Kubota B2650 and B3350 info and hints

[califr]

Just have 6 hours on my new 3350. Have a B2782B 63" blower. Been between -30 an 19 here in NW Wisconsin, since i picked up my tractor. Blower and tractor both get high marks so far. I am confused on the DPF regen. My manual says its in the auto mode by default. Without pressing any buttons? I also thought I heard my salesperson say you have to hit the lower right button to place in auto regen mode.

Well after 6 hours the tractor shut down. Dealer picked up and said a hi temp code was triggered. I have been letting tractor warm up fefore using for 15-29 min in low idle. i also had the dealer install a block heater and trickle charger pigtails. Is this the cause of the DPF buildup?

I want to give this system a chance, but need some help.

When operating in cold temps, what tips do you have for DPF to funtion optimally. How long between regen cycles typically?

Thanks

 

[2010drive]

Califr,

I have a B3350 with a 63" blower as well. The tractor does not go into the auto mode automatically as silly as it sounds, you need to press the auto button each time you start the tractor.

My tractor also shutdown on it's own while blowing snow at 2500RPM without any warning, I tried starting it backup and it would not even turnover. I let it cool down for about 30 min and went back out and it started right up and the DPF light came on so I did a parked regen (about 20 min) and all was fine afterwards. So yours is most likely DPF related as well.

The tractor needs to be running high RPM's during a regen (I believe it's between 2300-2500), if you move the throttle during a regen it will interrupt the regen. So make sure you don't touch the throttle lever during a regen.

Mine typically regens every 10 hours, I start it at half throttle (1300-1500RPM) like the manual recommends and let it warmup at half throttle for 10-15 minutes or until I see at least 1 bar on the temp gauge. I also run it all full throttle during use.

 

[bumperm]

Agree with 2010drive.

If you are going to be running the tractor at around 2200+ rpm, for more than a few minutes, and where the high temps of regen exhaust won't be a problem, then push the lower right AutoRegen light each time you start.

If you don't have the AutoRegen button pushed, and the computer determines its time for a regen, the warning light and maybe the buzzer will sound. If the parked regen light comes on, then a parked regen can be selected (I've only done this once). This is done by pushing that button while at idle rpm - - then leave the throttle alone and don't touch it during the parked regen process. The computer will control throttle which will initially go to full 2500 rpm to heat up the DPF. After awhile it will drop to 2000 rpm and the regen process will continue. If you move the throttle during this process, it will automatically interrupt.

There is a sticker on the left rear of the cab vertical post that describes regen indications and options - - not particularly easy to understand, as like the manual it is somewhat cryptic until you go through it.

As 2010drive says, you don't want to warm up at low idle. In fact the manual cautions against prolonged low throttle setting operations. That said, if I get out of the tractor for a few minutes, I'll drop it to idle. If it's going to be 5 minutes or more, unlike other diesel tractors I've owned, I'll shut it down. Doesn't seem logical to leave it sitting there doing nothing at higher rpm.

One thing I wish they included in the parked regen cyle would be the option to have the tractor auto shut down when the process is finished. As it is, they tell you to not leave the tractor unattended. Wife said, "Dinner!", so I left it doing it's thing. When regen is finished, it drops down to a low idle and just sits there running - - loading up the DPF again! Until you think to go check on it and turn it off.

My dealer, who it seems was not familiar with the manual's recommendations, said to leave the auto regen button off, and only push it when the regen light comes on. I find it easier to follow the manual and run it with auto-regen enabled if I'm mowing, snow blowing, or running the backhoe - stuff that is done at higher rpm - and if I'm planning on running the tractor long enough for a regen to be accomplished. Regen indicator comes on telling you it's doing it's thing and it's all pretty painless.

Another thing to be aware of is turbocharger cool down. I can't find anything in the manual re this, but standard procedure with other turbos is to not shut down immediately after dropping power from full throttle. Rather take it to idle and let it idle for at least a minute or so to give the turbo a chance to cool down some to avoid coking the oil in the turbo bearings.



bumper

 

[califr]

Great advice guys, thank you. Seems like you tamed the DPF beast!

 

[bumperm]

califr,

Forgot to address a couple of your questions. The block heater and charging pigtail would not affect DPF (save the block heater which will help extend time between regen cycles by allowing easier starts).

