Need construction backhoe for small farm-? size

[Dirtball]

After years of avoiding purchasing a backhoe, I finally have enough work to justify the purchase of a $25k used machine. I've considered rental for a couple months but have a good day job that only allows a few hours a week for the projects. I've hired pro's with backhoes, track loaders, bulldozers and excavators. There's no denying the need for the machine to be available for my free labor when I have time. Neighbor has a Deere 110- and it's too little for the big stump removal I have to do. I can handle a $25k purchase of a $75/new backhoe with ?2000-3000 hours. I want a big name Cat/Deere/Case/New Holland for easier resale a few years down the road. I need help what to look for. I have hills, snow removal and don't have to trailer it.. let the comments fly. thanks

 

[VirginiaAgent]

Same situation as I was in. If you have any long term projects, it's just much more cost effective to buy rather than hire. And it's amazing the work you can do with a full size backhoe/loader.

I picked up a 10 year old NH 555E earlier this year. It had 2700 hrs., 4wd, 4 in 1 front loader, ex-hoe, cab and air conditioning for close to your price range.

A full size backhoe is the way to go for big trees, stumps, and moving lots of dirt. I have taken down trees up to two feet in diameter, and lifted and hauled the stumps. You may have to roll them around a bit to get the dirt weight off, but I have yet to tackle anything that I did not handle.

Ideally, you would have a full size, and a compact for ease of use and maneuverability. But most of us don't have that kind of money for personal use equipment.

Cat, Deere are both good, but I could not justify the extra money for the Cat or Deere name. They are all going to break, leak, and occasionally need fixing, no matter what the name.

Regardless of what you get, I highly recommend 4wd and the 4 in 1 front loader. And, on a 95 degree day like today, the air conditioned cab was nice.

EddieWalker has some great posts about what to look for in used equipment. He's very knowledgable, so I suggest you search for his threads.

VA

 

[Cat_Driver]

I'm not trying to sway you but I will add my advice, since you asked.

I was looking at backhoes for 6 months after getting rid of my Kubota farm tractor, then someone said look at a track skidsteer. My first thoughts were nah not for me I NEED a big honkin full size backhoe.

Then one day I started looking at the skidsteers, and by chance I purchased what I have now I bought a year old 400 hours track skidsteer for 30K, new it was over 60k.

I've had it since Nov. and I have to say it's the best piece of equipment man ever invented. Some say it's the Swiss Army knives of tractors and I now believe it.

I do thing with this skid steer I would never dreamed of doing with a tractor. In one day alone I can put on a trencher attachment and dig 100' of water line, then a grappler to clean up debris, then a bucket for dirt, then a set of forks, next a backhoe attachment for a hole...yes all in one day, several attachments. I've gotten more work done with this skidsteer in a few months than I did in four years with my Kubota.

Changing attachments is quick, except for putting on the CAT backhoe, but the versatility is exactly what I needed.

Plus I was l always getting flat tires that would ruin a whole day, now never ever can I get a flat. Turning radius is 360 degrees in one spot, lifting is amazing, probably not quite what a big backhoe would do but enough for me.

I don't know what you're planning on doing, but if it involves a lot of different tasks give a skidsteer a look, they are cheap on the used market.

 

[AlanB]

If you don't have to trailer it, you can get one of those oversized ones.

I bought an old ragged 555C Ford. I am very happy with having the full size hoe. I also have a skid (743 Bobcat) and a Cut (1925 NH) and they all do different things well.

Things I would look for most is being able to get parts and support if needed, scratch that, when needed. All the brands you mentioned though have pretty excellent parts support though, so at that point I would start looking for condition and features I liked.

I posed a similar question prior to buying mine and you may search on my name and see what other wrote then.

4WD is definetely nice, Mine gets used far more then I thought I would have too.

I don't have the 4 way bucket but I can see where it would be a real advantage.

Good luck in your search.

 

[coopers]

Deere and Case are very well made machines and have great resale, especially case backhoes.

 

[Dirtball]

Well I started to look. Surfed Ebay. Stopped at the local Cat and Deere shops. Looks like a good $10,000 markup at dealer on $25k machine. Just missed a great unit locally . 5 yearold 2500hr machine for $20k. I am in no immediate rush. I'd like to get something in 60 days. A 2-3000 hr unit would hopefully keep away from the repair shop for a while. I know I can get a 8000hr unit for $10k but I dont want the repair headaches. Question??---Do the backhoe controls change from brand to brand? when were all the sticks condensed to fewer 4 in 1 joysticks? ie. will any 2002 model year and up have modern controls?

