Comparison New to tractors

[reynoldsr586]

So I am new to tractors and am looking to buy a workhorse for my up north property. It’s probably about 5 acres mixed between woods and grass. This tractor would be used for road management (grating) as well as cutting grass and moving stumps and logs. I don’t think I need a backhoe. I’ve looked at a few and am just curious how the subcompact ls can have so much higher lifting capacity than all the other subcompacts. Just looking for some what you guys think would be the best for what I described above. Thanks in advance.

 

[jeff9366]

Subcompact tractors weigh around 1,700 pounds, bare tractor, and have scant 9" ground clearance, not enough to get into woods. Subcompacts are incapable of moving any but small logs, forget stumps. Subcompacts are great lawn Finish Mowers but pretty limited as tractors. Subcompact tractors are certainly NOT "workhorses".

I suggest you research tractors around 2,700 pounds, bare tractor, with just under 25-horsepower to avoid expensive pollution controls required on tractors with >25-horsepower. Tractors weighing 2,700 pounds and more have 12" to 14" ground clearance. Tractors weighing 2,700 pounds, bare tractor, can pull quite large uncut logs but few stumps. Tractors this size fit into the average residential garage with ROPS folded.
(Note engines with large displacement for as much torque as possible with <25-horsepower limitation.)

One example would be Kubota's L2501/HST/4-WD. (100.47 cubic inch displacement engine.)
https://www.kubotausa.com/docs/defa...dardlseries_l2501_specs.pdf?sfvrsn=86856e5d_4


All tractor manufacturers produce 2,700 pound, <25-horsepower tractors. This is a 'hot' category.


Here are sample "five acre" threads from the T-B-N archive:
tractor for five acres site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search


I pulled a fair size stump to our burn pit today with my 3,500 pound (bare tractor)/ 5,400 pounds operating weight, Kubota L3560. Photo from today. Hurricane Irma debris.

 

[jeff9366]

I am curious how the subcompact LS can have higher lifting capacity than other subcompacts.

Lift capacity is dependent on size of hydraulic cylinders fitted to the FEL. Larger cylinders yield more lift, possibly slower lift unless higher flow hydraulic pump is fitted.

LS makes fine tractors.


PUT YOUR LOCATION INTO YOUR T-B-N PROFILE. ADD TRACTOR WHEN YOU BUY.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Subcompact tractors weigh around 1,700 pounds, bare tractor, and have scant 9" ground clearance, not enough to get into woods. Subcompacts are incapable of moving any but small logs, forget stumps. Subcompacts are great lawn Finish Mowers but pretty limited as tractors.

I suggest you research tractors around 2,700 pounds, bare tractor, with just under 25-horsepower to avoid expensive pollution controls required on tractors with >25-horsepower. Tractors weighing 2,700 pounds and more have 12" to 14" ground clearance. Tractors weighing 2,700 pounds, bare tractor, can pull quite large uncut logs but few stumps. Tractors this size fit into the average residential garage with ROPS folded.
(Note engines with large displacement for as much torque as possible with <25-horsepower limitation.)

One example would be Kubota's L2501/HST/4-WD. (100.47 cubic inch displacement engine.)
https://www.kubotausa.com/docs/defa...dardlseries_l2501_specs.pdf?sfvrsn=86856e5d_4


All tractor manufacturers produce 2,700 pound, <25-horsepower tractors. This is a 'hot' category.


Here are sample "five acre" threads from the T-B-N archive:
tractor for five acres site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search


I pulled a fair size stump to our burn pit today with my 3,500 pound (bare tractor)/ 5,400 pounds operating weight, Kubota L3560. Photo from today. Hurricane Irma debris.

I hear this all the time on TBN. I don't understand where this comes from. My 37 hp Branson has none of this you speak of. Just a soot cooker (think like a catalytic converter), and that's it. No "controls", no emissions computer, nada. If I remove the soot cooker and disconnect it's related sensor (it runs an idiot light on the dash and that's it), the tractor will run just fine with no "awareness" that I've done anything to it.

 

[jeff9366]

TIME.

The EPA has tightened "commercial" tractor emission standards in phases over the years. During Tier IV, "residential" tractors, arbitrarily defined as tractors <25-horsepower, are held to less stringent emission standards than commercial tractors with >25-horsepower engines.

Tier iV is the current standard for >25-horsepower tractors.