Time between DPF cycles is dependent on operating conditions. My first regen was at 13.9 hours IIRC, and I have seen as short a time as 10 or 11 hours between regens as well. I had the auto regen button on while operating the tractor at near full rpm. Only indication regen was happening was the regen indicator light came on and stayed on for maybe 10 minutes or so (didn't time it, don't know for sure, but it sure seemed much quicker than the previous regen cylces I've seen (my tractor has 55 hours now so haven't had all that many.

Like diesel cars that will clean out the DPF during longer freeway driving, our DPF should extend time between regen events simply by running at or near full throttle.

Of interest: http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/23715/conventional-vs-synthetic-oil

bumper

 

[robstaples]

Boy am I thrilled. I have a prince type pto hydraulic pump that I was using on my L39 for my hydr snow blower. Fitting on my new B3350, it was tight so I added a pto extender ( about 4 inches). Things seemed fine to start and the blower was working. Looking back at the pto, I noticed a wiggle. Apparently the extra length of the shaft and the weight of the pump caused the shaft to bend. I thought it was the extension and tried another. for a monent. The tractor shaft is bent.. not a lot but the pump shakes. I'm moving toward a remote pump mount with a drive shaft. I thought I might be able to bend it back. Thoughts? ( I broke it with less then 6 hours.. Wife is thrilled at my competence!! olto )

 

[robstaples]

Opened another thread and got this resolved.. The extenders had the wobble in them not the tractor shaft. Working on a remote pump.

 

[robstaples]

bumperm, I had my first regen today and the engine light stays on after the engine rpms drop ( from parked regen) .
The manual doesn't say what happens after regen( or I've missed it) After parked regen and flashing ! engine light , I restarted engine and the regen came back on so I hit auto regen and it seem to do more. ?? Any insight would be appreciated.

PS I had to tow my stopped ( won't restart) tractor out of the narrow icy street in front of my house where I was snow blowing and wait 30-45 minutes before it would restart. Tier 4 .... thanks Gov!!

 

[califr]

After my Dealer wrench talked to the Kubota rep, he indicated that the ECU is shutting the tractor down in very cold weather. This is independent of the regen issue. The two sensors on top of the DPF canister are working, but in colder weather, the ECU has a programming problem showing a temp that triggers shutdown. Kubota is contemplating reprogramming the ECU to prevent these unwarranted shutdowns.

When you are in parked regen mod, the rpms go uo and then come down as you indicated. The regen cycle doesnt end when you hear the rpm's decrease tho. You have to wait until the cycle light goes off. Then it is finished.

I placed cardboard over the radiator with a 5" hole cut out in the center. This allows my engine temp to get up to at least 3 bars. I am blowing snow in the minus 10 to 20 degree range here! Hopefully this will lengthen the time between regen cycles.

Take Care

 

[ZZZ2D1]

Can someone paste the shop vac method for saving fluids - can not seem to find it.

 

[nightdevil]

subscribe

 

[bumperm]

Can someone paste the shop vac method for saving fluids - can not seem to find it.

I apologize, for some reason I was no longer getting emailed notices of posts here, so haven't looked in a few weeks . . .

The Shop Vac method for changing the HST filter while saving (not draining) the fluid for the 50 hour "filter only" change:

Remove the yellow rubber plug cap at the rear of the tractor. Find a suitable adapter that will fit snugly in this hole. You may have to use a couple of adapters to get the hose size of your vac - many vacs include a taper round nozzle that helps - the adapter should have as big an ID hole as possible so as to not restrict the vacuum suck too much. I used a plastic fuel nozzle that fit nicely.

Loosen the filter. On the B3350 this is the filter on the left rear side. Prepare new filter by coating O-ring with a light coat of silicone grease or motor oil. Put an oil drain pan under filter - - there will be a small loss, maybe a pint or so. Get into a comfortable position with the new filter handy. Remove old filter and put on new filter.

Side note:

After my 50 hour change, the tractor started much easier without so much of the staggering and stumbling as before. I'm using Chevron Delco 400LE synthetic 5-40 weight oil (the manual calls for 15-40) not sure if this is making for easier starts, but I suspect so. In any case, to help protect the turbo from oil coking, I would only use a synthetic oil. I also always allow the engine to idle for at least 30 seconds to before shut down.

bumper

 

[Paystar]

Why would anybody NOT change the fluid? Crazy. Oil is cheap compared to repairs.
And even though the owners manual says filters only at 50 hours......the shop/service manual says hydro oil MUST be changed at 50 hours.

 

[bumperm]

And some people change their car engine oil at 3K miles when the manufacturer recommends 5K or even 10K (as Toyota does on my FJ). Things change, better fluids and other factors combine to make longer recommended service intervals. Frankly, while I don't think it's "crazy" to change fluids more often than that, I do think it wasteful and overkill for no benefit. However, if it makes you feel good . . .

