PTO Generators: Winco

[jgh]

20050924

I bought several pumps on a silly whim several years ago from Northern and your Pump 2 was one of them. The aggravation is not worth the cheap price. Skip it!

Cannot comment on the others but I wound up with a real one (ie, couple hundred$, service station type) for the 55 gal drum I am going to equip.

Northern has some in betweens, check 'em out.

Watch shelf life on diesel, specially in that NC heat, the stuff does go bad, even with preservatives. I would consider propane if you go standalone.

One thing also to consider--do you want to be hooking up a PTO generator in a storm?

Just food for thought, not meaning to be a party pooper,

Jim

 

[Soundguy]

240vac at 50a is right at 12kw .. ANd yes.. you would need either a load trnasfer switch, or need to isolate your main breaker so you don't backfeed the grid..

Your hookup cableing needs to be of sufficient size for it's length of run so that you don't have a power drop.

Soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( This one? Pump 1Or this one?Pump 2Or this one?
Pump 3
)</font>

Pump 2 is silly for anything but a 1-2 gallon lawnmower.. I had one and it worked your arm off to fill a 5g bucket..

I have the 19$ #1 pump.. works good.. I would have got the 39$ one if i would have seen it... etc.

Soundguy

 

[John_Mc]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( 240vac at 50a is right at 12kw .. ANd yes.. you would need either a load trnasfer switch, or need to isolate your main breaker so you don't backfeed the grid. )</font>

You're right. I should have been more clear in my response that he didn't need to do anything special to use a 240V generator. I was focusing on the fact that he shouldn't have to do any other rewiring of his house or get a step-down transformer or the like. I was assuming he knew that you can't just plug it in and go (never assume...). It does need to be properly isolated from the utility line. Of course this is true regardless of whether he has a 120 or 240 v generator. What I should have said was that there is nothing ADDITIONAL to do for a 240 as compared to a 120 v hookup.

I've got the mechanical interlock on my main circuit breaker, so I can't hook my generator up to the house without first disconnecting from the grid. Works great... I can use my regular panel to deactivate whatever circuits I don't want powered while running on the generator.

The only thing I want to add is some sort of indicator to tell me when the grid is back on. As it is, the only way I can tell is to disconnect the generator and reconnect to the grid. May something with an indicator light and a momentary contact "push to test" switch that would light up when pressed if the grid was back on. Have you ever seen anything like this?

John Mc

 

[Soundguy]

How about a neon bulb on a push-to-test switch?

Soundguy

 

[kennyd]

Why does it have to be on a switch? Just wire the bulb off the in side of the main breaker, the bulb could be mounted right in the cover of the panel. I have seen this in alot of commercial applications.

 

[Charolais]

http://www.mastersalesonline.com/appchart.html

And this is the one I bought. I made the frame(3 pt. hitch) and before I bolted it down I set it up so I could use the PTO shaft that came with my Caroni tiller.
http://www.mastersalesonline.com/voltmaster/pto15-12.html

 

[Soundguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Why does it have to be on a switch )</font>

Doesn't have to be... just depends on if you want the neon bulb to be energized 100% of the time when the utility is on.

Soundguy

 

[dmccarty]

John_Mc,

Thanks. At least I'm getting the requirements down.

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Soundguy,

The electrician and I have dicussed things but I have been trying to figure out how many watts/generator we are going to use. I just want a simple switch to disconnect me from the grid. I dont' want fancy circuits that I see on some switches. I want to be able to manage things in the circuit breaker box in the house. I would like a light fixture of some kind on the grid side of the switch so I know when power is back on.

The funny thing is that now we are thinking of using a DR mower to run the generator. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif They have a 6000/5500 watt generator for their mowers. We need one of their mowers anyway, soooo.... The generator is 600-700 dollars which is the least expensive option we have seen even though 5500 watts seems to be the minimum we need to power the hot water heater....