Your Branson may be Tier II or Tier III standard.

The price of my Tier IV Kubota L3560 (37-horsepower) increased $4,000 over its Tier III predecessor, the L3540 (35-horsepower).
Kubota instituted several non-engine upgrades with the model L3560 but more stringent emission controls comprised most of the $4,000 price increase. L3560 does not smoke nor smell of diesel at any time.

Had you followed T-B-N in 2012 you would have read numerous threads every week bemoaning the change from Tier III to Tier IV and speculating on Tier IV's effect on the tractor market.

Kubota's L2501 was the first "cheater" model with a detuned, large displacement engine for <25-horsepower, to reach the marketplace and it has been a volume seller ever since.

In twenty years all tractors sold in the US, Europe and Asia may be electrically powered.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

I don't know what to tell you. No idea what "tier" my tractor is. It is a 2017 model, bought new from the dealer in '17. It is 37 hp. And it has none of the razzmattazz on it that "all tractors over 25 hp are supposed to have".

 

[jeff9366]

Here is a LINK to Branson's web site: http://www.bransontractor.com/Branson/files/75/759b3785-895e-490c-b09c-97e8696b3af0.pdf

Branson shows:


Branson 25 Series Tractors

"Branson A Series Diesel Engine

Tier IV Carb Certified!

Tier IV certification is achieved with a DPF/DOC exhaust system.

Operation is fully automatic while engine is running.

No intervention or cycling required from the operator.

An electronic data recorder monitors the system but does not effect the engine's injection pump."


The sole difference I can see from Kubota L3560 is Kubota requires operator to push a button to initiate regeneration, which is burning soot off the DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter).

Branson regenerates automatically but all the Tier IV "stuff" is there.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Doesn't seem like a very "complex" system, or warranting telling new buyers to "stay away" from tractors over 25 hp then?

Or am I missing something?

I can literally take the soot cooker off, remove the "data logger" (it's only job is to light the idiot light on the dash), put on a plain jane old muffler and the tractor will never miss a beat.

Are some other brands designed to be more complex than this?

Just wondering why this gets repeated every. single. time. someone says they're looking at tractors?

 

[gladehound]

So I am new to tractors and am looking to buy a workhorse for my up north property. It’s probably about 5 acres mixed between woods and grass. This tractor would be used for road management (grating) as well as cutting grass and moving stumps and logs. I don’t think I need a backhoe. I’ve looked at a few and am just curious how the subcompact ls can have so much higher lifting capacity than all the other subcompacts. Just looking for some what you guys think would be the best for what I described above. Thanks in advance.

For what you describe, I'd strongly consider getting a larger older tractor. I did a lot of woods clean up with a heavy 20HP Kioti (much heavier than any SCUT) and found the hydraulics far to weak to be efficient. I now do the same duties with a 45 HP Kioti CUT. I feel this is a nice compromise to maintain maneuverability yet get the hydraulic lift and stability needed to move good size logs and stumps. A used 40+HP CUT or even small UT can be had for the price of a new SCUT and if pre-2014, probably wont have anything on the exhaust but a muffler (not that there is anything wrong with all of that stuff, until something goes wrong and you get the bill!)

 

[ericm979]

Branson manages to meet Tier IV with an old fashioned mechanical fuel injection. There is a DPF but there's no regen. The only electronics is a data recorder that's connected to pressure sensors in the DPF. The data recorder will light an indicator lamp on the dash if the DPF is getting clogged.

It's a simple system but running at low rpms all the time can clog the DPF. Most other Tier IV tractors have that problem to some extent. The DPF needs to get hot enough to burn off the soot. The majority of Tier IV machines have electronic fuel injection and a DPF. Many have discrete regen phases for the DPF. Mahindras that use Mahindra engines have no DPF; they manage to meet Tier IV with just electronic fuel injection.

It is nice not having to breathe diesel smoke while operating or hooking up implements.

The size of tractor you need is probably determined by the size of the stumps and logs you want to move and how you want to move them (i.e. pulling logs vs carrying them in a grapple).

With loader lift capacity pay attention to how it's measured. Some measure at the pins, which is not representative of how the load is distributed in real life. Also the capacity with the loader down is usually higher than at full lift due to leverage. And I think some rate the loader capacity with no bucket on the loader, which is kind of misleading.