Property/homeowners Insurance

[ericm979]

My Oregon place is on farm insurance. The agent warned me when I was filling out the forms that a wood stove would cost extra. Turned out to be all of $30!

Our California insurance isn't all that expensive (for California). And we haven't been canceled yet. So many people in my local mountains and in the Sierras have expensive insurance or are on the FAIR plan. I do not understand how we have avoided those. Maybe the insurance company's risk models have data showing us as less of a risk than I think we are. But surely they know that rebuilding costs are $800-1000 sq ft (and that's not for a fancy place, just a decent one).

 

[ultrarunner]

I was in escrow and never gave insurance a second thought until the rejections started and this was 2017

The 2 agents that had all my business each took the address and said no can do…

Then I saw Costco was advertising Insurance so I filled out the detailed online application and rejected so I filed a complaint saying I was redlined due to Oakland location and the response was the stove.

I know two people that never once used the fireplace as in never not once since new and now with the burn bans and prohibition on new wood burning builds it’s highly unlikely but because the homes had chimneys it was a no go not mattering never used.

The home of my dreams was sold and I keep in touch with the current owner and he has had a hell of a time with insurance… Lloyds of London at one time and now a split policy with State for fire and another for liability…

Twelve years ago it was $2800 and now pushing 20k

 

[wilso]

I'm in search of a good insurance company for our rental property. Just looked into Obie insurance. I should say, I'm impressed. Their online quote process was super quick and transparent. And rates seem competitive compared to traditional insurers. It was easy to contact them via the obie phone number and get the needed info. But I still want to check more companies to have a wider choice.

 

[ultrarunner]

I had hoped to dodge a bullet but after 40 years the non renewal letter arrived today for a single family rental… zero claim history in 40 years a max $7,500 deductible…

Farmers says they are no longer offering this coverage in California…

I’ve run into this before with Fireman’s Fund on a different property.

Now the fun begins… what will it take to place coverage and with rent control how to pay for higher premiums should this be the case?

Potentially, this could be the first of many…

 

[scootr]

State Farm just raised my rates. Still affordable at $134 month for a small 4 bdrm 2 bath home in CA.

 

[Thall303]

I’m a landlord in Houston and am curious as to how many if any are willing to go without insurance coverage altogether?

 

[ultrarunner]

I would on my residence but too risky with rentals…

Several of my rural friends no longer have fire coverage… just not doable… they all still have separate liability.

 

[CloverKnollFarms]

I clean up debris from tornados, for homeowners without insurance, too often. I can't imagine not insuring my largest physical asset

 

[ultrarunner]

It’s good you have options but some have run out of options.

A friend shut down his boutique winery due to insurance…

It was simply no longer available except for the California Fair Plan which is insurance of last resort for home owners but policy limits fall short of covering his operation with buildings and equipment factored.

Unable to place insurance has stopped sales when a mortgage is needed.

A nearby retirement community with its own zip code has the highest number of cash transactions and also the highest number without insurance…

Dad had lots of friends in the business and to a one all are gone as they get squeezed or forced out…

I will continue with max deductibles as long as I can…

 

[RayIN]

No it does not. We update our policy every other year. They are constantly upping the value to replace every time adjusted for inflation. Heck, this years policy shows the base dwelling replacement value is 4 times what it was 10 years ago.

If you dont update this occasionally, you wont be happy if the house is lost.

Just today the evening ABC national news did a piece on the people who's houses were burned in the California fires. 46% were under-insured; some by at least $150,000.

 

[ultrarunner]

Just today the evening ABC national news did a piece on the people who's houses were burned in the California fires. 46% were under-insured; some by at least $150,000.

I believe it as the cost to rebuild leaped since 2020.

Some policies the onus is on the insurance company to track replacement and not much was done during Covid years…

Many legal battles will be fought on replacement riders and I see more policies no longer offering guaranteed replacement.

The taxpayers and insured with no losses are expected to pick up a billion shortfall per the insurance commissioner…

 

[ericm979]

Just today the evening ABC national news did a piece on the people who's houses were burned in the California fires. 46% were under-insured; some by at least $150,000.

Construction costs have gone up a lot in parts of California.

