Price to install remote

[rswyan]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I thought these units came with the necessary connections to run all these attachments. )</font>
The attachments for the most part should come with hoses and hydraulic quick disconnect fittings, but the remote valves on the tractor would not be included.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If not, I really need to consider this issue when I make my purchase, new OR used. )</font>
Yup.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I will eventually need a BH (after I buy a friggn' tractor) and I assumed that it was self contained and ran off a PTO. )</font>
It could be that way - or not - depending on the specific backhoe brand and model. My BL4690B backhoe for my B2910 came with a PTO pump as part of the kit. On the otherhand the BH90 for larger tractors probably doesn't (runs off remotes) It just depends.

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If these remote hydraulics are so expensive, either dealer installed when new or aftermarket, it really is a big issue... )</font>
If you negociate remotes (parts & install) into the initial purchase you may be able to get a deal as part of the package. Otherwise going with an aftermarket/3rd party setup may save you considerable coin. I've spent around $350 or $400 on a 3 spool valve and fittings adding remotes to my B2910. The same setup using Kubota parts would have probably cost 3x that amount for the parts alone at full ticket.

 

[DanR67]

MadRef / Henro -

OK - I am now clear on how power beyond and open-center valves work on my tractors' hydraulics - I obviously hadn't noticed this before - as I only recently added the rear top link hydraulic cylinder! I'm at work so I'll have to crawl underneath to take a picture of how it's hydraulically connected under the forward / brake pedals once I get home.

The only thing that now confuses me: if the 3PH is the *last* control in the hydraulic circuit - then when I had the rear hydraulics valve activated and the 3PH lift valve activated - the 3PH *won*.

As the rear hydraulics pressure line is taken off "before" the 3PH - and there is no "power beyond" return line from the rear remote valve - then I'd think the rear hydraulics would *win* - as all the pressure would go to the rear top link cylinder - thereby "starving" the 3PH valve of pressure.

But when I had both the 3PH and the rear remote valves activated - the *last* control in the circuit - the 3PH - won.

As I said - I'm now clear on what "power beyond" and "open center" mean - but my sympton seems contrary (assuming the 3PH is last in circuit) - so I'm still confused! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

After I take a picture - I'll also pull out my work shop manual and review the hydraulic schematics - I'll get to the bottom of this yet!

Thanks again for your feedback & help!

Dan

 

[MadReferee]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( The only thing that now confuses me: if the 3PH is the *last* control in the hydraulic circuit - then when I had the rear hydraulics valve activated and the 3PH lift valve activated - the 3PH *won*. )</font>

The 3pt is last in the *original* circuit. By teeing into the high pressure circuit you have added a second *last* circuit that has its own return to tank.

The fluid flow will take the path of least resistance. That said, the path of least resistance does not always mean the closest path. In fact there are many variables that come into play, cylinder size being one of them.

 

[DanR67]

Ok - I figured it out!

As MadReferee astutely pointed out - there is no "3rd hose" from the rear remote hydraulic valve - so one hose supplies pressure (Power Beyond from FEL valve block) and the other can do one of two things:

1) Centered = Power Beyond - feeds 3PH control valve
2) Actuated = Tank (drains side of cylinder not doing work)

The problem occurs because the 3PH lift valve provide the path to tank for the rear remote valve. As long as the 3PH valve is in the "center" or "lower 3PH" position - a pathway exists for the rear remotes oil to flow.

BUT... when the 3PH valve is in the "raise 3PH" position - the oil that is supposed to be "power beyond" from the Rear Remote - but is in fact "tank" - has no where to go - because the oil is completely routed to the 3PH lift cylinder. This means the rear remote cylinder does not function because the cylinder is "hydraulically locked" - there is nowhere for the oil to flow! /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

********

I took a look at how the rear remote valve was connected - and then went to my FEL, Owners' Manual and Work Shop Manuals and sorted it all out.

I attached a scanned excerpt from the work shop manual - showing the "open center" design of the 3PH valve in the center / raise positions - but also showing the cause of my problem when the 3PH is placed in the raise position.

It all makes perfect sense now! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Thanks again for pointing this out - and now everyone who asks to get one mounted can ensure it gets put on the correct way!

Dan

 

[MadReferee]

Not so fast. Remember this is an open center system where the pump is continuously pumping fluid. The fluid ALWAYS has to have somewhere to go or the pressure relief will activate which itself will return fluid to tank.

Your tractor has the 1/4" valve for the 3pt which does not have any feedback circuit. The B2410/B2710/B2910 tractors do. When the 3pt is fully lifted, the feedback linkage circuit engages and returns the position control valve spool to neutral thus creating a path to tank for the fluid. The 3pt cylinder will be locked in the up position just as any other cylinder would be when the spool is returned to neutral.

There is also a shock dampening mechanism in the control valve that lets a small amount of fluid to flow to prevent the shock of the 3pt starting to move up or stopping.

 

[blackmajicwoman]

As I am a newbie to the world of hydraulics, I am trying to understand what I need to do to add rear ports so that I can eventually hook up a Woods BH6000 to my BX1500. I have talked in great detailed with my Kubota dealer, the dealer at tractorsmart.com, as well as a technician at Woods.

Woods informed me that all I needed was a set of rear ports, but didn’t. My dealer wasn’t too sure what I needed. The dealer at tractorsmart.com said I could add the rear hook up that is the same as the BX23. With that, the “factory” modification does not require a three hose hook up to the BH. See attached. I outline in red the route of the modification.

After gathering this information, I went to my local deal and check out the plumbing on a BX23 and sure enough it was the same as what is illustrated in the attached. These two ports are what the BH connects to when attached. Also, and I believe this is the key, is that when the BH is not connected, the rear ports need to be connected to each other to complete the hydraulic loop. As you can see, I have to replace the block that the FEL is currently connected to. All of the factory parts cost me about $250.

I haven’t hooked it up yet, but plan to in the next few weeks. I am assuming, from the info gathered on this thread, that I “could” connect other implements that contain their own respective valve(s) to the rear ports (i.e. log splitter, PHD, etc.), but would not be able to correctly operate the 3PH at the same time as the respective implement? Any clarification would help.

 

[MadReferee]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I am assuming, from the info gathered on this thread, that I “could” connect other implements that contain their own respective valve(s) to the rear ports (i.e. log splitter, PHD, etc.), but would not be able to correctly operate the 3PH at the same time as the respective implement? Any clarification would help.)</font>

That is correct.

 

[blackmajicwoman]

Mad,

Thanks, you're a great resource!

 

[blackmajicwoman]

Just finished installing the rear remote hook up on my BX1500 today. This is the same exact way the BX23 is set up. Cost me about $250 from tractorsmart.com. The person I dealt with (Ronnie) was extremely helpful and even sent me outlined parts diagrams to assist in the hookup.

 

[blackmajicwoman]

Here a pic of the hydraulic "block" that replaces the one that is installed with the FEL on the BX1500, BX18xx, and the BX22XX.