JD 5210 Will not restart warm.

[tallbill]

3 months ago I changed fuel filter due to sluggish starting. Then it was OK until recently. Started OK cold, ran it for several hours and shut it down. It would not restart 15 or 20 minutes later. Still would not start the next day. Drained some gunk out of fuel tank bottom and changed the fuel filter. Started like new and runs great, but will not restart while the engine is warm. This has repeated day after day. Any ideas what to try?

 

[Edward. S]

Could try adding some fuel additives or blowing out the air filter and checking radiator if its clean.

 

[JD5210]

When it will not start is the tractor smoking, if no it is most likely a fuel problem.

The fuel tank is not venting, at the back of the fuel tank behind the SMV sign there is a vent make sure it is clean and the tube is clean or temporally just open the fuel tank cap.

Junk in the tank, drain some fuel from the valve at the bottom, back left hand side of the tank.

Clean out the priming pump as the fuel runs up through there here is a video of someone that could not start their tractor for that reason.
JD 5203 John Deere tractor fuel filter change - YouTube

As already suggested summer fuel conditioner JD part number is ty26784.

Make sure the air filters are clean.

Here are some URLs that you may find informative.
//manuals.deere.com/omview/OMRE71736_19/
Leaking Fuel Cap : Solve a leaky fuel cap on some older 5000 series tractors
Loose Muffler on Some 5000 Tractors : Quick fix for loose mufflers or exhaust leaks on certain 5000 series tractors.
//www.deere.com/en_US/ag/servicesupport/tips/augusta/5000/instrpanelfog.html
//www.deere.com/en_US/ag/servicesupport/tips/augusta/5000/bentcylinderrods.html
//www.deere.com/en_US/ag/servicesupport/tips/augusta/5000/backlash.html

This is a John Deere manual on the engine.
//www.visaevolution.com/dati_sito/manuali/officina/motori/john%20deere/ctm125-3029-ENG.pdf

 

[cowski]

blow the fuel line out between filter and tank.make sure the injector pump is hot.

 

[Tx Jim]

Can you hear fuel solenoid click when ign switch is turned on??

 

[tallbill]

All,
I'm heading to farm in GA tomorrow, so I will be able to try your suggestions.
I have blown out the air filter, drained the bottom of the fuel tank, and replaced the priming pump.
I thought the tank vented through the cap, so I will check the vent. I did not know there was a fuel solenoid, so I will listen for a click. Will also pick up some fuel conditioner on the way.
Thanks a bunch for the link to the tech manual and all these suggestions. Wish me luck. I'll let you know how it turns out.
Bill

 

[JD5210]

The fuel solenoid is in the center on top of the injection pump. Must admit I can never heard the click on him. You may want to take a volt meter with you.

 

[mechanic327]

Is this an open station, cab, or straddle mount tractor. This makes all the difference in fixing your tractor. Fuel tank is mounted in different locations.

 

[tallbill]

Is this an open station, cab, or straddle mount tractor. This makes all the difference in fixing your tractor. Fuel tank is mounted in different locations.

It is open station.

 

[bitternut]

Well its been nearly a month since the last update. Has the problem been corrected and if so how was it corrected. I am curious since I also have a 5210 tractor.

 

[tallbill]

Jury is still out.

Fuel tank vent, behind the slow moving vehicle sign, was plugged. Cleaned and reinstalled. Also added fuel treatment.

Fuel line from tank to filter is clear.

Ran good and restarted while hot for several days, then again it would not restart hot. Let it cool and still would not start. I can hear fuel cut-off solenoid inside the injector pump functioning. Also, tried disconnecting the temperature sensor that advances the timing. Still would not start. So, I replaced fuel filter. Followed purging procedure. Working fine so far, but only used tractor several days. Will not be at farm again until July 13.

Thanks for all your help.

Bill

 

[cowski]

trash in fuel tank blow fuel line out between filter and tank. you may have to take the tank off and clean it.what is the fuel level when it does not start?

 

[JD5210]

Thanks for the update. Sounds like you are making some positive headway.

You might consider cutting open the old fuel filter to see if it was plugged. My thinking is you have a vapor lock (not allowing air in to replace fuel or junk being sucked down and held to bottom of tank) and by putting on a new filter you just opened up the system and released the lock. Next time consider just take the old filter off, empty it, put new fuel back in the filter and put it back on.

On my 5210 I have replaced the fuel filter a few times and just by filling the new filter before putting it back on I have not needed to bleed the tractor to get it to start-up.

If you decide to clean out tank here are the steps from the tech manual. If I was going to do this I would replace the fuel lines are at least the supply line. The attachment has sizes and part numbers for the fuel lines.

