Looking at 40-ish HP options

[vvanders]

We'll be moving to our new place that we've been building over the last year-ish. Going from 2.5ac of mud in the winter/dust in the summer to 5ac of lush farmland. Here's what it looked like ~4 weeks ago before the grass really took off.

While the Ford has been good to us as the field at the new house has grown it's clear that the 17HP PTO isn't enough to drive our little 5ft flail mower in the really thick stuff, so new tractor shopping time!

I've done a pretty exhaustive search of the dealers up here on the peninsula and in no particular order there's Kubota(20min, 1hr), Mahindra(10min, 1.5hr), LS(1hr), Deere(1hr). I've got a rough list of tractors to go look at but want to be sure I'm not missing anything before I start kicking tires. We're still at least a couple months out with the move and everything.

As far as tractor work I consider the non-inclusive list to be:
-Mowing, probably moving up to a 6/7ft flail after the Ford is sold.
-Horse upkeep, we've got 5 equines now and plan to dedicate a decent portion of our land to their care and setup.
-Moving round bales, for more economical feeding of above.
-Loader work, plan to possibly put in a small pond and any other small ground work. We've got a great excavator that's around the corner to do our super-heavy stuff.
-PHD for planting large grove + occasional fence post.
-Upkeep of gravel/dirt roads to barn/field/etc.
-Hauling tractor on 7k equip trailer to help out family and friends.

One thing that's tripping me up is that last one. Our 7k trailer weights about 1.5k, it seems like with most loaders being around 1.5k as well that leaves me with either 4k for tractor + attachments or deal with detachable loader each time I want to haul it with an attachment on the back. If I want to do the former I'm looking at 3.5k lb tractors otherwise a bunch of great options open up in the 4k lb+ range. Upgrading the trailer isn't an option as the truck is rated to 7.4k towing anyway.

With that said here's the list:
Kubota L4060 HST
Kubota L4701 HST
Kubota MX4800 HST

LS XR4140/XR4145 HST
LS MT345 HST

Mahindra 1640 HST
Mahindra 2538 HST

Really like the options on the L4060 although would like to maybe see a bit more HP but can't justify the $5k jump to the L4760. The XR4145 looks great but at 4k lbs it's going to be on the heavy side. Don't know much about the Mahindras yet other than they seem popular up where we're moving.

Also not sure what to do about remotes, don't currently have any plans for attachments that need them but the consensus that I've seen here is to always get at least one at purchase.

Any other options/models that I missed? Would love to have a chance to cross-shop Kioti too as the local dealer here is fantastic but not keen on being 3h drive away if anything goes wrong.

 

[jeff9366]

I consider myself a generous person. However, I have made it clear to my neighbors that I do not work on other private land routinely. You express concern over machine costs. Helping friends may double your costs and is more likely to impair than improve inter-family relations.

I fuel my tractor and I grease it. Other tractor/implement maintenance is done by my Kubota dealer or the welding shop. My tractor cost $30,000 and I have about $30,000 additional in implements and attachments. I figure my tractor/implement operating cost is $35 to $40 per hour. Trailering will increase your hourly cost. Doing most of your own tractor and implement maintenance will decrease your cost, perhaps to $25 per hour, if you have the tools, mechanical skills and want to spend your free time wrenching, after caring for the horses.

You will seldom have optimal implements for other's tasks. Many projects require passes over the land with two or three implements in succession.
Your friends will not know exactly where water, power, cable lines are and septic tanks and lines, new and old, are. Cutting a utility line is expensive and will make your host angry.
Your friends will not realize how unstable tractors are and will expect you to operate on slopes, which are hazardous due to the danger of rollover.

I donate tractor time in emergencies, which are usually hurricane related where I live. I am amenable to helping residents over the age of eighty. I am seventy. My Kubota L3560 is my third tractor.

 

[jeff9366]

Our 7k trailer weights about 1.5k, it seems like with most loaders being around 1.5k as well that leaves me with either 4k for tractor + attachments or deal with detachable loader each time I want to haul it with an attachment on the back. If I want to do the former I'm looking at 3.5k lb tractors otherwise a bunch of great options open up in the 4k lb+ range. Upgrading the trailer isn't an option as the truck is rated to 7.4k towing anyway.