In 2019 I asked the contractor that was renovating our house what it would cost to replace it if it burned down. He said about $400/sqft. These days I'm hearing more like $800/sqft. This is for a house that's mid range at best, not a mansion.

It's hard to get contractors and they charge a premium. Partly because their costs are higher but also because they can.

When there's a fire that burns a lot of houses the contractor shortage and prices gets even worse.

 

[grsthegreat]

Construction costs have gone up a lot in parts of California.

In 2019 I asked the contractor that was renovating our house what it would cost to replace it if it burned down. He said about $400/sqft. These days I'm hearing more like $800/sqft. This is for a house that's mid range at best, not a mansion.

It's hard to get contractors and they charge a premium. Partly because their costs are higher but also because they can.

When there's a fire that burns a lot of houses the contractor shortage and prices gets even worse.

Holy hell. Still glad i moved out of there 30 years ago. I have a 4000 sf house now here in idaho. I refuse to say what I paid to build it 30 years ago…..but it wasnt much. Mind you i did most of the work myself.

 

[ultrarunner]

You left and didn’t take your friends with you?

 

[grsthegreat]

You left and didn’t take your friends with you?

I left BECAUSE of my crazy friends

 

[ultrarunner]

I understand… it’s crazier now!

 

[ericm979]

Holy hell. Still glad i moved out of there 30 years ago. I have a 4000 sf house now here in idaho. I refuse to say what I paid to build it 30 years ago…..but it wasnt much. Mind you i did most of the work myself.

30 years ago building a house here wasn't terribly expensive either! That was before the tech boom made some people rich, enough to have a significant effect on housing and a lot more. That's driven a lot of it. Other parts of California have other expense drivers.

A friend of mine has a house in town that he GC'd himself and did a lot of the work on. It's very well built. The house next door got bought by a couple who are both lawyers with a large tech firm. They paid a few million and then found out that the house was basically unusable. They tore it down and have been rebuilding it. In the end he estimates it will cost $4M. They could probably get their money out of it when they sell if it's reasonably nice. This is on a small lot and not mansion size.

When my wife and I first moved in together we rented an Eichler in Palo Alto. Eichlers were built as cheap tract homes but people into mid century modern love them now. Back then the part of Palo Alto we were in was mostly regular people like teachers. One neighbor worked at Stanford in plant maintenance. Now Palo Alto is a "nice address"- it's where Mark Zuckerberg has his compound. The house wasn't all that great, it leaked and was dark and cold, but it was cheap and had a garage for our motorcycles.

Last year it sold for $3.5M. Still looked about the same on street view. I don't think they did anything in the last 30 years. It'll need a complete renovation to be nice.

Yes, it's insane. One of the reasons why we're leaving.

 

[ultrarunner]

Do you think over time Southern Oregon will follow California?

I really like Washington but the crazy rules of late make Olympia hard to discern from Berkeley and that’s not even getting into the rocks and bottles thrown at our troops arriving home…

Maybe the West Coast is more alike than different?

 

[ericm979]

Do you think over time Southern Oregon will follow California?

I hope not! We want to escape Silicon Valley and not have it follow us. It's already bad enough that Silicon Valley attitudes and ideas are going national.

The Southern Oregon economy doesn't have anything like Silicon Valley's wealth generation. There are some people from SV who work remote and live in Southern Oregon, or retired there, but they're relatively rare.

Bend's a little ahead of Southern Oregon on that, and house prices are higher.

 

[RayIN]

Construction costs have gone up a lot in parts of California.

In 2019 I asked the contractor that was renovating our house what it would cost to replace it if it burned down. He said about $400/sqft. These days I'm hearing more like $800/sqft. This is for a house that's mid range at best, not a mansion.

It's hard to get contractors and they charge a premium. Partly because their costs are higher but also because they can.

When there's a fire that burns a lot of houses the contractor shortage and prices gets even worse.

That same program had a segment where the leader of people who lost houses to the big fires 4-5 years ago said. After we learned our house had burned I immediately contacted a housing contractor and locked-in a contract to build a new house. Those who didn't follow my advice to hire a contractor ASAP had to pay about double the price per sq. ft. 6 months later.