LA304FEL not level possible problem (pics)

[displacedPA]

I just can up from the shop and snapped a few pics. I found 6bolts loose on the sub frame. three on each side. My original complaint was that the right side of the loader sat higher than the left. these pics and bolt holes agree with why the bucket is not level. Like others have said before and inch time 6feet is a lot. I don't think these were tight from the get go it kinda irritates me but, in the same token I should have gone over the bolts with a torque wrench before i started using it. I will try and caption the pics as best as possible.
right side of tractor is from the drivers seat.

right side top hole sub frame is raised hitting bottom of bolt. indicating right side is higher than the left. this is the fith pic down.

the pic where the bolt is removed and all the metal shavings are is the left side of the tractor. the side that is lower than the right.

hope the good news is that the loader arms are not bent as a result of all this.

My thoughts for righting this wrong is to mount the loader and place the tractor on a level surface then loosen bolt and apply down force with the bucket. hoping there is enough slop in the holes to get everything back in square. then tighten to factory specs with a torque wrench..


Im open to suggestions on fixes and what to do.

 

[BeezFun]

I'd run a tap through those threaded holes to clean them up, unless you're sure all those chips are from the bolts and you can just blow them out. I think your approach is right.
I think I'll go out and check my loader bolts...

 

[displacedPA]

I think I do need to tap the holes again however finding a 17mm tap might be hard to do. I have a tool supplier at work perhaps he will have one on hand.
Getting back to the loose bolts has anyone else ever had this problem>?

I was thinking last night should I try and straighten things with a bottle jack with the loader off and the loader bolts loose? thought this method maybe more acurate.

 

[Grateful11]

I can't tell from the the picture but are the threads messed up all the way to the depth that the bolt will go in after you get everything cleaned up? I ask because I wonder if it was cross threaded when they mounted the loader.

Unless I'm looking at it wrong the bracket needs to come down so loosing the the others might do the trick.

Makes me want to check ours.

 

[displacedPA]

The bolt on the left of the tractor is crossed and more than likely done with and impact at the dealer. I could see the front of the hole is damaged but the thread looked good deeper in the hole Im going to try and find a tap and perhaps some new bolts if needed. I hope only the one bolt is crossed I havent checked the rest yet. the side that is high is the right side and thats the side that is high when the loader is on as well. I feel rather sure that the out of level is just a result of the sub frame being loose. and shifted. When I first put my rachet on the bolt i was amazed how loose it was!!! then to find all 6 I couldnt belive it!! The front bolts which are 18 or 19mm were tighter still not as tight as i would have expected though..

 

[beckmurph]

Isn't this a new b2320? Let the selling dealer fix this. Rather replace it.

 

[displacedPA]

Isn't this a new b2320? Let the selling dealer fix this. Rather replace it.

I would like to do that however that is one of the draw backs I was afraid of by buying out of state. I could contact them but what can they do for me they are 6 hours away. maybe send me new bolts>?

 

[displacedPA]

or by replace it do you mean the whole loader?

 

[displacedPA]

The loader manual calls for m12 by 1.75 pitch bolts however. the guide sheet in the back of the FEL manual says the bolt I pulled out of the hole is a m10 by 40mm long. (not sure of the pitch.) I pulled a few more bolts last night and discovered though not all the threads are crossed as bad as the one in the pics in my earlier post. The top of the thread pitch on the bolts are all pressed down. This indicates to me that the wrong thread pitch has been used?
these bolts go directly into the clutch housing on the tractor. I could retap them ect. but im not sure that this should really be my problem. Dealer used the worng bolts.... The tractor was bought out of state and is still under a year old. I have KTAC insurance also.
Im going to go to the fastener store and check to make sure that bolt is indeed the wrong size.

I then need to figure out what to do next.
any sugestions would be apperciated.

thanks guys

 

[beckmurph]

Yes, have them replace it. They should replace the whole
kit and kabutol. That is somewhat extreme, but those bolts
have to be tight to hold the loader frame inplace. I would speak with
selling dealer and see what there solution would be.
Good luck.

 

[displacedPA]

spoke with the selling dealer. they wanted to come pick it up and fix it weather it be a new tractor or just new bolts and tap the holes. I stressed the point that I want the loader to be level when its all said and done. I also said that I want to make sure that the housing that the loader attaches to is not damaged. They were very nice and said they could bring me another tractor ect. while mine is being fixed.
I think its still and assy. issue or manufacturing issue. the fact that all the bolts on the right side have crossed threads the entire length of the bolt points someone got happy on the impact and damaged all three bolts or the holes on that side of the frame were messed up from the factory.

 

[Deano]

spoke with the selling dealer. they wanted to come pick it up and fix it weather it be a new tractor or just new bolts and tap the holes. I stressed the point that I want the loader to be level when its all said and done. I also said that I want to make sure that the housing that the loader attaches to is not damaged. They were very nice and said they could bring me another tractor ect. while mine is being fixed.
I think its still and assy. issue or manufacturing issue. the fact that all the bolts on the right side have crossed threads the entire length of the bolt points someone got happy on the impact and damaged all three bolts or the holes on that side of the frame were messed up from the factory.

Nice Dealer...hard to find!

 

[radioman]

If the dealer is willing to fix it - I'd let them if they would be willing to do it on site while you are watching. If worse comes to worse- all they gotta do is give you a loaner and they can take it for a real fix.

I'd also would document this and call ktac and let them know the dealer is willing to fix, but you are concerned about long term usability past warranty stage since any metal that is fragmented like that, since its a point of impact forces it could very well become loose and be a big problem.

