plow troubles

[mao123]

greetings folks,

I am a newbie farmer, so bear with me if this sounds like a real dumb question.

I borrowed a 2 bottom 3 point hitch type plow from a friend.
He told me he could never get it to work properly from the day he bought it.
But I was welcome to try it.

I only wanted to plow over a small area that was rough pasture, and eventually put some lawn in for my wife. The area is only about 2 acres.

Anyway, the problem I discovered is that the second or further back plow will not roll over the furrow. I can watch it attempt to roll, but after about 5-6 feet, the furrow falls back into its original spot. This is really making a mess!

The owner of this plow told me he had numerous old timer experts look at the plow. They tried many different adjustment, all to no avail.

I was hoping I might find some answers here, after reading some of the posts, it sounds like there is a lot of good knoweldgeable help out there.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.


PS

I am not sure what type of plow this is, Turf or otherwise.

Regards Mike

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Any chance of getting a few pictures? One looking straight at the front. One straight on from the rear. And one from the side. Maybe a sprung beam. One or the other bottom not in proper alignment that way. Also, what speed are you trying to plow at? Too slow and the furrow slice will turn up on its edge, then flop back down "green side up". Also, is the plow level when in the ground? (front to rear) If the rear bottom isn't in the ground as far as the front, they'll turn the dirt quite differently.

And last. This one needs a keen eye or the pictures. I bought a plow several years ago where someone had taken a 2X12" plow and installed 16" bottoms. Rear bottom was only getting a partial cut. Dirt was sliding down the moldboard and not turning it. Turned out to be a parts plow....

 

[wolc123]

Since you only have a couple acres to plow and the front bottom is working good, just remove the rear bottom. If a couple old-timers could not get it working right then it is doubtfull that you will have much luck yourself with the back bottom even with "expert" internet advice. This will also enable you to bump up the speed quite a bit which may also help as FWJ suggests.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

As odd as it may sound, I've seen countless numbers of old farmers who just couldn't grasp the concept of plow set-up. They figured if it's in the ground, it must be OK. Nothing farther from the truth. A well adjusted plow can reduce the load on a tractor by a huge margin over an incorrectly adjusted one. "Back in the day" good tractor salesmen would know how to set up their plows to make their tractors look more powerful. It's not rocket science, but there's a LOT more to it than what meets the eye.

 

[Gator6x4]

I asked a farmer one time how individuals adjusted the double bottom plows to plow and leave the field looking smooth. His response was to place a 4x4 in front of the left rear wheel, drive forward and stop with the wheel on top of the 4x4. Then using the lift arm adjustment lever-handle adjust the plow until is level. Drive forward off the 4x4 and finalize the adjustment in the field when plowing. I have never tried this. I am passing the information on just as received.

I also found this link here on tractorbynet on how to set the plow up. More detailed than my descriprion above.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/29965-turning-plow.html

 

[Charlie175]

depends on how deep the furrow is, with the tire in the furrow you want the plow to be level. This is why the 3 point mounting points are not in line.

 

[N80]

It takes me a good 20 minutes to get my plow set up right each time I put it on, mostly because I'm not very methodical. As Gator and Charlie mentioned, you have to get it set up keeping in mind that one side of the tractor is going to be in a furrow. You also have to adjust the top link so the rear bottom is engaging the same way (depth and time) as the front. As FWJ mentioned it isn't rocket science but it does take a bit of what I'd call intuitive experience....which kind of translates into knowing what you're doing and having done it a lot.

That's what I don't have. That's why it takes a lot of fiddling and trial and error.

My point is, keep fooling with it and you'll find that sweet spot. That's the best we newbies can do.

I also agree with FWJ about speed, you got to give that turf some momentum to keep it rolling over.

 

[art]

From time to time we have found a bent beam on a plow do to the rocks we can hook up on with a plow. This is not that uncommon in our area on older plows without a breakaway release for the bottom.

When a plow is bent it is not uncommon for it to do what you have described although with bigger bottoms such as 20 and above in old sod a lower ground speed will also do the same3 but often for all bottoms.

