Tom_H
Veteran Member
Curt,
You really need to have a very good real estate attorney at that meeting.
Tom
You really need to have a very good real estate attorney at that meeting.
Tom
Proposed Easement Advice (Long)
- Thread starter ultrarunner
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2nstonge
Gold Member
CurlyDave - lots of well reasoned, well thought advice - I want you as my advisor next time something comes up!
-Norm
-Norm
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ultrarunner
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Dave... Lots of great advice and many thanks to all who posted.
The total site, Mom's and the developer's, is hard to describe in words. It encompasses several canyons, creeks, ridges, heavily wooded and in places very rugged with nice vistas... and poison oak!
If construction were to happen, the way Mom's home is situated, she could not see any of it and there would be no construction or new homeowner traffic on her culdesac. Her home is on the far upper edge of the project at an elevation of 525' and the proposed road starts at 450' (On Mom's land) and follows the canyon ridges down to 250' elevation.
I stopped by Mom's after work today and she said two of the developer's partners came by to "Introduce" themselves and leave her with a project map and map from the survey they had done on her property. (Yes, in CA, Surveyors don't need the property owner's permission to do their work... something dating back to the Gold Rush days as I understand...)
The maps look interesting, but as Mom told them, "They are only paper." She also told them if they were at all serious about her land, to put their proposal in writing and she would have "Her" people take a look... and she wished them well.
The total site, Mom's and the developer's, is hard to describe in words. It encompasses several canyons, creeks, ridges, heavily wooded and in places very rugged with nice vistas... and poison oak!
If construction were to happen, the way Mom's home is situated, she could not see any of it and there would be no construction or new homeowner traffic on her culdesac. Her home is on the far upper edge of the project at an elevation of 525' and the proposed road starts at 450' (On Mom's land) and follows the canyon ridges down to 250' elevation.
I stopped by Mom's after work today and she said two of the developer's partners came by to "Introduce" themselves and leave her with a project map and map from the survey they had done on her property. (Yes, in CA, Surveyors don't need the property owner's permission to do their work... something dating back to the Gold Rush days as I understand...)
The maps look interesting, but as Mom told them, "They are only paper." She also told them if they were at all serious about her land, to put their proposal in writing and she would have "Her" people take a look... and she wished them well.
EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
Curt,
I'm wondering if maybe we're worried about the wrong party here. You mom might have more fox in her than we thought. It might be the developers who we should be offering help to!! hahahahaha
I'm enjoying the thread and all the advice your gettng. It's been extremly informative and enlightening. Thanks to you and everyone who's posting. I'm learning allot.
Eddie
I'm wondering if maybe we're worried about the wrong party here. You mom might have more fox in her than we thought. It might be the developers who we should be offering help to!! hahahahaha
I'm enjoying the thread and all the advice your gettng. It's been extremly informative and enlightening. Thanks to you and everyone who's posting. I'm learning allot.
Eddie
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ultrarunner
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Thanks Eddie for the compliment about Mom...
Mom was born and raised on a small family operated Dairy Farm.
It might not apply to this situation, but from an early age I can remember her giving me some words of wisdom that her Father had given her...
"Two farmers got into an argument over a cow. When they could not come to an agreement, they both hired lawyers. In the end, neither farmer ended up with the cow... but the lawyers had steak to eat for the rest of the year."
I can just picture my Grandfather saying this... sounds like something he would have said!
Mom was born and raised on a small family operated Dairy Farm.
It might not apply to this situation, but from an early age I can remember her giving me some words of wisdom that her Father had given her...
"Two farmers got into an argument over a cow. When they could not come to an agreement, they both hired lawyers. In the end, neither farmer ended up with the cow... but the lawyers had steak to eat for the rest of the year."
I can just picture my Grandfather saying this... sounds like something he would have said!
turnkey4099
Elite Member
Just something I saw up thread. It sounds like the developer basically has a landlocked parcel, i.e., no access. In some areas, he can 'force' a right of way to get access. Has to pay for it of course.
Harry K
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ultrarunner
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The only access from a public city street to the developer's 67 acres is a 20' wide by 100' long driveway .
There are also several fire roads/equestrian tail access points that run through multiple private homeowners backyards. The developer has been unable to convince the homeowners association to allow him the right to convert these into roads because his property is outside the association boundaries.
His largest parcel, 30 acres, was in the association until 1948, when the then owners petitioned to have it removed. The developer's lawyers have offered to pay 58 years of homeowners dues, interest and road assessments to be reinstated. So far, the association lawyers have been successful in preventing this.