Chances are if the wrong bolts were used - if you are keeping same machine - a real fix is to bore out the holes to next size up bolts and rethread everything to same sizee in good metal. this is no easy job.

 

[displacedPA]

The dealer will look at the problem on site before taking it back to their shop. Given my mechanical backround this is not a driveway fix. It kills me becasue I know I can do the fix. My thoughts are though I should not have to fix these problems on a brand new peice of equipment. I also should not have these problems on such a low hour machine...

I reinstalled two bolts last night and could not get them to go in fully because they are crossed so badly. I left them like that. so they can see the severity. I numbered all the bolts with a sharpie so i didnt get the holes and bolts confused ect. I may take some more pics tonight just for documentation purposes.

part of me hopes they want to replace the houseing but im sure they will opt for re tapping the holes which is fine. so long as its done properly. I will admit im OCD especially when it comes to mechanical things. I expect the loader to be back in level and the bolt and holes to be refreshed or replaced.
when they email me on monday i want to make all that clear to them.

As far as KTAC i understand maybe i should let them know but. I wasnt going to file a claim with them. I wonder if it would help the dealer if I made a claim or not>?


PS im not disclosing the dealer at this time because i feel they are doing the right thing and making every attempt to make things right. Even if this isnt their mistake they are taking full reponseablity. :thumbsup:

 

[don white]

If this is new equipment I would not just retap. There is no way those threads are going to be as strong original. You are looking for trouble down the road. If you have numerous bad threads then someone put the wrong bolts in and everything needs to be fixed and fixed right. I would think the dealer would be responsible to pick up fix and return this machine.

 

[displacedPA]

If this is new equipment I would not just retap. There is no way those threads are going to be as strong original. You are looking for trouble down the road. If you have numerous bad threads then someone put the wrong bolts in and everything needs to be fixed and fixed right. I would think the dealer would be responsible to pick up fix and return this machine.

Don,

Those are my same thoughts. like I stated earlier I have every bolt marked for my own peice of mind. You can bet Ill be removing every bolt to inspect the holes. I really think the housing should be replaced. They said they would change it if needed. The more I think about it the more im worried about long term reliablity. The more I want them to replace the housing. They are driving 6hours one way to come pick up the machine. I would think they would want to fix it right the first time.

 

[Recoveryhill]

If the dealer installed the loader frame with undersize bolts, the dealer must make good on this problem. Even if you clean the female threads up, in the housing and install the correct bolts, you are at risk of not being able to maintain proper torque and risk of having a bolt strip the receiver threads completely.

A competent machine shop would be able to install a thread insert to regain the proper threads in the clutch housing, assuming there is sufficient meat in the housing to take an oversized hole.

If in fact they did install undersize bolts, were it I, the tractor would go back to the selling dealer for a replacement tractor and let them sort out the patch. The liability to Kubota and the dealer of having the loader fail should give them some incentive to see it your way.

If the bolts are proper size and the threads buggered either when installed or damaged by becoming loose, the issue of who is at fault is less clear. Your insurance should step in and cover a fix, I assume.

Good luck and don't take any wooden nickels.

 

[Slimson]

I just can up from the shop and snapped a few pics. I found 6bolts loose on the sub frame. three on each side. My original complaint was that the right side of the loader sat higher than the left. these pics and bolt holes agree with why the bucket is not level. Like others have said before and inch time 6feet is a lot. I don't think these were tight from the get go it kinda irritates me but, in the same token I should have gone over the bolts with a torque wrench before i started using it. I will try and caption the pics as best as possible.
right side of tractor is from the drivers seat.

right side top hole sub frame is raised hitting bottom of bolt. indicating right side is higher than the left. this is the fith pic down.

the pic where the bolt is removed and all the metal shavings are is the left side of the tractor. the side that is lower than the right.

hope the good news is that the loader arms are not bent as a result of all this.

My thoughts for righting this wrong is to mount the loader and place the tractor on a level surface then loosen bolt and apply down force with the bucket. hoping there is enough slop in the holes to get everything back in square. then tighten to factory specs with a torque wrench..


Im open to suggestions on fixes and what to do.

I'm curious how much off level is your loader?
Because I just discovered on my L3200 one side is 5/8" higher than the other.
I'm new to FEL operation, so don't know what is to be expected- just noted that when lowering a pallet with my forks, one side lands before the other side. So I measured it on a level surface.
I will be interested to learn whether re-securing your sub-frame properly addresses the out of level condition.

 

[NoTrespassing]

I'm curious how much off level is your loader?
Because I just discovered on my L3200 one side is 5/8" higher than the other.
I'm new to FEL operation, so don't know what is to be expected- just noted that when lowering a pallet with my forks, one side lands before the other side. So I measured it on a level surface.
I will be interested to learn whether re-securing your sub-frame properly addresses the out of level condition.

I'd suggest making sure your tire pressures are exactly the same and check it on a good flat concrete floor before checking anything else. When I bought my L3710 used, the loader didn't sit perfectly flat. The rear tire pressures were slightly different and evening them out fixed most of the problem. I think it's still slightly off but I never notice it doing loader work.

Of course it wouldn't hurt to make sure you don't have the same problem as the OP.

Kevin

 

[Slimson]

I took great pains to check and balance the front tire pressure -now I realize the front axle is on a pivot, so that was a waste of time. The rears were sitting valve down, so didn't check due to liquid fill.
I will check the rears next.
One advantage to living on a flood plain is I know all the low spots in my garage floor. The guy that poured the floor did a good job leveling it.