Middle Buster or Subsoiler for Water Pipe Trenching? Or just rent a trencher??

[SanDucerro]

Need to lay some water lines down. I can rent a 35-45HP ride on trencher for about $390 a day, or I could buy a Middle Buster or Subsoiler for less than $200. In the "reviews" section of Tractor Supply - both the subsoiler and the middle buster implements have reviewers who say they use these to cut trenches/ditches to bury the pipe. Question is, does this actual work? If so, is one better than the other?

 

[Halftrack]

I have used a trencher and a subsoiler with a pipe laying attachment. To me, it depends on what you are planning to do. If it involves long runs with no T's of about 12 inches deep, go with the subsoiler. If you are talking a lot of T's, then rent the trencher, cut your trenches as fast as you can and return it. Lay the pipe with T's and cover with your equipment. The middle buster will be difficult to maintain anything close to 12" deep but is the alternative to the trencher for and open trench to assemble T's. If it is the long run situation, look for a subsoiler with the pipe laying attachment or fabricate your own. Good luck.

 

[SSdoxie]

if it works or how well depends on soil type, hidden obstructions, how deep, weight & HP of the tractor. If you are going to try it, get the subsoiler. It has a longer shank for extra depth. You can always get a middle buster shovel to put on it. I have used a middle buster to bury electrical and TV cable (made mistake and Middle Buster, but I didn't need extra depth for the cables). I made first pass with a subsoiler tooth on to get ground penetration then went back for second pass with the middle buster shovel to clean and widen the trench.

 

[gwdixon]

If you intend to bury PVC pipe in a area that has a lot of traffic (tractor or otherwise) and/or ground engaging equipment then a trencher is the best bet.

A middle buster trench is way too shallow for serious pressure pipe burial IMO. Plus, unless the soil is perfect, a shovel is necessary to clean out the ditch as the spoils will often fall back into the ditch. Gravity is not friendly for this application.

I just helped my neighbor put in PVC pipe to drip irrigate 50 redwood trees (they require a lot of water). He plans to flail mow the "orchard". When the ground gets wet here it turns to putty so a tire could easily sink and break the pipe.

Anyway, he bought a trencher at auction, we rebuilt and serviced it, then dug a tremendous amount of trench about two feet deep with cross ditches for the drip line to come out at the base of the trees. Under no circumstances would a middle buster have done a satisfactory job.

Bottom line: If you are going to lay water pipe in your vineyard it would be advisable to get the line deep and out of harm's way. There is a lot of necessary traffic in a vineyard and your M7040 is heavy enough to sink in a wet spot. It will get out but repairing the damage is a detriment.

 

[SanDucerro]

If you intend to bury PVC pipe in a area that has a lot of traffic (tractor or otherwise) and/or ground engaging equipment then a trencher is the best bet.

A middle buster trench is way too shallow for serious pressure pipe burial IMO. Plus, unless the soil is perfect, a shovel is necessary to clean out the ditch as the spoils will often fall back into the ditch. Gravity is not friendly for this application.

I just helped my neighbor put in PVC pipe to drip irrigate 50 redwood trees (they require a lot of water). He plans to flail mow the "orchard". When the ground gets wet here it turns to putty so a tire could easily sink and break the pipe.

Anyway, he bought a trencher at auction, we rebuilt and serviced it, then dug a tremendous amount of trench about two feet deep with cross ditches for the drip line to come out at the base of the trees. Under no circumstances would a middle buster have done a satisfactory job.

Bottom line: If you are going to lay water pipe in your vineyard it would be advisable to get the line deep and out of harm's way. There is a lot of necessary traffic in a vineyard and your M7040 is heavy enough to sink in a wet spot. It will get out but repairing the damage is a detriment.