 

[DarinRay]

Sent you a private message dirtball. boy i feel bad calling you that.

I agree on the case backhoes being leader of the pack. Sure it's because I have one.

Darin

 

[coopers]

Deere and Case offered the opposite 'normal' controls for their units for quite a long time, I believe 2004-5 was when pilot controls were introduced but that may only be when I just read about them. Someone else might have to correct me on that. Deere was always the "deere controls" (wobble sticks) and case always had the 3 (or 4 if an extendahoe) controls with foot pedals for swing. Like I said, even back on the old 580C's (70's model) they offered the stupid wobble stick. I've seen old 310's with case controls too, very rare though. Now it's just whatever you choose. 2002 would be case controls on case, and deere controls on deere, unless I'm wrong and pilot controls were out by '02.

 

[ScottAR]

What Coopers said... You can get any of the controls on the newer machines.
With the possible exception of the Ford 4 lever style (4 levers no pedals) but I haven't seen those in a long time.

If you find a nice machine with controls you don't like, You can convert with a kit from the dealer. No idea on price.

Enjoy the ride. Shopping for a backhoe can be quite enjoyable.

 

[White Shark]

What Coopers said... You can get any of the controls on the newer machines.
With the possible exception of the Ford 4 lever style (4 levers no pedals) but I haven't seen those in a long time.

If you find a nice machine with controls you don't like, You can convert with a kit from the dealer. No idea on price.

Enjoy the ride. Shopping for a backhoe can be quite enjoyable.

I'd look for a used CAT 420D if I were looking for a used hoe. Pilot controls and plenty of power to spare. I'm not a fan of the 416D and the 430D is a pretty good sized machine.

There are a lot of nice Case and New Holland machines worth picking up too. They will be a lot cheaper than the CATs, but every bit as good. I prefer the CATs but the price can be a deal breaker. Same with the Deeres. I don't like the Deeres much and they are over priced more often than not. You will maximize your dollar by going with Case or NH.

I once worked for an outfit that had a Case hoe with 13,000 hours on it and it was still running pretty strong. The brakes are always a problem on the units, especially at high hours, but it was amazing that it was running that long considering it had spent it's entire life at an oil refinery where equipment gets regularly abused. It's just a testament to how solid Case backhoes are.


..

 

[Builder]

Well I started to look. Surfed Ebay. Stopped at the local Cat and Deere shops. Looks like a good $10,000 markup at dealer on $25k machine. Just missed a great unit locally . 5 yearold 2500hr machine for $20k. I am in no immediate rush. I'd like to get something in 60 days. A 2-3000 hr unit would hopefully keep away from the repair shop for a while. I know I can get a 8000hr unit for $10k but I dont want the repair headaches. Question??---Do the backhoe controls change from brand to brand? when were all the sticks condensed to fewer 4 in 1 joysticks? ie. will any 2002 model year and up have modern controls?

Yes, they can be had with 2 sticks and maybe a footpedal to swing the boom. I like CASE units because they invented the modern day backhoe and have a lot of dealer support. They also make an excellent machine.

One thing not mentioned I would strongly recommend is an extenda-hoe. Once you have one, you'll never figure out how you survived without one.

I'll tell you who makes fines hoes for a cheaper price in used units is JCB, New Holland & Terex. No, they're not as good as Case, Cat or Deere, but you're not a professional excavator either, so you don't need the world's best machine. Believe me, plenty of pro-excavators use them, but they are more hoe than you'll ever need and they run cheaper because they don't hold resale value as well.

 

[nathan812]

The controls for the hoe vary depending on how the original purchaser ordered the machine. Once you use one type or the other for a while it will be like second nature. I started using the wobble stick backhoes, which are the two sticks that move in four directions, it isn't hard to learn how to use them. I then started using the case 3 stick controls which really messed with me for a while but once you get used to them they are real good at doing fine work. In the long run it just takes practice with either type of controls and you will get used to them. I know Case had wobble stick in their late 80 models the K's. John Deere, cat, and others have them also. The new Cat pilot controls are real nice but just came out a few years ago. I also agree with the extendahoe, once you use one you won't want to use a standard hoe again. The increased reach is worth the extra money.

 

[Builder]

I have the pilot controls and love them.

 

[wroughtn_harv]

builder, "I like CASE units because they invented the modern day backhoe"

Case bought American Tractor in 57 so they could put their new hydraulic backhoe on their small Case dozers.

Bamford was building hydraulic tractor backhoes in 53. (JCB)

 

[Builder]

Case bought American Tractor in 57 so they could put their new hydraulic backhoe on their small Case dozers.