Tractors are spec'ed DRY. You need to allow for eight gallons combined of engine oil and transmission fluid plus ten gallons of diesel fuel.

The tractors you are considering are too tall to fit in your garage, even with ROPS folded.
Tractors are theft prone, especially in your case, as you are not far from an international boundary. Plan for tractor security.

How wide is your trailer? Tractors you are considering have rear tire spread of around 68" with R1/ag tires, around 72" wide with R4/industrial tires.

Operating width of implements is generally a tad wider than rear tire width. Overall width of implements varies but generally about 12" wider than implement operating width.


Your land is beautiful and the air looks pristine. In selecting a retirement location CLEAN AIR was at the top of my priority list and SMALL TOWN at the top of my wife's priorities. I think your location and site are wonderful. (I passed my first seventeen years in Seattle, then population 350,000.)

 

[oosik]

Looks like you will have some mowing to do around the acreage. Nice looking place - many opportunities for projects - specifically tree planting.

Anyhow - I completely agree with Jeff. DO NOT determine your new tractor needs based upon supplying services to friends, relatives or neighbors. You will be getting yourself into a thankless, expensive and potentially combative situation.


It very nice that you would help others but if its going to impact your initial or operational costs - I'd have a long discussion with the "others" about that.

I have several implements along with the M6040 Kubota. Total value is very near $82K and very likely to increase as I travel the web looking for the "ultimate" implement. I'm quite fortunate out here in the "sticks" or "boondocks", whatever its called. All my neighbors have their own tractors or will have as soon as they get settled in.

You might want to look at the smaller M series of Kubota tractors also.

 

[rngrrymd]

Based on your options, I believe u can expect to pay between $40k - $46k for the GrandL4060 with a cab. Looks like the list is $8065 less on Kubota website for a ROPS model so roughly $30k-$35k for one of those because cabs cost more than just the cab when you add wipers, defrost, larger alternators, etc. Depends if you get a sun cover and lights etc as options for the ROPS model. I got quoted prices a little on the higher end when I was shopping because I included 3rd SCV, the quick coupler for the hoses, a heavy duty bucket w/bolt-on edge and some other niceties. If you are going up on horsepower get a price on the L6060 instead of the L4760 - they seem to be close in price. Seems like the L4760 is more of an odd size and the dealers around my area tended to stock the 40HP and 60HP versions. If you have good credit and don't mind dropping 20% down-payment u can get 0% for 84 months right now as well. As far as Jeff's comments on protecting your investment - if u finance Kubota will make u purchase KCIC insurance anyways and that does cover theft loss but I would recommend as Jeff implies you put up a building to house the tractor in long term (the horse barn?). I really liked the Kubota - if Kubota didn't have the 20% down-payment requirement I might have picked the Grand L instead of the Case 75C I just purchased.
And I agree, you have to be careful you don't become the free tractor support guy - kind of like having a pool and everyone comes to your house to swim at the pool. The hidden cost is when all those people swimming at your pool are eating your food and drinking your beverages without any reimbursement to you. Had a neighbor like that growing up. Heaven knows how much they spent for all the relatives and friends swimming there all summer long.

 

[Omega Woods]

Given your restrictions, I'd go with the lightest of what you have listed. All good units. I'm partial to the LS but my local dealer is way far off.

 

[Groo]

I think you are looking for way more machine than you really need. You need more HP than you currently have, but a BX or 1 series can meet your HP requirement without added size.
All you really need size for is to lift a round bale; 1200lbs on the high end, so all you really need is about 1500lb capacity. Does that have to be with the loader, or could it be with a 3 point?

A Deere 3 series woould do all you want. the 30XXr tractors come in at 2900lbs with an open cab and a 1600lb loader capacity
Smaller than the L4060 with nearly the same loader strength.

 

[rngrrymd]

Here is a listing for Washington Tractor for a 3033R for $26,749:

217 JOHN DEERE 333R For Sale In Ellensburg, Washington | TractorHouse.com

 

[Groo]

Here is a listing for Washington Tractor for a 3033R for $26,749:

217 JOHN DEERE 333R For Sale In Ellensburg, Washington | TractorHouse.com

the loader on that one is weaker than the loader they list on the new ones. I wonder why?
I might be easier to swap to a heavier loader, or up cylinder size. Not sure on that one.