Good points. The ground is sandy loam where I'm laying pipe and it does tend to refill what you dig. The trench will be inside the "H" brace on the vineyard rows, so the traffic will be crossing at the entrance to the row. While the M7040 can and will go down the rows, it's not the preferred tractor for row work. But, having said that, I can see where a need would exist for the M7040 to run a sprayer after a rain event - so that may be the deal breaker....

 

[mikim]

I bought a subsoiler from TSC but the first 20 feet - it twisted into a pretzel. Had a heck of a time getting it off the 3 point. TSC gave my money back. I'd still like one for trenching but maybe I'll buy a welder and use it as a "first time project" thing. I have a backhoe that I've been using for several years -- it works OK but slow and makes a big trench for conduit or small water line. Unless you plan on trenching as a regular activity - renting might be the best. Rentals make the best trench in the least time and when you're done you take it back and they do the maintaining.

 

[ishiboo]

How many feet of lines are you burying, and what diameter?

I would probably use the subsoiler unless there were a lot of complex right angles/etc. where you couldn't simply weave through. The L3130 will pull it fine. It will go quite fast. You will need a helper to unspool the irrigation line unless you build a spool mount for it. The black HDPE pipe does not recover well from being kinked.

A middle buster doesn't really get down far enough and makes somewhat of a mess... the subsoiler leaves a very small trench you can almost pack right over by driving over when you're done, it doesn't even heavily disturb the sod.

 

[lostcreekranch]

Look at this attachment at Agri-Supply to lay continuous poly pipe up to about 2".

3 Point Pipelayer-Pipe Layer Attachment | Agri Supply #73622

It works with this one;

3 Point Subsoiler-Subsoiler Attachment | Agri Supply #73410


Sent from my iPad using TractorByNet

 

[Arc weld]

Why not rent a walk behind trencher for a lot less money?

 

[lostcreekranch]

Why not rent a walk behind trencher for a lot less money?

I would guess even a small 12" WB trencher would rent for $100+ per day. The above kit is about $200 total and you still have a pretty good ripper.

My 2 cents worth.

Sent from my iPad using TractorByNet

 

[SanDucerro]

Unfortunately, my water line will have LOTS of "T" joints - one every 13 feet over a total length of 180 feet. Although the "main line" out to the "T" area is much longer with no "T" joints.

At any rate, in thinking about this I thought the Middle Buster might be a better choice as it would leave a larger trench to work within. I think what's going to drive me back to a Ditch Witch rental will be the needed depth. The rental rate isn't an issue, it's just needing to be done in a day that had me looking for alternatives. I have the run described above that I'd like to do next week, but then I need to do a second area about a month from now and I really didn't want to rent the unit twice. I imagine I'll just wait until both fields are complete before I rent and then do them both at once.

 

[C4Ranch]

Here is what a middle buster trench looks like. Used it to bury a 4" drain. Biggest prob is the dirt that kept falling back into trench. This was only abt 120' so I could go clean it out with a spade.

I'm about to lay 400' of electric conduit and 200' of water line so I'm gonna get a walk behind from Home Depot for about $140 a day.

 

[SanDucerro]

Here is what a middle buster trench looks like. Used it to bury a 4" drain. Biggest prob is the dirt that kept falling back into trench. This was only abt 120' so I could go clean it out with a spade.

I'm about to lay 400' of electric conduit and 200' of water line so I'm gonna get a walk behind from Home Depot for about $140 a day.

Nice work! Thanks for the visual!

 

[SanDucerro]

How many feet of lines are you burying, and what diameter?

I would probably use the subsoiler unless there were a lot of complex right angles/etc. where you couldn't simply weave through. The L3130 will pull it fine. It will go quite fast. You will need a helper to unspool the irrigation line unless you build a spool mount for it. The black HDPE pipe does not recover well from being kinked.

A middle buster doesn't really get down far enough and makes somewhat of a mess... the subsoiler leaves a very small trench you can almost pack right over by driving over when you're done, it doesn't even heavily disturb the sod.

