John Deere 4200 Rear Diff lock repair

[pollolittle]

Not sure If I'm in the right spot, but we'll see.

The dealer is quoting me 10-12 hours to break the tractor in half and tell me whats wrong at $70 an hour. He said the price would start climbing. Worst case scenario and it would be around $3500.

Which is different from the first dealer I took it too, who changed the oil and charged me two + hours for hydraulic oil change. He quoted me $5500 just to open up the rear end and start replacing items.

Anybody have experience with opening the rear end up and fixing this problem and how much? The three point hitch also is staying engaged at full lift, which I'm told you have to go by it to get to the differential lock.

He also told me my clutch was wearing out and the clutch pedal is out to it's limits, so I need a new clutch.

confused and worn out in Memphis, Tn.

Ordered the service manual today so will look through it and see if I can do this.

Any suggestions or comments appreciated, i think.

 

[jimmysisson]

How old is your tractor in hours? In heavy use? In sleeping outdoors? Are you in a freeze/thaw climate? Happy to help, need more info.
Jim

 

[pollolittle]

How old is your tractor in hours? barely broken in around 950.

In heavy use? mowing my yard and about three times mowing 10 acre pasture, not really heavy use.

In sleeping outdoors? stays up out of the weather under shelter.

Are you in a freeze/thaw climate? In memphis, tn, not really a heavy freeze/thaw climate.

It is the first year production run in 1999, bought it with 100 hours on it, the rest are me sitting in the saddle.

 

[dusty3030]

What is broken on the Diff. lock?
Also, what dealers have you tried? Just curious, I'm near you and I use Greenway in Marion.

 

[pollolittle]

Push the lever down and no engagement, one wheel still spinnning. From what I can tell from researching the web is the engagement piece is normally the culprit. One side is harder than the other and it rounds off the other side, leaving you with no way to engage the lock. Haven't opened up the rearend, nor have I had a dealer do it yet.

Tried the dealer in Somerville. Haven't been to Greenway, most of the service managers must know it is a big job, cause they raise their eyebrows and ruffle their feathers up even just talking about it.

 

[RoyJackson]

950 Hours isn't much for a wet clutch, unless you've been riding the clutch. Is the tractor shifting OK?
BTW, do you have a sync-shift or reverser transmission?

As far as the differential lock...check linkages first although it probably is inside.

The kind of money they're quoting for the repair is getting close to 50% of it's value. You have to consider that...

 

[beenthere]

Do you need to fix if just the diff lock?

Getting the tech manual that you ordered is a first step. A lot of the work getting at it is the busy work of "getting at it", and the reverse of putting it back together.

Any other problems other than the diff lock?

The

.. three point hitch also is staying engaged at full lift,

is just an adjustment of the feedback linkage on near the left side rocker arm. Lengthen it a tiny bit, but the details are in the tech manual that you are getting.

 

[kebo]

If you have some time, and a big cup of coffee (or maybe a beer or three!) I suggest you skim over this entire thread by dfkrug. Dave bought a wore out, abused JD 4300 from a rental shop and rebuilt the motor, tranny, and rear end in it. Lots of great info and good pictures too. You might pay close attention to the section where he repaired the diff lock on that tractor by squaring up the teeth on the difflock, rather than go and buy new parts for it. That was (and is) a great thread for the JD do-it-yourself'er.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/parts-repairs/146974-john-deere-4300-complete-rebuild.html

 

[pollolittle]

BeenThere - I saw the adjustment you were talking about, I have to see if that cures it, it would be great if it did. One less thing to worry about.

Sometimes the FEL will lift like it is supposed to, other times barely move.

I know the clutch is wearing out, I have already adjusted the clutch pedal to the max and the trans still wants to grind when I try to stick it into gear unless the tractor comes to rest in the right spot, then it slips right in no issue. Sounds like the synchronizers.

Looking in the book for splitting the tractor I need the tractor stands at $690 bucks and the clutch tool for $498 and the ball extractor tool for $21. Anybody know where I can either rent, borrow, steal (just Kidding) or alternative methods for splitting the tractor.

Thanks for all the replies, looks like I will be tearing it apart. Now I just gotta figure out how to do it.

Kebo - I browsed through that post by dfkrug and wow. Seems he has different abilities than I with figuring stuff out and manufacturing what he needs.

