How to Finish a Stable - Walls and Floor

[PandDLong]

I am putting up a multi-use building - Building a shop / shed / barn / greenhouse

It has an 10' x 18' "stable" - this is a critical part to let me take down an old ramshackle "barn" that I inherited on the property. The stable will be for my donkey at the moment, but a horse, calves, goat and/or a second donkey are all future possibilities.

What are your suggestions on the floor? I am not putting in concrete - but what exactly makes up a "dirt floor" in a stable/barn? I probably need some natural drainage, does that mean a thick layer of topsoil or ...? Should I put in some weeping tile that runs out to daylight?


For the walls, I am thinking of framing in the walls up to 4' (the proverbial pony wall which seems very fitting in this case) and then covering with 1/2" plywood. This would leave the exterior metal exposed above the pony wall. For the demising wall between stable and storage, if it is too low (ie. a horse rather than donkey), I would likely add height to the wall with a wood frame and rebar creating a jail cell look.

What are you suggestions on walls?



Michael

 

[paulsharvey]

So, compacted ball field clay(sand clay), would work, but the issue will anything, without moisture, if it gets worked up, it won't compact back down. For drainage, I would consider leaving every other panel or every 3rd panel, up off the floor about 3 inches.

For the interior side of the wall, 1/2" plywood would work fine, but keep it up off the floor a few inches. Between outside moisture and urine, the bottom edge is gonna swell and start delaminating if you run it all the way to the dirt/clay/surface. Not a horse person, but you might need to treat the top edge of the knee wall with kresote to keep the future horse from crewing it.

Also, you probably already know this, but urine is very corrosive, and it will attack the galvi on the bottom couple inches of your metal exterior panels. Lime on the clay should combat both the smell and corrosion.

 

[D&D]

I am putting up a multi-use building - Building a shop / shed / barn / greenhouse

It has an 10' x 18' "stable" - this is a critical part to let me take down an old ramshackle "barn" that I inherited on the property. The stable will be for my donkey at the moment, but a horse, calves, goat and/or a second donkey are all future possibilities.

What are your suggestions on the floor? I am not putting in concrete - but what exactly makes up a "dirt floor" in a stable/barn? I probably need some natural drainage, does that mean a thick layer of topsoil or ...? Should I put in some weeping tile that runs out to daylight?


For the walls, I am thinking of framing in the walls up to 4' (the proverbial pony wall which seems very fitting in this case) and then covering with 1/2" plywood. This would leave the exterior metal exposed above the pony wall. For the demising wall between stable and storage, if it is too low (ie. a horse rather than donkey), I would likely add height to the wall with a wood frame and rebar creating a jail cell look.

What are you suggestions on walls?



Michael

For the floor, compacted limestone with a top of hex-pave (geocell) filled with limestone. The limestone will absorb urine odors, the geo-pave will help keep livestock from unevenly compacting the floor. For the walls, ground contact pressure treated on perimeter then your preference. I use t&g 2x8’s. Eastern white pine is being imported (from Canada) here for barn siding.
Barn has different meanings depending on the eye. Your version of barn may be plywood and rebar, but for a girl (guess how I know) foreground has base in. Permeable pavers weren’t installed yet

• 

 

[DJ54]

I used Limestone screenings for floors in my Horse/ Donkey stalls about 4" thick. You'll want to wet them down, then compact. Makes a very nice solid floor. I bed with straw, and it absorbs the urine and moisture from manure. You just need to replenish, or clean/pick manure daily if you want it perfect. I don't and clean weekly. But they are free stalls so they can come and go outside as they please. Doors are open to the South to catch the SW prevailing wind/breeze in the Summer for keeping cool. Harsh cold wind from the North/NW is blocked by the building.

I used 2 X 6 T&G treated lumber 3 high around the bottom of the stalls for a starter. Horses have a tendency to back up against the wall to do their business. Being they are free stalls they all seem to congregate in one stall in the Summer standing head to tail to keep the Flies off each other. Wintertime to share warmth. After a week, it can pile up in one spot. 75% of the time they stand in their own stall.

