How to recharge an Optima battery?

[Richard]

I've got an industrial backhoe (JCB) that over the 8 years or so of ownership, has never really been kind to batteries. Through a mix of low use (as homeowner) and perhaps an unknown issue in the charging system, it never keeps a battery charged. (the alternator HAS been checked out as ok)

So...be it as it may... I last bought a red topped Optima just to see how it would work. Salesman said it would keep a charge longer (ha)

The thing is probably no more than 6/8 months old.

Ok, so I tried starting backhoe with jumper cables from car AND also tried a different tractor (that has TWO batteries connected to it) and nothing there worked.

I yanked the Optima out and put it on charger.

Truthefully, I did this a couple days ago and yesterday, after being on the charger overnight, it didn't even "click" my solenoid.

Yesterday, after this happened, is when I tried to jump with other car and other tractor.

When that failed, I put back on charger.

The first time I did it, I had the switch on "gel" as I recall and now, I've got it on manual.

I had the other switch (the first time) on 2 amp and now I think I have it on 10 (or is it 20)... either way, I upped the amps.

I did this last night.

This morning, I was SUPPOSED to see a green light on my charger saying all was well and instead, I had the red light which I think means, nothing happened.

How on earth, did I screw up charging a battery?? OR, do these work on a charger the same way?

Should I just get another battery again?

 

[john_bud]

Stupid question alert!

You didn't hook the + to the - did you? They won't charge like that.

Stupid question alert ends!


Ok, have you put a meter on the battery? If you deep discharged the battery it may have fried, but that's hard to do with a gel battery. When you are charging, what voltage does the meter read? What is the discharge rate when you stop charging? does it go from 14.5v to 10v quick or from 14.5 to 14.2? etc.

One thing you should do is get a battery disconnect. Either from a marine store or speed shop. Then, a quick twist and the battery is isolated and will hold charge for a long long time.

Or you should find out where the short is in the tractor. Or even do both.

jb

 

[jinman]

Richard, an Optima battery is a "SLA" which stands for Sealed Lead Acid. It is no different from a normal lead-acid battery. It is NOT a gel-cel battery. The biggest problem as I see it is that you have completely discharged a battery that is not a deep cycle battery. The Optima yellow-tops are deep cycle (read "much more expensive"). Your red-top is just for starting like a car battery and is probably "toast" since it has been completely discharged.

As JB suggested, you should read the voltage on the battery, but don't be surprised if it doesn't take a "surface" charge and read 13.8 volts until you put a load on it. Any significant load will make it go to zero or very near zero.

I think you need a new Optima or other deep cycle battery or a disconnect like John Bud suggested. I'll bet your current Red-top Optima is no good.

 

[johnnylight]

Richard,

Bring it back should be covered under warranty and while your at it upgrade to the yellow like jinman suggested.

The salesman should of know better.

That's what I would do.

 

[Blagadan]

Or you should find out where the short is in the tractor. Or even do both.

jb

+1

I vote for warranty replacing that battery, finding the short AND fitting the isolator switch.

Could even fit a $50 solar panel "trickle charger" to the battery to keep it topped if your machine sits outdoors and idle for prolonged periods.

 

[Richard]

You didn't hook the + to the - did you? They won't charge like that.

Not a stupid question at all... (as one who's done that before). I double checked and everything was hooked up properly.

Now, I should mention in all fairness.... couple days ago, when I went out to start the backhoe, I DID find that some DUFAS had left the ignition key in the 'on' position. Since I live 15 miles out of town and my next nearest neighbor is a mile away, I'm not sure WHO the DUFAS was, but if I ever catch that DUFAS who left the key turned on, he's in for a nice can of whup hiney!!

 

[Richard]

As JB suggested, you should read the voltage on the battery, but don't be surprised if it doesn't take a "surface" charge and read 13.8 volts until you put a load on it. Any significant load will make it go to zero or very near zero.

Thanks for clarifying the red/yellow. I thought I was getting the heavier battery.

While trying to jump start this yesterday, I turned the lights on and they blazed in full glory. The instant I hit the ignition switch, it was as though that process hit the lights off switch. They died like a fingersnap and had NO residual glow that I could see. It was an immediate lights out for them. I got to thinking at that point, that it might be bad news for this red headed stepchild I've been trying to electrocute with the tractor.

 

[Richard]

General question .... would a yellow top Optima be a 'better' battery than a generic auto/truck type battery? (the older traditional style with perhaps, the plugs on top for fluid level check)



As for the trickle charger, I've actually been wanting to get one of those for a long time now (about 3 batteries ago ) and keep letting it slip my mind and not doing it.

 

[tallyho8]

There are some nice battery disconnects that I just got an email coupon for on sale at Harbor Freight for $3.99. The item number is 97853.

 

[jake98]

It was an immediate lights out for them. I got to thinking at that point, that it might be bad news for this red headed stepchild I've been trying to electrocute with the tractor.[/QUOTE]


That sounds like a bad connection on the batt. term. if you hooked the charger to the cable end, without touching the post, that would also explain the no charging.
jm

 

[Mickey_Fx]

Let's see, this battery tech was developed by Gates Energy Products back in the 80's. I was an early customer, actually the Co I worked for was but I was the eng doing the qualifications. OH, gel cell and AGM batteries are NOT the same in some important areas.