I'm about convinced there is nothing the L3130 can't do! It's currently got a Landpride RTR1274 Tiller on the 3-pt and we're tearing up acreage right and left. Just tilled right at 1.5 acres with it and it never missed a beat. Well, there was one spot where we hit a Huisache root - but those things are TOUGH!

But to answer your question - the pipe I need to bury is 1/2" PVC (or whatever they call it now). I can't use the flexible stuff as I need to have "T" fittings every 13 feet. At those junctions we'll connect to the flexible drip lines which will run the length of the vineyard rows, but those aren't underground - they ride on a wire about a foot off the ground.

 

[Brad_Blazer]

I built a pipe layer to attach to a subsoiler using some 1-1/4 sch 40 pipe bent using a hydraulic pipe bender. Pretty similar to the Agri-Supply one. I trenched in 600 feet of the 1" 100psi coil pipe. It runs to a hydrant at my pasture and this year it froze twice when we had single digit temps. That was the first time it froze since I installed it about 8 years ago. It worked fine again after it thawed.

I ran the subsoiler along the route "dry" before I laid the pipe. At the joints I would install the hose barb coupling, run it into the ground, then pull the pipe up slightly in the trench to install the hose clamps and then push it back down. You could probably do something similar to install tees, pulling the pipe up a little, cutting it, and installing a 99 cent hose barb tee. I used a hand trowel to clear the trench a little where I accessed the pipe. It looks like the irrigation tees don't even need clamps. Mine went in about 12" deep.

Wow, the 1/2" irrigation pipe at Lowes is less than $50 for a 500' roll.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...156d1305078825-laying-water-pipe-img_3363-jpg

Check out this thread for more ideas. http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/206527-laying-water-pipe.html?highlight=subsoiler

 

[ROUSTABOUT]

I have Sandy Loam soil. Just run your middle buster two or three times. We have an old mule plow with a 3 PT welded up. Just ease along so you don't break the plow. Trenchers don't go fast and tractor should be walking speed max. Middle busters are made for worked ground. I have a relative that breaks everything. Other people used it 125 years and 15 minutes of him it's thrown in the scrap pile, him claiming it was a piece of junk anyway. Seen him snap a 6' Ford blade going fast the way he likes it. Had a roller with a 3" solid rod through it. Few minutes it was a two piece special. Came by with it chained to rear of a disc and it was bouncing off the ground 3 ft high on a gravel road while he was traveling. I stopped said slow that thing down. Oh it'll be fine. Took back off, snap, more junk. It was 100 years old and they never broke it, but just a few minutes of him... I do have a case maxi sneaker but I have never done pipe. I do want to change up one plow to do up to 1 1/2" pipe and direct burial cable. You run 3/4 I'd think.

 

[MESSMAKER]

Walk behind trencher is pretty easy and quick enough. It is better than a tractor when the going gets tight.

 

[orezok]

Unfortunately, my water line will have LOTS of "T" joints - one every 13 feet over a total length of 180 feet. Although the "main line" out to the "T" area is much longer with no "T" joints.

I would be concerned with your choice of 1/2” pipe. Over the distance you indicated I think you will find that the trees at the end of the line get little water due to pressure loss over that distance and number of tees.

 

[nyone]

I'm about convinced there is nothing the L3130 can't do! It's currently got a Landpride RTR1274 Tiller on the 3-pt and we're tearing up acreage right and left. Just tilled right at 1.5 acres with it and it never missed a beat. Well, there was one spot where we hit a Huisache root - but those things are TOUGH!

But to answer your question - the pipe I need to bury is 1/2" PVC (or whatever they call it now). I can't use the flexible stuff as I need to have "T" fittings every 13 feet. At those junctions we'll connect to the flexible drip lines which will run the length of the vineyard rows, but those aren't underground - they ride on a wire about a foot off the ground.

You cant lay PVC with a middle buster or ripper shank. If you do your only going to use it to break up the ground then hand shovel the trench out.