They do make heavy rubber mats that interlock if you prefer to go that way if you have some that have a tendency to paw at the floor and dig holes.

For my walls I went a little extreme on the work side and planed rough 5/4 Poplar down to 7/8" thick, then ship lapped it, and screwed to the walls up about 6' high. I used 2 X 10's as stringers at body height to take the abuse of rubbing/bouncing off the walls. Above that I used 2 X 6's and 1/2" plywood. The East walls where weather may blow in I used 1/2" treated plywood up 8'. There is an air gap of 4' at the top to allow some air circulation in the Summer with the SW prevailing winds. No problem in the Winter.

Stall fronts I framed up to about 4' high, planed some oak thins I got from a sawmill down to about 3/8". Ship lapped that too and inset about 1". Above that I made the jail cell look but with 2" spacing using 1-1/2" flat strap and 3/8" cold rolled rod. I cut the straps to length and tack welded on the ends to hold in place. Center punched for holes every 2", laid up on the drill press and drilled the holes. Slipped the rods in leaving a 4" - 5" space between the bottom and second strap so as to lay pretty straight 2 X 4 along the bottom for a straight edge, then welded around the rods. You'll want to knock the straps apart some so you can keep bumping them up for strap spacing. Lay the 2 X 4 in for a straight edge, tack a few, then remove 2 X 4 and weld the rest. Welded tabs on either straight, or at 90º to attach to framework. Then painted it all with IH red. I used a light come-a-long to pick up and put in place working by myself. For the stall doors I used the Cannon Ball track and rollers. Those doors are extremely heavy, but you can roll them open with one finger. Well worth the money.

It was a lot of work but bought all of the steel for 4 stalls for less than one pre-made one. I attached a couple of pics to give you a general idea, one including my boy Radar being the camera ham he is. Doesn't look quite as nice 11 years later with all of the Sparrows leaving their mark, but still looks pretty decent.

 

[PandDLong]

So, compacted ball field clay(sand clay), would work, but the issue will anything, without moisture, if it gets worked up, it won't compact back down. For drainage, I would consider leaving every other panel or every 3rd panel, up off the floor about 3 inches.

For the interior side of the wall, 1/2" plywood would work fine, but keep it up off the floor a few inches. Between outside moisture and urine, the bottom edge is gonna swell and start delaminating if you run it all the way to the dirt/clay/surface. Not a horse person, but you might need to treat the top edge of the knee wall with kresote to keep the future horse from crewing it.

Also, you probably already know this, but urine is very corrosive, and it will attack the galvi on the bottom couple inches of your metal exterior panels. Lime on the clay should combat both the smell and corrosion.

I am not familiar with sand clay - is that a mix of the two and does it drain naturally?

Good point on keeping plywood away from the floor and moisture - and keeping the metal clean. Plan on adding a sacrificial 2x4 along the top edge that I can easily remove and replace as a chew board.

Michael

 

[PandDLong]

For the floor, compacted limestone with a top of hex-pave (geocell) filled with limestone. The limestone will absorb urine odors, the geo-pave will help keep livestock from unevenly compacting the floor. For the walls, ground contact pressure treated on perimeter then your preference. I use t&g 2x8’s. Eastern white pine is being imported (from Canada) here for barn siding.
Barn has different meanings depending on the eye. Your version of barn may be plywood and rebar, but for a girl (guess how I know) foreground has base in. Permeable pavers weren’t installed yet

The geo-pave looks like a good solution - I will need to look into local availabilty and $$.

Ground contact pressure-treated seems like a solution to the bottom of the walls.

Nice looking barn!!

Michael

 

[PandDLong]

I used Limestone screenings for floors in my Horse/ Donkey stalls about 4" thick. You'll want to wet them down, then compact. Makes a very nice solid floor. I bed with straw, and it absorbs the urine and moisture from manure. You just need to replenish, or clean/pick manure daily if you want it perfect. I don't and clean weekly. But they are free stalls so they can come and go outside as they please. Doors are open to the South to catch the SW prevailing wind/breeze in the Summer for keeping cool. Harsh cold wind from the North/NW is blocked by the building.

