember, the tractors shrink when they get on your property.
 

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