 

[rngrrymd]

Good catch, Groo. OP would want the H165 loader on a 2017 model or 320R loader on the new 2018 models to get the 1,598 lb lift. The newer 2018 models moved the fuel fill to the left rear fender as well which is nicer than this 2017 older model unit. I never got to see a loader on a 3R series with a cab and had to drive almost 1.5 hours to even test drive a cab model they are so scarce around here.

Here are 2 interesting listings:

From Mutton Power: 218 JOHN DEERE 339R For Sale In Fort Wayne, Indiana | TractorHouse.com
From Ag-Pro: 218 JOHN DEERE 339R For Sale In MIDDLEBURG, Florida | TractorHouse.com

From the looks of it the Ag-Pro internet guy was lazy and stole Mutton Power's pictures for his listing. That or Tractorhouse is showing it wrong.

 

[vvanders]

Thanks for all the feedback, definitely some stuff to mull over. Couple things in no particular order:

1. Tractor is getting its own storage. We've already got two tractors(wife's Ferguson TE-20 and our Ford 1500) so we're planning some sort of structure to keep them out of the sun/rain and whatever we choose going to make sure it will fit it.

2. I may have over-emphasized helping neighbors/family. I'd like to have the *option* but completely understand turning down work if needed. If I go with a dealer that's 1hr+ away I also don't want to have to hassle them to come out and pick it up.

3. Plan to go open station. Weather is pretty nice where we'll be at 17" of rain a year and moderate temp so cab seems overkill.

Ended up kicking some tires soon that I thought and stopped by the local LS dealer in town. Pretty impressed overall with them and also added the XG3140 HST to the list. Been a bit of trouble tracking down prices for them online so was pretty impressed with the initial, non-haggled prices.

$26k for the XR4140, $22k for XG3140 HST. Loader capacity is pretty impressive, 2200 for XG3140, 2700 for XR4140.

XR4140 is definitely pretty large and may be too big for what we need, at least for being able to haul on a 7k trailer. Forgot to get a quote for an MT3 but liked the size, XR4140 is the only one that comes with remotes standard.

Next on the list is probably Kubota, going to have till we get up till we can look at Mahindra since there's no dealer close to where we're living now.

 

[vvanders]

I think you are looking for way more machine than you really need. You need more HP than you currently have, but a BX or 1 series can meet your HP requirement without added size.
All you really need size for is to lift a round bale; 1200lbs on the high end, so all you really need is about 1500lb capacity. Does that have to be with the loader, or could it be with a 3 point?

A Deere 3 series woould do all you want. the 30XXr tractors come in at 2900lbs with an open cab and a 1600lb loader capacity
Smaller than the L4060 with nearly the same loader strength.

I almost omitted the Deere dealership from my list, they're a part of a large corp chain that I haven't been that impressed with.

Back when we got the ford we stopped in a few times to look at implements and couldn't get a single sales person to help us. One person tried to look something up and then just walked off. After going there the 3rd time it became clear that SCUT/CUT owners are somewhat of a second class citizen and I'm a little concerned that getting work done would have to be around their schedule. I'd rather go with a brand where CUTs are their bread and butter. Combined with being an hour away and them not being close cost wise with other brands it'd have to be a serious deal for me to consider them.

 

[vvanders]

Tractors are spec'ed DRY. You need to allow for eight gallons combined of engine oil and transmission fluid plus ten gallons of diesel fuel.

The tractors you are considering are too tall to fit in your garage, even with ROPS folded.
Tractors are theft prone, especially in your case, as you are not far from an international boundary. Plan for tractor security.

How wide is your trailer? Tractors you are considering have rear tire spread of around 68" with R1/ag tires, around 72" wide with R4/industrial tires.

Operating width of implements is generally a tad wider than rear tire width. Overall width of implements varies but generally about 12" wider than implement operating width.