Bamford was building hydraulic tractor backhoes in 53. (JCB)

I said modern day backhoe.

I've seen backhoe booms mounted on the back of an army deuce and a half, but that's not a modern backhoe.

You get the idea.....they were the first to take it to the big time.

 

[Renze]

I said modern day backhoe.

I've seen backhoe booms mounted on the back of an army deuce and a half, but that's not a modern backhoe.

You get the idea.....they were the first to take it to the big time.

I think Case was the first to sell them as construction tractor at their dealerships as a complete start-and-go solution, with factory mounted loader and backhoe, with no 3pt: A dedicated backhoe machine, you didnt have to buy a standard farm tractor, and then find yourself a hoe and a loader to bolt on to it.

loose backhoes from JCB are older, but they consisted of a farm tractor, built up with a hoe and loader by JCB, and for warranty you needed 2 different companies. But Case was the first to provide an off-factory all-in-one solution, which was a ready to go backhoe from the factory. That helped a great deal in promoting the concept.

 

[MFRED]

Case is an excellent machine. Cat & Deere are too, just be ready to poay for it in Parts & Service. The resale will gain it back however. If it's something you will have for a while then resale isn't that big of a deal. I really like the Terex machine. JCB & Komatsu are good too. I had an old Case 580C, Excellent machine. Brakes, they never worked. But it had 10K hours on it when it got sold, for near inital purchase price.
If I were to replace the Ford 555 today it wouold be with a Terex or Komatsu. If you can fix most things, you can pay half as much for one of these names. If you don't pay as much, you won't need to get as much ouot of it in the end.

 

[Dirtball]

I found one local machine. 1999 Cat416C 4wd , X-hoe, cab heat/No air, 1100 hrs , standard frt bucket , one leaky cylinder and broken glass in cab. CAT store knows the machine, they have a print out on it I can get- he considered trading it in . Someone recommended sending oil samples. owner wants near 30,000 for it. I'll go see it next week..How many hp is this machine?

 

[Builder]

I found one local machine. 1999 Cat416C 4wd , X-hoe, cab heat/No air, 1100 hrs , standard frt bucket , one leaky cylinder and broken glass in cab. CAT store knows the machine, they have a print out on it I can get- he considered trading it in . Someone recommended sending oil samples. owner wants near 30,000 for it. I'll go see it next week..How many hp is this machine?

Dirt,

Probably ~85HP. That's funny that it has no air. I considered a similar 416C and it also had no A/C. Let me warn you, no A/C in a cab sux. Been there done that with another machine I used to run. A/C is like an extendahoe-you won't know how you lived without it. Keep looking for one with AC would be my advice. Perhaps that kind of thing doesn't matter to you, but when it's hot, a cab is like a greenhouse, even w/ doors open. Have you tried Eagle power & equipment(Case) or Plasterer(John Deere) or Ransome (CAT) All of themn basically are thieves, but they usually have fleet returns that are decently maintained.

I started out the same way as you. I was gonna buy a 25-30K machine until I realized how nice it would be to have a newer more loaded machine. Yeah, the payments suck, but I really like it. My CASE really spoiled me.

 

[osucowboy]

You know my Daddy always jokes that you never let the facts get in the way of a good argument, but I will have to interject some facts here on the subject of backhoes!

Fact, Joesph Cyril Bamford built and sold the first intregal "modern" backhoe in 1954.
Fact, Case bought the American Farm Tractor company out in 1957 soley to acquire their backhoe that they where developing and then brought it to market in 1958. That is why if you went to Con-Expo (or a display at your local dealer) you would have seen the "50th Anniversary" backhoe. To confirm this information please refer to Case Construction Equipments website.

OK, now lets talk sales and who is really #1.

Fact, there has not been a single year since 1954 that ANYONE has manufactured or sold more backhoes than JCB. They have a worldwide market share of 38%!! I cannot tell you the exact number of backhoes built and sold in 2007 but it was over 35,000. In the world market John Deere and Cat fight for second and Case and New Holland for 4th and 5th. Just fact, ask your dealer. Now in North America I will give you that Case has major market share. The majority of their backhoes are sold here, but JCB's market share is growing by leaps and bounds!

Fact, they had the first outboard planetry drives, first side shift, first four wheel steer, first over 85HP, ect.... Joe Bamford always sought to improve and be first. Today they are the ONLY company to manufacuer their own engine, transmission, axles and cabs for backhoes!! They can only do this because they build almost twice as many as anyone else...

Like it or not thems the facts. We can argue preferences, tastes, ect. in another session. But, the numbers are the numbers.