HST vs. Shuttle Shift?

[LMan1967]

I'm fully briefed on the differences b/w HST and gear transmissions....how does a shuttle shift compare/differ b/w those two?

 

[art]

I'm fully briefed on the differences b/w HST and gear transmissions....how does a shuttle shift compare/differ b/w those two?

I wonder?

The only way you get a shuttle shift is with a gear drive! Then you have the option depending on the make of tractor as to if it might be a syncro shuttle or a hydraulic shuttle.

 

[oldnslo]

Do newer power shift tractors offer shuttle shift also? Just curious since this is what is used on full size TLB's. Still indirectly a gear drive but no manual clutch to operate.

 

[TripleR]

Over simplistic, but essentially you have the same number of gears going back as forward, the shuttle shift simply determines whether you go forward or backward. Some SS are non synchro so you have to come to a full stop to change directions, others are synchro, so you can change at low speed without coming to a full stop. Then there is the hydraulic shuttle shift where the clutch is activated by moving the SS lever and you don't need to come to a full stop.

We have owned all three. I am sure someone else can go into more detail.

 

[RoyJackson]

Over simplistic, but essentially you have the same number of gears going back as forward, the shuttle shift simply determines whether you go forward or backward. Some SS are non synchro so you have to come to a full stop to change directions, others are synchro, so you can change at low speed without coming to a full stop. Then there is the hydraulic shuttle shift where the clutch is activated by moving the SS lever and you don't need to come to a full stop.

We have owned all three. I am sure someone else can go into more detail.

Aren't these also known as Reverser transmissions?

 

[TripleR]

Aren't these also known as Reverser transmissions?

Yeah, I "think" that is what John Deere calls them, but I don't know much about John Deere nomenclature.

 

[magicheater]

I have both. The HST is more responsive, The gear drive with hydraulic shuttle seems to have more grunt but with a lag between FWD & REV. The gear drive is more RPM driven, as in no neutral petal position. There are benefits to both. I'd boil it down to responsiveness (HST) VS. grunt (hyd shuttle). Just my opinion with a fair amount of seat time with both types and a history of pushing my tractors to all they can be.

 

[US American]

Deere's version is the PwrReverser. You can use it pretty much like a standard gear setup with clutching or you can go clutchless and just flick the lever. I had a hydro and now have the reverser. They both have their advantages. A hydraulic reverser is the cats meow for a gear drive. I needed power to the ground more than I needed surgical strike capabilities so that is why I have and like my reverser.

 

[LMan1967]

OK, thanks. So would a shuttle shift be sort of in between a gear xsmn and a HST, as far as things like heavy loader use goes?

My future tractor will do more loader/bushogging work than mowing (75-80% of my land is wooded), so Im looking carefully at which xsmn would be best.

 

[US American]

For loader work it is kind of in between. I set my hand throttle for 1500 rpms and then throttle up and down with the foot throttle when I do loader work. Direction changes can then be done solely with the reverser lever. It works real slick but hst is king for loader work.

For what you described I would recommend hst. My old jd 4200 hst was great with the brush hog and loader work. Test drive both and see what you think.

 

[TripleR]

Pretty much what US American said, I run a L5030 with HST and M8540 with Hydraulic Shuttle Shift/Power Reverser. Loader work can be done easily with both, but the HST is easier especially for new users.

 

[Verticaltrx]

For a wide variety of loader tasks HST is easier and more efficient. Especially for finer operations like grading, cleaning out small areas etc. In cases where you are actually using the loader just as a loader, like loading trucks or spreaders, that is where the hydraulic shuttle shift (or power reverser) shines. Just pick a gear, set the minimum rpm you want with the hand throttle, then just throw the lever back and forth all day long. You can also vary your speed with the foot throttle. While an HST achieves the same function, IMO the hyd. shuttle is a little less tiring when loading all day long. With that said, for compact tractors I'd opt for HST, for utility and ag tractors over 40pto hp I'd go with hydraulic shuttle.

