Loosing the Split Rim Dayton Wheels

[Gale Hawkins]

This morning I bought 6 of the the 10 R22.5 tires mounted on the Dayton radial style wheel for the 1989 Ford F700 16' flat dump that were pulled from wrecked school buses. The truck currently has the Dayton split rims that I want to get away from because more and more shops will not service tires mounted on split rims.

The two steers are Kumho KRS02's that have never been ran because the size printed on the tread and the rubber tips from the molds show no wear. They are dated 2008 and of course they look new in every way.

The four drives are new like retreads with matching drive tread. Two are Goodyear 2001 cases that really are not showing any weather cracking yet. Two are Michelin cases with one dated 2001 and one dated 1997. The 2001 Michelin case shows some weathering cracks but less than the 1997 Michelin case.

We have ran Michelin car tires for many years on at least one of our daily drivers but they were replaced every two years. This is my first experience with Michelin large truck tires.

While I am not concerned about the Michelin cracking on these G load rated tires I was just giving some feedback on these brands from what I saw today.

I guess being school buses the law does not permit retreads on steers but are OK on drives.

We were happy to find the set of six mounted radial tires and rims for $600. The two new Kumho's alone were worth that.

Details: Kumho KRS02 10 R22.5 14PR BSW - tires-easy.com

 

[herringchoker]

That's a good deal..2 new tires and 4 others plus 6 rims for $600.

It's been a while, but I tried Michelin, Firestone, Good Year, BF Goodrich and others on my trucks (11R22.5 and 11R24.5). I never ran recaps on the steer axle, but had great success with recaps on the drive axles. I never had a recap failure that was not caused by the casing (under inflation, cuts in the sidewall). I found that Good Year had very stiff sidewalls, while Michelins were very flexible. (You notice that when you do your own tire installation.) I had the best luck with Michelin and BF Goodrich (owned by Michelin), and got the best bang for the buck with BF Goodrich. I got as many as 3 recaps on casings that started out new on steer axles (mostly Oliver retreads). Never tried Kumho.

I would probably mount the Michelins together on one side, that way the Good Year casing wouldn't be carrying more load due to the stiffer sidewall than a Michelin beside it. (But that's just me. )

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Thanks for your point about sidewall stiffness. I was going to check heights and run the two Goodyear capped tires on the inside because the casing looked better but I am going to rethink that.

With Michelin sidewalls flexing more natually they are going to get the fine cracking look faster so maybe they just look like they are aging faster due to the flexing?

I just bought 7 of the Kumho KRS03 for the MH and did not know how much higher the 10 R22.5's are.

The F700 may only see 1000+ miles a year so am fine with the recapped drives. I am really excited they are already mounted on radial wheels so I will no longer have the split rims even if our current steers are brand new 10 x 20 tires/tubes.

We are going to wash up the tires/rims really well and inspect them well before we take them to get them mounted to the hubs.

The Firestones came off of a different bus than the Michelins so I expect they were paired in real life. I plan to run the max PSI stamped on the tires (I know 115 for the Kumhos) since being a truck we will be prepared for any thing.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I have never messed with Michelin on big trucks but every time I have had them on a LT or a car I have had bad luck. Just like mentioned before, the soft sidewalls got me. That has left me not a fan of that brand.

If I were to mount them up I would do as you were thinking and put the Goodyears on the inside and the Michelin on the outer's.

Chris

 

[slowzuki]

True split rims on a 1989? Thats kind of weird...

This morning I bought 6 of the the 10 R22.5 tires mounted on the Dayton radial style wheel for the 1989 Ford F700 16' flat dump that were pulled from wrecked school buses. The truck currently has the Dayton split rims that I want to get away from because more and more shops will not service tires mounted on split rims.

Details: Kumho KRS02 10 R22.5 14PR BSW - tires-easy.com

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Great 50/50 on suggestions. :laughing:

Around here the narrow highly crowned roads I expect can put 60%+ on the inside tires. I can see that by the temp rise in the motorhome drives with the TST TPMS.

I like the best tires on the inside for that reason AND so I can visually better keep an eye on weaker tires when mounted on the outside. It may be a few days before I take it to town for the installation anyway.

Tomorrow I am going to take the right side mirror to the glass shop to get the glass replaced after my BIL caught a limb with it when we first got it.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

True split rims on a 1989? Thats kind of weird...

Since the true split rims did go away a while ago today the term is used when talking about the two piece Dayton bias tire rims. The locking ring is split. :thumbsup:

More and more tire shops will not do these two part Dayton wheels and about the only tires for them come from China it seems. I may find someone with Dayton wheel system that just wants tires that will hold air. Two of the six are new 10x20's.

 

[slowzuki]

Why wouldn't they work on Dayton's? Do they misunderstand what a split rim actually is? The Dayton's aren't dangerous to air up, only a bit harder to get on straight.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

They are OK working with Dayton radial rims. It is the two piece bias rims that they do not want to work with in part because staff does not understand how to seat the keeper ring but I think in part it is the manual labor involved to unseat a tire mounted 15 years ago due to rust, etc.

Hard work is to be avoided at all cost. :laughing:

While there is the service issue but it is the ability to find 10 R22.5 tires vs 10.00 x 20 bias tires too that makes loosing the two part rims in favor of the 1 part rim.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Well I had 'assumed' all six were G rated but the Michelins are only F rated. Not sure if mixing load ratings on the same side would be OK or not.

Dad aways said to load to the high side of the road but make sure the right tires were able to handle the extra weight shift if you dropped of the road, etc.

I think the G's will carry about 1200 more pounds as a pair than the F's but that may not be an issue in our case. I could try to come up with two more G's but for our use it may be a waist of time and money.