There are a number of "conflicts" between the Kubota Work Shop Manual and the Operator's Manual that comes included with the tractor. The WSM has an issue date of 12 - 2012, while the OM has a date of 2013 (no month indicated). I conclude the OM takes precedence and checked to confirm this with my Kubota dealer.

The maintenance schedule in the OM says the HST filter needs to be replaced at 50 -200 - and 400 hours. However, the Kubota Super UDT2 (newer synthetic HST oil) is scheduled to be replaced only after the first 400 hours and every 400 hours thereafter. There's 4 gallons of UDT2, so just over $100 worth. Won't hurt a thing to change it more often than recommended. I'm complying with the OM and leaving mine in until the called for 400 hours of service, unless there's sign of water contamination, discoloration - and at just 60 hours now, it looks as new. I did buy 6 gallons of UDT2, just to have on hand.

bumper

 

[Paystar]

Not arguing....I'd just rather dump the breakin oil. Mine was pretty black.
I might send SOS samples in to Cat like I do with the big truck just to see how it holds up, so I know when to change it. Might take me a while to get 400 hours. Longer than I would want to keep the same oil in it anyway.

 

[Paystar]

Not arguing....I'd just rather dump the breakin oil. Mine was pretty black.
I might send SOS samples in to Cat like I do with the big truck just to see how it holds up, so I know when to change it. Might take me a while to get 400 hours. Longer than I would want to keep the same oil in it anyway.

 

[bumperm]

Not arguing....I'd just rather dump the breakin oil. Mine was pretty black.
. . . .

What? Black? Are we talking about the same thing? HST oil should *never* be black! If so, that would surely mean that something was grossly overheating in the tranny and I would have expected some sort of catastrophic failure to have happened many hours prior. Seriously, HST oil should, even after hundreds of hours, look almost like the day it was born. Water contamination can make it milky or with froth.

What Kubota installs for HST oil in a new tractor is not "break in" oil, it is the same UDT2 synthetic oil they recommend using throughout the life of the tractor.

Now when I changed my engine oil, that was black, as one would expect oil to be after 50 hours in a diesel engine.

bumper

 

[robstaples]

I just got my 3350 back from the dealer. They worked with Kubota technical and resolved my problem. Symptoms: wouldn't regen in the cold. Would indoors but not out in 25degree or lower. They replaced the regen glow plug. Wasn't getting hot enough. My dpf ought to be really clean as they forced 4 or 5 regens resolving the problem. 6 hours run time and a tank of fuel. Nice to have it back. I just need one more big snow fall to test my finished blower.��

 

[Paystar]

What? Black? Are we talking about the same thing? HST oil should *never* be black! If so, that would surely mean that something was grossly overheating in the tranny and I would have expected some sort of catastrophic failure to have happened many hours prior. Seriously, HST oil should, even after hundreds of hours, look almost like the day it was born. Water contamination can make it milky or with froth.

What Kubota installs for HST oil in a new tractor is not "break in" oil, it is the same UDT2 synthetic oil they recommend using throughout the life of the tractor.

Now when I changed my engine oil, that was black, as one would expect oil to be after 50 hours in a diesel engine.

bumper

Yes, hst/hydraulic oil. Was not "black" but clearly used oil. And I know it is not some kind of "break-in" oil. But I like to over maintain my stuff and when it is all new parts working for the first time after manufacture.....I change MY oil.
And no, was not overheated. Everything is fine and tractor works well.
I do fluid sampling on my big truck but for 4 gallons of premium udt in the little Kubota, I'm not too worried about it. No big deal to change it.

 

[WilliamBos]

What? Black? Are we talking about the same thing? HST oil should *never* be black! If so, that would surely mean that something was grossly overheating in the tranny and I would have expected some sort of catastrophic failure to have happened many hours prior. Seriously, HST oil should, even after hundreds of hours, look almost like the day it was born. Water contamination can make it milky or with froth. What Kubota installs for HST oil in a new tractor is not "break in" oil, it is the same UDT2 synthetic oil they recommend using throughout the life of the tractor. Now when I changed my engine oil, that was black, as one would expect oil to be after 50 hours in a diesel engine. bumper

Maybe if you never use your tractor, it will stay clear, but lots of use will brown it out. Black in the oil was from the assembly process, totally normal. Oil is not that expensive, change and drive on.