With adjustments to all tillage equipment the frame should be level when in the ground working, they must be both front to rear and side to side. This being done on the second pass so the tractor is in the open furrow with the right wheel. It is also good to have someone watch it while working with it to check the level.

When tillage equipment is set up improperly it will pull harder and wear engaging parts faster.

 

[N80]

Art, how much does a plow have to be bent to make a noticeable difference? In other words, is this something you can eyeball or does a bend too small to eyeball still cause problems?

 

[schmism]

if the bottom of the furrow isnt flat, thats an indication that your leaning to far to one side with the plow.

usually the furrow falling back into place is just a simptom of not enough speed to flip the sod. A "high speed" plow will want to run between 4-5mph. doesnt sound fast till your out there doing it then it feels like your hauling arse.

the tilt of the plow/3point can be affected by how the plow was built. mine was designed with a straight draw bar, but there are many that take the offset draw bar.

FWJ has a great plowsetup thread out there with pics... i keep meaning to bookmark it for these times...

 

[LAWALLSTRACTOR]

From what you are saying, I am willing to bet you have a bent plow frame. If you have a good eye set the plow on some level concrete and not attached to the tractor. Look at the plow bottoms from different directions, all of the bottoms should set flat on the floor and all of the angles should look the same, on all bottoms. If it is bent you will find it almost impossible the ever get it to work correctly. Good luck with it.

 

[art]

Art, how much does a plow have to be bent to make a noticeable difference? In other words, is this something you can eyeball or does a bend too small to eyeball still cause problems?

We often would find them out a couple of inches on the ones that were relatively close. For the size of many of the plows it was easy to watch the furrows and measure the plowing width's comparably from bottom to bottom. We normally are working with more then two bottoms!!!!

There are often a hole or two on the back of the moldboard and for a field expediete bolt an extra piece of steel on the tail to set the furrow over a little further! Many older plows actually came with them to assist with this problem in difficult conditions. It might be enough to rectify this problem.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Another question.... How deep were you attempting to plow? Many older plows held true to the rule where they were intended to be used at a depth of one half of the bottom width. (ie a 12" plow to be used at 6" deep, 16" plow to be used at 8" deep, ect) If used too deep, the furrow slice would almost always turn up on edge, then flop back to "green side up". The lead bottom MAY be taking less than a full width of cut. Let's say a 10" wide cut being rolled into a 14" open furrow. That would let it roll completely over. The REAR bottom, (or multiple bottoms in the case of a plow with 3 or more bottoms) wouldn't have that extra room to lay the furrow slice all the way over. It then stops partially rolled over, then falls back. I had a John Deere 3X14" model 215A plow that wouldn't turn bottoms 2 and 3 all the way to save itself if the plow was ANY deeper than 7". It would turn the front cut all the way over very consistantly no matter what depth.

Just a wild guess.....


But, I'm of the same opinion as everyone else here so far. Sure sounds like a sprung frame.

By the way, what BRAND plow? And is it a trip beam? (Or rigid beam)

 

[N80]

I was down at my property this weekend and just for kicks decided to look at the plow that I use. It was rescued from my B-I-L's junk pile and as I mentioned above, it often takes me a good while to get it to work right. But, the truth of the matter is that I can usually get it to do a good job, but one bottom or the other usually 'digs' a little better than the other no matter what I do.

Sure enough, the frog (is that the right term?) on one of them is bent just a little bit and it kicks the tip of that share out a bit compared to the other. (Hmmm, maybe that's why it was in the junk pile?)

The plow is a rusty piece of junk and looks like most of the new ones you can buy nowadays at TSC etc.

I have found a lot of use for it but I suspect a good older model plow or even a new plow similar to it would work a lot better and be a lot easier to set up.

I may have to find me another 2-14 plow somewhere.

 

[backdoor]

Is there some way you can remove the rear plow shank and bottom from the rest of the plow? I've done that, and used the front plow only. Of course, on my plow the rear plow was the one sprung way out of line. I took the long landside off the rear plow and put it on the front, but I don't know for sure if that was needed. Mine worked great as a one-bottom.