 

[JESSE1]

Here's a comparison between a Dayton wheel and a Budd wheel. The truck on the left is a '56 White WC22PLT with 10Rx22.5 tubeless tires mounted on Dayton wheels. It originally had 10.00x20 bias ply tires mounted on tube type Dayton wheels with a locking ring. The truck on the right is a '59 White 4400TD that has 11R24.5 tubeless tires mounted on Budd wheels. It originally had 10.00x22 bias ply tires mounted on tube type Budd wheels. I changed out both trucks to tubeless tires because good quality bias ply tires aren't available anymore.

 

[cowski]

put the better tires on the out side of each side and the michlens on the inside.

 

[ultrarunner]

We run similar wheels on Model T Fords and tire availability has not been a problem...

 

[Gale Hawkins]

I will compare them side by side to see if the drives are all of equal height but my thinking is cut the PSI in the G's from 115 to 95(F load rating) and just run all at 95 as if they were F rated. I with put the Goodyear (G's) on the right and the weaker Michelin's on the left (high side of the road).

JESSE1 those are some awesome looking trucks. Thanks for posting the photos. I will be glad to loose the bias bounce on each trip out. :laughing:

 

[QRTRHRS]

Just wondering about the dates on those tires? I had a 22.5 low pro capped awhile back. The folks at the tire business I frequent told me that by federal law nothing over five years old can be capped now. But anyway, that would not stop me from running them.

My preference is to run the more worn tires on the inside when running on alot of crowned roads. With equal tire pressure, both tires would be more equally loaded where as a larger inside tire is going to get more load and wear more.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

OK used the pressure washer on the wheels and tires and got them to looking better then when to the car wash thinking that would be stronger but it was not but thankfully I took my jug of AWESOME and found an old rag in the PU and got off grease/brake dust off the front wheels. The pressure washer blew some bad black paint off of one set and I sanded it off the outside wheel on the other set.

Found a short screw and a broken chain link in one of them. The chain link had been in there for a while it took a while to work it out with a screw driver.

I am now ready to go to town and get them mounted but I will wait for daylight. :thumbsup:

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Today I got the radial rims/tires installed and glad to have that behind me. The bias tires after they got warmed up were smooth at ever 70 but not these new tires.

Well the truck is home and parked and I made a local truck/tractor tire dealer an offer on the bias rims/tires that he could not pass up so they are gone.

Some day when it is cooler I will jack up the truck and see if the rims and the tires are in round.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

No longer got the shakes. :thumbsup:

My son helped me true up the steer Dayton rims today by removing the lateral run-out.

We used a split piece of fire wood to server as a redneck dial (eyeball) indicator. :laughing:

Had to pick up my son from a week of Boy Scouts camp this morning in the Lowes parking lot so I picked up a cheater bar. The double wall conduit was wanting to bend on me.

1" galvanized pipe was a perfect fit out the 3/4" pull hanle. They had a 5' piece threaded on each end for $17 but I what thinking 4' then I saw a 10'j for $19 and they cut it to give me a 4' and 6' pipe so for $2 we got a 6' stick too. :thumbsup:

A 12 mile test drive (empty) indicated we were back to running as smooth before. We used the 7000 red click jack from TSC ($40?) in the front bumper step holes which maxed out it limits for the most part. Some day we will go under the rear with the 20 ton jack and check out the lateral run there but the steering wheel shake is gone now.

 

[ModMech]

An F-700 will have a GVW of around 26k - 28k as I recall, that is generally 9k or 10k on the steer and 16k - 18k on the drive.

Even at 85 psi, you have more tire than spring and at 95 psi more tire than you'd need even modestly over loaded.

We were a 100% Michelin fleet and I spent as much as $10k/month on tires, that was almost 15 years ago now and a LOT of tires. Never had a failure with a Michelin, even a cap. When we moved from 10R22.5 to 11R22.5 we also stopped using caps because in our (bus) operation, it actually COST MORE to cap than to buy virgin tires and trade them in at the time.

Good idea on ditching the split rims! Magically, every split-rim we dismounted had a small crack in it ... somewhere and was replaced with a tubelss rim/tire.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

ModMech I am so happy to now have the one piece radial Dayton rims especially since they came with new Kumho KRS02 10 R22.5 steers and and good looking recapped drives with full tread. While they are not mud grips they are fine for me because I have little need to pay in the mud anymore.

I think GVW on our old 1989 F700 may be 23.001 pounds because I remember that was good for insurance, etc. While the old truck can still work some it should be all we until I am 90. The twin 3-stage hoist on it was a main attraction for me. :thumbsup:

After I got the one piece wheels mounted the shop across the street from my office put them in the bed so I would not have to come back with the trailer and pick them up. The drives were new 10.00 x 20's complete with new liners and tubes that I gave $450 for mounted in Cleveland TN before I make the 300 mile trip home in it. the drives were old 9.00 x 20's. I was hoping to get $200 out of all 6 but the demand is next to zero so while I had them on the truck (not wanting to touch them again) I went by the only big tire shop in town. The owner was on a tractor service call but when he got in he was not very interested but I kept talking so finally he got up in the truck (had my stool ready for him :laughing and looked at them. I could see he saw what I told him about them was true and knew there was aways old farm trucks/trailers needed a cheap out so I asked if he would give me $100. He said for all six and I said yes. He called a guy over and told him to roll them out of the way when he flipped them of the 4' bed then got down and gave me a $100 bill.

He will be able to sell them for $500 in time and my physical limitations are so that I would have given them to him because I can not get one up off the ground.