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Ahhh,

I used a pump similar to the Number 2 model when I was a teenager. The boss had me fill up the trucks and tractor all the time. Sure took ALOT of time but I was paid by the hour, cheap, and had/have a weak mind but I built big muscles. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Sooo, if you have cheap labor pump #2 works.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Later,
Dan

 

[Westonium]

Just thought I'd post this, since some people might be interested.

Certainly more expensive than a PTO gen, but probably cheaper than another tractor.

http://www.hardydiesel.com/gen/23kw.html
(it's selling for ~$4800ish when I looked)

I also saw a 8KW for about half that.

I already have a PTO gen, so I'm just working on getting the transfer switch stuff squared. Neighbor is doing likewise, and we are going halvsies on a 320 gal tank.

 

[John_Mc]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( The funny thing is that now we are thinking of using a DR mower to run the generator. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif They have a 6000/5500 watt generator for their mowers. We need one of their mowers anyway, soooo.... The generator is 600-700 dollars which is the least expensive option we have seen even though 5500 watts seems to be the minimum we need to power the hot water heater...)</font>

It's about time somebody came up with an idea like that. DR (Country Home Products) is just down the road from us. I had no idea they had the generator option.

How often do you need to run your water heater during a power outage? can you get by with just switching other things off while you heat up a tankfull?

John Mc

 

[John_Mc]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( How about a neon bulb on a push-to-test switch? )</font>

I know I could do it, and do it safely. What I'm wondering is if it's legal to do it without some sort of inspection. Wasn't sure if the regs required something, especially since the power company isn't too nuts about people poking around with the grid side of their main breaker.

John Mc

 

[Soundguy]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( the power company isn't too nuts about people poking around with the grid side of their main breaker.
)</font>

At least in our area, everything past the meter can belongs to the home owner. I'e. it the meter or the overhead( or buried) wireing goes bad.. it is thier fix. If the wire from the meter can to your breaker goes bad.. the homeowner calls an electrician.. etc.

Kinda like the phone company.. everything past the utility side of the Customer access box is on your dime.. etc. Least that's the way i understand it.

Soundguy

 

[dicker]

That is also the way it is here in Ontario.

However, although you pay, you need a permit and a hydro inspection. Or put it this way, you are supposed to.


Richard

 

[dmccarty]

John,

I not sure how often we would have to power the water heater. We just moved into the house in January and have not had an outage. Thankfully. The water heater takes 5500 watts. BUT, that is with two elements. Even with HEAVY water usage I have never seen both elements on. Sooo, I'm guessing that really it only needs 2750 watts if we don't use too much water or let it cool down.

We would just have to turn off everything if the water heater needed all 5500 watts.

I am still researching this stuff but I think DR is going to get the dollars from us. I found a couple of websites that hook generators up to your truck to provide power. On one, the generator was connected via a belt to the engine. Don't like that idea. The other one was hooked up to your tranny PTO if you have one which I do. BUT, hooking up a 12KW generator to a 275 HP engine when 24 HP will do does not seem money wise to me. Don't have a clue what the thing costs either.

So, its looking like DR Time.

Later,
Dan

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Whether it's how the laws are written or just how the laws are enforced, this is how it goes around here...

You can do anything to your side of the meter as long as the power company doesn't have to shut off power. If you schedule the power company to cut your power, you have to have a permit and inspection to turn it back on.

The side effect of this is that some homeowners take some risks with a live power source that they probably shouldn't take.

 

[Inspector507]

Dan,
Take a close look at your water heater. While the nameplate rating may say 5500 watts, you probably have 2 5500 watt elements. The thermostat does not let both elements run at the same time. One heats for a while then the other one kicks in. At least that is my experience with an electric water heater.

Your mileage may differ since I use gas now /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[John_Mc]

I've also seen water heaters where each element has its own thermostat. Usually, one is set lower than the other (I can remember whether upper or lower was set to the higher number... I'm thinking the upper was generally left at 120 deg F, and you set the lower higher if you wanted hottter water ???) If you have two separate thermostats, you could set one very low during a power outage to reduce the chances of it coming on (or disconnect that element entirely to prevent it coming on). This would slow down your recovery time once you used a tank of hot water, however.