1. Drain fuel tank.
2. Remove seat and support. (from experience is this heavier then you think would be nice if you had someone off the tractor that you could hand this too). You could just try and push the seat forward
3. Remove left-side control console and panel (will need to remove left fender, that PTO knob is just pushed on there, but is hard to get loose)
4. Disconnect fuel supply hose. Close all openings using caps and plugs.
5. Loosen clamps holding fuel line and wiring
6. Disconnect fuel hose. Close all openings using caps and plugs.
NOTE: Tag or label wiring leads to aid during installation.
7. Disconnect wiring leads.
8. Remove two screws and nuts from back and bottom of tank.
9. Remove two cap screws and nuts from back of tank.
10. Lift retaining strap away from tank and remove fuel tank.
11. Inspect fuel tank for damage. Replace if necessary.
12. Wash tank out with a small amount of fuel to remove any debris.
13. Inspect rubber isolator, located between bottom of tank and rockshaft case, for excessive wear or damage. Replace if necessary.
14. Install fuel tank, cap screws, and nuts.

 

[tallbill]

Good idea to cut open old filter. I have saved them. Will I be able to tell if they are plugged? I've been told moisture in the fuel will plug the filter.

Last time I replaced the filter, I disconnected fuel line to injector pump and used the priming pump to purge. I did not see any air bubbles and engine still not start when reconnected.

What would cause vapor lock? Wouldn't it affect the running of the tractor as well as restart. Tractor runs fine until I shut it down and then try to restart.

If problem continues, I will get into cleaning the tank.

Thanks for your help.

Bill

 

[Tx Jim]

In all my years of working on diesel engines this is the 1st time I've ever heard of "vapor lock" on a diesel. Air locked(blocked) yes,vapor -no.

 

[JD5210]

Maybe I am using the wrong term vapor/air, but it would appear something is blocking/not allowing fuel.

Since the 5210 has no fuel pump the injection pump is doing all the work, while running the pump can over come the blockage, but not when starting. Since you said sometimes it starts when hot, I do not think the hot engine is the problem, but time frees the blockage.

My suggestion at this point is to clean the tank and replace the fuel line.

I am not a fan of working on a hot engine and certainly not with fuel and open to others input. You might consider seeing if you are getting fuel to the pump by cracking the line going into the pump, when trying start. Depending on what you find consider cracking an injector.

 

[Tx Jim]

Maybe I am using the wrong term vapor/air, but it would appear something is blocking/not allowing fuel.

Since the 5210 has no fuel pump the injection pump is doing all the work,

There's something helping inj pump get fuel called gravity. That's why there's no lift pump but one could be installed if necessary.

 

[tallbill]

It has been a while. Here is where we stand.

Several times I thought the problem was corrected, only to have it rear it's ugly head again. Even though I got clear fuel out of the fuel tank drain, I decided it was time to remove the tank and fuel hose to insure it was clean. Turns out there was a good bit of sludge in the bottom of the tank. I cleaned an reinstalled it. Filled it with new fuel with conditioner and replaced the fuel filter. I was very confident that the problem was solved at last. I ran the tractor several hours, shut it down and tried to start. It would not start. Opened the fuel tank cap to insure it was vented. Still would not start.

Next day, I loaded it up and carried to JD dealer. They found a little trash in the hand priming pump check valve. They installed a rebuild kit. Said it was restarting when hot, but a little sluggish. Wanted to pull and check injectors, check compression and valves, and check starter rpm. Injectors were fine, compression better than spec, decided no reason to check valves and starter sounded fine. You can pick it up.

When I got there several hours later, they had continued restarting it hot and the problem was back!! However, it would restart with a little ether.

They had talked to several of their other shops and the shop they use to rebuild injector pumps. Consensus was that there was probably trash in the injector pump inlet screen. They could check it, but there was a "good chance that everything would fall out" and it would need to be rebuilt ( $900).

Injector pump is a Stanadyne Model # D9 DB4327-5563; Mfg. nbr RE-500441.

I am at a loss as to how trash got to the primer pump check valve. Wouldn't that be on the discharge (clean) side of the filter?

I am going to operate tractor, using starting fluid as needed, and hope the starting gets better.

Isn't it bad for an engine to regularly use ether to get it started?

Bill

 

[Tx Jim]

How many hrs are on the tach? I refuse to use ether on an engine. It's too easy to break top piston rings.

 

[JD5210]

I am not an engine mechanic, but based on everything I have read. I suggest you take TX Jim advance on NOT using ether.