RoyJackson - Even at 50% of value, if I don't fix it then it is 0% of value. Lets say I don't fix it, then what do I do with it?

 

[John_in_TN]

Re: clutch problem: This is a long-shot, but make sure the transmision/hydraulic oil is at the correct level. With the tractor on a level surface the oil should be at, or slightly below the center of the sight glass. If the oil is above the center of the glass, it can cause the clutch NOT to release completely especially when the nose of the tractor is pointed downhill. (I experienced this problem with the new 4200 that was delivered to me 3/1/1999). After correcting the oil level, I never experienced any similar problems during the seven years & nearly 800 hours that I owned that tractor.

Also, if you have the Collar-Shift transmission it does NOT have any synconizers.

Good luck!

 

[Mighty Dodge]

You definitely need the manual. The diff lock is in the lh final drive. Do you know if they cleaned the suction screen when they changed the oil? If they didn't that could account for the erratic loader operation. Taking the final drive(s) off isn't that hard. I just changed a axle seal in mine a few months ago.

 

[pollolittle]

John in TN - the oil level was at the halfway mark on level ground. then I added fluid yesterday to see if it would change anything. No change. Now the level is toward the top of the glass. Which that is the way it has been for 10 years till the dealer changed it out.

The service manual seems to show synchronizer's and to check them.


I don't know how to post a pic, yet. Otherwise, I would show the pic and then you could explain it to me.

Mighty Dodge - Supposedly they cleaned the suction screen. How did you support the tractor when you split it to change the seal.

 

[dfkrug]

How did you support the tractor when you split it to change the seal.

So you must have the SST, with the 3-speed synchronized gearbox. The
manual (TM1677) is very detailed on how to fix the wet clutch and different
gear trannies. You will have to split the tractor to fix the clutch and
I suggest that if you do not have a hoist, use a cherry picker and rolling
jacks. Keep all the wheels on to facilitate rolling the halves.

For removing one of the rear "trumpet" housings, you don't split the
tractor. Just support the tractor under the central gearbox at the
rear and leave one rear wheel on for stability.

 

[pollolittle]

I have the book TM1677. Looking over it now, I see that I have the CST with no synchronizer assembly that I can find on the parts breakdown.

Here's my problem, then, everytime I go to shift it into gear the gears grind until such time it moves the wheels enough to slide into gear. Maybe I need to start over from the beginning, since I have the attention of more intelligent folks than I. Looking at the digital version of the book and I thought I was looking at synchronizers.

So, what makes it grind and how do I stop it from doing so.

 

[Mighty Dodge]

I didn't have to split the tractor. I just removed one of the final drives.

 

[John_in_TN]

I think you do have a clutch problem. I was just hoping the fix might be simpler than a clutch replacement. Sorry, but I am not a mechanic so I don't have any additional reccomendations.
The problem I experienced is probably rare. My dealer sent mechanics out twice (2 different mechanics) and both just said the tractor needed to wear-in and that the extra oil wouldn't cause the problem. After about fifty hours I somehow punctured the rubber coupling that connects the hydraulic suction tube to the transmission. I went out one morning to find a puddle of oil under the tractor. I needed to move it to a better position before the repair and found that it shifted much better than before. After installing the new coupling, I refilled to the center of the glass (like my manual specified), and never had anymore shifting problems.
Good luck with resolving your problems.

 

[dfkrug]

I think you do have a clutch problem.

I agree. If the clutch is dragging due to contaminated fluid or broken
friction discs or bearings, that will make the gears grind during engagement.

 

[pollolittle]

It is starting to make more sense.

Where do you get your parts from? Cheaper than dealer or equivalent price just mail order.?

You got to love a nice puddle to make a tractor work better.

 

[dfkrug]

Where do you get your parts from? Cheaper than dealer or equivalent price just mail order.?

My last order came from Bomberger's in PA. I have had good parts
sales from Arends Bros in IL also.

First, sign up on JDParts.com, then assign a dealer to your parts price
quotations. It does not have to be a local dealer. My locals have
gone off the charts when it comes to prices. And Deere prices are
already quite high.

 

[pollolittle]

OK, now the tractor is split in half. Now the what! I got the clutch off and seems to measure fine. Unfortunately I don't know what I'm looking for that would cause my problem. I haven't taken the gears out yet. I thought about removing them and taking all of it down to the dealer. The clutch and gear set to see if they could tell me what I had to fix. Any ideas would be great?