 

[LMan1967]

Is there a reliability difference b/w the two? I envision mostly doing grading, moving gravel/debris/etc from one place to another, and bushhogging range trails and underbrush around trees. The land is mostly level - don't anticipate much mowing since I already have a ZTR for that.

My HP range Im looking at is 40-50 hp.

 

[beppington]

Is there a reliability difference b/w the two? I envision mostly doing grading, moving gravel/debris/etc from one place to another, and bushhogging range trails and underbrush around trees. The land is mostly level - don't anticipate much mowing since I already have a ZTR for that.

My HP range Im looking at is 40-50 hp.

Before (& after) buying my HST I read a lot about them, & while some tractor owners seem skeptical about a seemingly more complicated machine, I haven't read anything about HST's actually being less reliable.

 

[TripleR]

Is there a reliability difference b/w the two? I envision mostly doing grading, moving gravel/debris/etc from one place to another, and bushhogging range trails and underbrush around trees. The land is mostly level - don't anticipate much mowing since I already have a ZTR for that.

My HP range I'm looking at is 40-50 hp.

There may be long term, but you won't wear an HST out in your lifetime.

 

[impdaddy]

Never knew diddly aabout HST when I got my NH1520. But I will say I will never own a tractor w/o HST. Makes dummies like me look good

 

[canoetrpr]

There may be long term, but you won't wear an HST out in your lifetime.

Reminds me of what Adam Smith said in a different context "In the long run, we are all dead"

 

[Qapla]

Keep in mind that some shuttle shift tractors do require the use of the clutch do change directions.

If you are going to do mostly loader work, especially if that work entails multiple direction changes while doing the work, you may need to use the clutch quite a bit. Not only does this get tiring on the leg/foot, it also can lead to premature clutch damage and be a bit costly to fix.

The clutch situation is one of the reasons HST is so popular for loader work.

Though it is true that some tractors incorporate the clutch in with the shuttle lever, many do not. Make sure if you go shuttle, you know exactly what you are getting and how it works. If it needs the actual clutch pedal to be used, do NOT ride that pedal with your foot.

 

[jinman]

Is there a reliability difference b/w the two? I envision mostly doing grading, moving gravel/debris/etc from one place to another, and bushhogging range trails and underbrush around trees. The land is mostly level - don't anticipate much mowing since I already have a ZTR for that.

My HP range Im looking at is 40-50 hp.

If you do a lot of tasks which require fine control, slow and fast speeds, direction changes, and the ability to concentrate completely on the task and not the tractor's operation, then HST is the best choice. Some HST tractors in the 45-55 hp range do not even have a clutch. There's no need for a clutch since you can slow to creep speed, stop, go in the opposite direction with the HST pedal(s). Some HST tractors maintain a clutch just for PTO operation, but many have PTOs that are engaged completely independent of the drivetrain.

In my experience/observation, I find many people with gear driven tractors experience clutch problems because they end up riding the clutch to slow the tractor and do fine work. Shuttle shifting changes direction, but does nothing for you if you need to slow to a creep and then accelerate without changing gears. That's what HST does with ease, but many gear tractor operators (especially those who are new to tractors) will burn out clutches because they slip the clutch to achieve varying speeds. In full-size TLBs used for construction, clutches have been replaced with torque converters, but I don't know of anything similar in the utility sized tractors.

 

[WilliamBos]

Keep in mind that some shuttle shift tractors do require the use of the clutch do change directions.

If you are going to do mostly loader work, especially if that work entails multiple direction changes while doing the work, you may need to use the clutch quite a bit. Not only does this get tiring on the leg/foot, it also can lead to premature clutch damage and be a bit costly to fix.

The clutch situation is one of the reasons HST is so popular for loader work.

Though it is true that some tractors incorporate the clutch in with the shuttle lever, many do not. Make sure if you go shuttle, you know exactly what you are getting and how it works. If it needs the actual clutch pedal to be used, do NOT ride that pedal with your foot.

Sync shuttle requires a clutch, Powershuttle does not. All excellent points, and I agree, make sure it is Powershuttle, life will be so much easier.