The original tech was called starved electrolyte but in recent yrs been called AGM. No need for special charging schemes. These batteries have a low self discharge rate ~1%/mo/remaining capacity. Lead acid batteries DON'T like to be left in a partial/full discharged condition. That will cut their life in short order. The sulfation of the plates will harden if left in that condition and it's hard to reverse once this has happened. One possibility to help recover is to install a battery desulfator. They do a fare job of bring a sulfated battery back to life.

Have any idea how long the switch was left in the ON position? Are you sure ALL connection are clean and tight. When the equip is running, what voltage do you see at the battery? Should be in the range of 14.25V. You can get a good voltage reading off the battery after no current has flowed in/out for 6 hrs. Fully charged 12V nom battery should read close to 12.7V. By 12V battery is half discharged and goes down from there.

Seeing you tried jumpering a different battery to the set-up and a no go. That is telling me there are problems other than the battery, connections or something else. You need to trace that down and fix first. Battery may still be a goner if it has been in a discharged condition for months.

 

[john_bud]

If you have lights, but ignition kills it dead dead dead, that is about 90% certain a connection problem. Clean and tighten the cables at the battery, ground, starter, relay and inspect for corrosion damage.

I had a similar issue, and found a ground connection loose. Now I have a spare battery.

jb

 

[AlanB]

If you have lights, but ignition kills it dead dead dead, that is about 90% certain a connection problem. Clean and tighten the cables at the battery, ground, starter, relay and inspect for corrosion damage.

I had a similar issue, and found a ground connection loose. Now I have a spare battery.

jb

Second or third this wherever I am in line, or you have 2 problems.

I would be looking hard for a bad connection though.

I think you also said you jumped it and it did not help, that definetely sounds like a connection.

 

[Richard]

I dropped battery off this morning at Autozone. She put it on their checker and it passed the initial 5 minute exam their machine does. It then went into charge mode and she said could take an hour or more.

She also said, it could fail at anytime depending on what was going on.

The battery was bought new last July.

It failed their test as defective. So, it's covered under a warranty and I suspect I'll get 10% back

I'll probably put it towards a yellow top. I ALSO bought a disconnect switch. If you harken back to the Frankenstein movies, or perhaps someone in the electric chair... you have the two sets of contacts and the person moves the lever from up to down to connect them...

It's something much like one of those however, it's obviously much smaller. It fits on top of the negative post of battery and opens the ground circuit when you lift the lever.

Up to me then to remember to do that!

Will know in several hours when I get home, if all I needed was new battery (aside from possible charging issues). Now that I know for sure my old battery is defective, it takes SOME of the frustration out of the equation.

 

[Richard]

Well, doesn't that beat all...

Stopped by to talk about the results of the defective battery. Talked about a yellow top. Guy said I should look at BLUE top if I didn't mind the money. Said it was marine grade AND was "dual purpose" for cranking and deep cycle (or what ever it's called)

how much?

(clickty clickty click on his calculator)

Net difference after tax, about $76.00

HUH?

I got a 100% refund on my defective battery.... 100% !!!! no pro-rated no nothing but full refund.

Put it into Brutus and it fired up in its typical 3/4 revolution. (fast starting machine when you can get it to crank over)

I'm a happy camper

 

[jake98]

Yippy yai yippi ai cayay. Things do sometimes go your way. Gotta love it.
(almost better than if it didn't go wrong, right?)

 

[jinman]

Stopped by to talk about the results of the defective battery. Talked about a yellow top. Guy said I should look at BLUE top if I didn't mind the money. Said it was marine grade AND was "dual purpose" for cranking and deep cycle (or what ever it's called)

Richard, that's great news about Autozone giving you full credit. Stories like yours are why I always start at Autozone when looking for auto parts and accessories.

I'm not sure the blue-top Optima is the very best choice, but it certainly is better than the red-top for your application. Here is a link to Optima's site where they describe the battery types and primary uses.

Optima Products

 

[WilliamBos]

Richard, an Optima battery is a "SLA" which stands for Sealed Lead Acid. It is no different from a normal lead-acid battery. It is NOT a gel-cel battery. The biggest problem as I see it is that you have completely discharged a battery that is not a deep cycle battery. The Optima yellow-tops are deep cycle (read "much more expensive"). Your red-top is just for starting like a car battery and is probably "toast" since it has been completely discharged.

As JB suggested, you should read the voltage on the battery, but don't be surprised if it doesn't take a "surface" charge and read 13.8 volts until you put a load on it. Any significant load will make it go to zero or very near zero.

I think you need a new Optima or other deep cycle battery or a disconnect like John Bud suggested. I'll bet your current Red-top Optima is no good.

Without starting a war, what is the advantage to an optima, especially the yellow tops over a regular lead battery?

 

[Richard]

Without starting a war

Who's going to want to respond with that precondition?

 

[jinman]

Without starting a war, what is the advantage to an optima, especially the yellow tops over a regular lead battery?

No need to raise the war budget. I'll let Optima describe their own product.

The Optima Edge

I'll also say that my main application for my Optima is my tractor that had a regular lead-acid battery that seeped acid and acid vapors. Those vapors got drawn through my radiator and rusted the whole battery shelf. That caused a lot of damage to my tractor (pictures on request). I had to replace the radiator and HST cooler lines under warranty. The Optima ended that problem: no leakage, no damage, perfect starting. I'm a happy Optima camper.