Your land is beautiful and the air looks pristine. In selecting a retirement location CLEAN AIR was at the top of my priority list and SMALL TOWN at the top of my wife's priorities. I think your location and site are wonderful. (I passed my first seventeen years in Seattle, then population 350,000.)

Good point on fluid weight. Our trailer is pretty wide, the ford has it's wheels turned out to widest width and still about a foot clearance on each side. It's a little hard to see from this angle but I think with ag tires I've got the clearance. Probably over the limit on weight though.

Def planning for storage + insurance.

We're really looking forward to getting up to Sequim. Going to have more family nearby, a lot less rain(82in vs 17in a year) and can't wait to get out and explore the Olympic National Park. Gotta finish the house first though. Thankfully we're in the final stages there.

 

[GirlWhoWantsTractor]

Curious how you're going to fit pasture for 5 horses, a barn, a large orchard, and presumably some lawn for the house, on 5 acres. Not saying it can't be done; just trying to get the whole picture. Love your place BTW. Beautiful views!

My point is, sounds like your 5 horses are going to have a fairly small pasture, which means they'll keep it picked pretty clean; the lawn will be close-mowed, and the large orchard will be grass-free, so maybe your mowing tasks won't be very great.

 

[kenmac]

Good point on fluid weight. Our trailer is pretty wide, the ford has it's wheels turned out to widest width and still about a foot clearance on each side. It's a little hard to see from this angle but I think with ag tires I've got the clearance. Probably over the limit on weight though.

Def planning for storage + insurance.

We're really looking forward to getting up to Sequim. Going to have more family nearby, a lot less rain(82in vs 17in a year) and can't wait to get out and explore the Olympic National Park. Gotta finish the house first though. Thankfully we're in the final stages there.

what's the capacity of that trailer ?

 

[vvanders]

It's got two 3.5k axles and about 1500 lbs empty so got about 5.5k to work with. Truck is rated to 7.4k so no plans to change anything. Tows great though, when we hauled up the Ferguson got close to 20mpg.

We're going to figure out layout after we live there for a bit with some temporary fencing, we're on 2.5ac minus the orchard and it fits well so we'll see how we grow into the extra space.

 

[rngrrymd]

Vvanders,
looks like that XG3140H-40HP would be the ticket for your weight issue. 2,884 lbs for the tractor, 728 lbs for loader less bucket, add the bucket and say 4k lbs. 2,189 lb capacity of loader looks good. I was reading that the recommended size of property ratio for horses is 1 horse to 2 acres so you are going to definitely be handling round bales to make up feed demands of 5 horses.
Understand your thoughts on Deere dealer. Doesn't seem to be limited to one brand - I got negligible help at red, blue and green dealers alike.
Nice place up there, last time I was in your area was April 2012 - they just got the road open to Hurricane Ridge the week before. The snow up there was 20' high if I remember right.

 

[vvanders]

Yeah, it wasn't on my radar but seeing it in person definitely added it, still want to check out L4701 and L4060 plus whatever Mahindra options there are. Like I said at the start we're still probably a few months before actually picking anything up.

Luckily two of our equines are donkeys so they're a bit lighter on the feed side of things. Still on board with round bales, the price difference is just too big to pass up.

We're really happy with the land, wanted to get up to the pennisula to be near family, the acreage and view was a bonus.

 

[Tractorable]

You have a couple Yanmar dealers near you. They make really nice tractors and Yanmar builds the entire tractor including the engine in Japan. Check out the YT235 and YT347 while you’re comparison shopping.

 

[gladehound]

40hp can be had is basically two different frame sizes. I have and example of the larger frame size and I think this is too big for your truck / trailer combo.

I have a Kioti DS4510HS but they make a 40 hp version too. Dry weight is 3,500. But with fluids, my brush cage, filled rears, loader and forks it's 6,500 pounds.

Kioti also makes a 40hp tractor that is smaller in every dimension and lighter as well so you get the HP, a little less lift but in a more manageable package for trailering.

I only use Kioti as an example here because I know the line but I'm believe most manufacturers cross over frame size at around 40HP. Since you don't seem to need the lift of the larger frame models and you do need something small enough to trailer with what you have, a smaller framed 40HP seems to be the right choice.