There are also several fire roads/equestrian tail access points that run through multiple private homeowners backyards. The developer has been unable to convince the homeowners association to allow him the right to convert these into roads because his property is outside the association boundaries.
His largest parcel, 30 acres, was in the association until 1948, when the then owners petitioned to have it removed. The developer's lawyers have offered to pay 58 years of homeowners dues, interest and road assessments to be reinstated. So far, the association lawyers have been successful in preventing this.
OP
ultrarunner
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Thread Update....
The Developer cancelled escrow this week with a simple one line letter stating he is exercising his right under the purchase agreement... nothing more was said, not even a phone call or thank you or a sorry this did not work out.
There was a time when it seemed Mom could not leave home without someone representing the Developer standing at the door. At 73, it all became a bit overwhelming for her... she is not used to being in the spot light. All I can say is what a difference a year makes.
Anyway, she did get an updated survey and map showing the location and type of the several hundred trees on her land as part of cancellation. Every tree has been numbered and tagged with a metal disc as required by the city for any new development project.
Most of the deposit money was spent on Attorney Fees to review and draft documents... Mom is not out of pocket any money... just 18 months of dealing with neighbors, the city and the Developer on land that she was not intending to sell.
In retrospect, my instincts were right. All of the Developers promises did not amount to much of anything and way too much time was spent dealing with them in their attempt to divide off Mom's home from the land they wanted and the constant road alignment changes.
Three neighborhood associations were formed in response to the Development Proposal. It now looks like the Developer is pursuing selling his existing tract of land to the city for parkland or green space offset in exchange for future development rights.
I can see how people, especially older folks can get sucked in. The Developer even had maps drawn showing the new streets named after my family and never missed a Holiday without dropping over a box of Chocolate or a card.
We want to Thank Everyone for their advice... she read everyone's comments.
The Developer cancelled escrow this week with a simple one line letter stating he is exercising his right under the purchase agreement... nothing more was said, not even a phone call or thank you or a sorry this did not work out.
There was a time when it seemed Mom could not leave home without someone representing the Developer standing at the door. At 73, it all became a bit overwhelming for her... she is not used to being in the spot light. All I can say is what a difference a year makes.
Anyway, she did get an updated survey and map showing the location and type of the several hundred trees on her land as part of cancellation. Every tree has been numbered and tagged with a metal disc as required by the city for any new development project.
Most of the deposit money was spent on Attorney Fees to review and draft documents... Mom is not out of pocket any money... just 18 months of dealing with neighbors, the city and the Developer on land that she was not intending to sell.
In retrospect, my instincts were right. All of the Developers promises did not amount to much of anything and way too much time was spent dealing with them in their attempt to divide off Mom's home from the land they wanted and the constant road alignment changes.
Three neighborhood associations were formed in response to the Development Proposal. It now looks like the Developer is pursuing selling his existing tract of land to the city for parkland or green space offset in exchange for future development rights.
I can see how people, especially older folks can get sucked in. The Developer even had maps drawn showing the new streets named after my family and never missed a Holiday without dropping over a box of Chocolate or a card.
We want to Thank Everyone for their advice... she read everyone's comments.
WayneB
Elite Member
Just lots of good advice and reading on this thread. Just hope things have been put to rest and you, your brother and most importantly your Mother have succeeded with respect to your right to ownership and use of private property.
rlk
Gold Member
dmccarty said:
Dan, the problem with your statement is: in North Carolina, the NC Association of Realtors, and the Home Builders Association are so powerful, and have so many friends in the NC Legislature, that they can manipulate the local news media to spin the story such that it looks like they are doing the land owner a favor by having his land taken away from him.
A year or so ago, there was a land owner in Morrisville that had a piece of land a developer needed. The land owner was negotiating in good faith for a fair price for his land. The developer complained to the Morrisville Town Council that the land owner was being difficult to deal with, and wanted too much money for his piece of land. The Morrisville Town Council, in one of their meetings, told the land owner to settle quickly, or they would take his land by eminent domain and he would get very little for it. How's that for your elected officials representing the people who voted them into office?
Also, you probably just witnessed the effect the NCAR and NCHBA had on the transfer tax that was just on the ballot in a few counties. The NCAR and NCHBA spent so much money they were able to get their way by only telling half the truth about the transfer tax.
I'm to the point that I don't trust government at any level to do what's right for the average citizen. The developers and builders give so much money to politicians - why should the politicians care about the average citizen?
Bob