I used 2 X 6 T&G treated lumber 3 high around the bottom of the stalls for a starter. Horses have a tendency to back up against the wall to do their business. Being they are free stalls they all seem to congregate in one stall in the Summer standing head to tail to keep the Flies off each other. Wintertime to share warmth. After a week, it can pile up in one spot. 75% of the time they stand in their own stall.

They do make heavy rubber mats that interlock if you prefer to go that way if you have some that have a tendency to paw at the floor and dig holes.

For my walls I went a little extreme on the work side and planed rough 5/4 Poplar down to 7/8" thick, then ship lapped it, and screwed to the walls up about 6' high. I used 2 X 10's as stringers at body height to take the abuse of rubbing/bouncing off the walls. Above that I used 2 X 6's and 1/2" plywood. The East walls where weather may blow in I used 1/2" treated plywood up 8'. There is an air gap of 4' at the top to allow some air circulation in the Summer with the SW prevailing winds. No problem in the Winter.

Stall fronts I framed up to about 4' high, planed some oak thins I got from a sawmill down to about 3/8". Ship lapped that too and inset about 1". Above that I made the jail cell look but with 2" spacing using 1-1/2" flat strap and 3/8" cold rolled rod. I cut the straps to length and tack welded on the ends to hold in place. Center punched for holes every 2", laid up on the drill press and drilled the holes. Slipped the rods in leaving a 4" - 5" space between the bottom and second strap so as to lay pretty straight 2 X 4 along the bottom for a straight edge, then welded around the rods. You'll want to knock the straps apart some so you can keep bumping them up for strap spacing. Lay the 2 X 4 in for a straight edge, tack a few, then remove 2 X 4 and weld the rest. Welded tabs on either straight, or at 90º to attach to framework. Then painted it all with IH red. I used a light come-a-long to pick up and put in place working by myself. For the stall doors I used the Cannon Ball track and rollers. Those doors are extremely heavy, but you can roll them open with one finger. Well worth the money.

It was a lot of work but bought all of the steel for 4 stalls for less than one pre-made one. I attached a couple of pics to give you a general idea, one including my boy Radar being the camera ham he is. Doesn't look quite as nice 11 years later with all of the Sparrows leaving their mark, but still looks pretty decent.

Looks very decent - I really like the wood grain and colour variations on the doors. I have cannonball track and rollers for my outside sliding doors - they are great. Don't know why but I hadn't though about using them inside...

How big is each stall? Do you have a means to close the door to the outside if you need to keep an animal inside?

Sad to say but I definitely don't clean daily - doubt I could commit to weekly. I tend to be a bit ad-hoc and do it "as required". Seems like a compacted solid floor underneath straw for bedding and absorption is a good solution - certainly seems maintainable. Some of the local equine operations use a lot of peat as well to provide some softer footing and absorption -but that seems a bit pricey to me.

Two suggestions so far on using treated wood along the bottom - I will definitely do that. Good suggestion on the stringers placed to take the abuse at body height - I was wondering how to put something in place for that. Is your south wall metal clad on the exterior with a post frame (as I see in the end wall)?

Nice work on the metal (and wood).

Michael

 

[paulsharvey]

I am not familiar with sand clay - is that a mix of the two and does it drain naturally?

Good point on keeping plywood away from the floor and moisture - and keeping the metal clean. Plan on adding a sacrificial 2x4 along the top edge that I can easily remove and replace as a chew board.

Michael

Sand clay is just a naturally thing around here, and it just exactly what is used on a baseball field. It does not perk, or drain, really at all, that's why I mentioned basically drainage ports at the bottom of your wall. In my area, it's extremely cheap, in other areas, it's more expensive. I think its around $5/ton here; and compacts to a very tight/hard surface.

 

[paulsharvey]

For material price ideas; search up this couple months old thread, and there where several people posting actual regional prices for base materials.

 

[DJ54]

Looks very decent - I really like the wood grain and colour variations on the doors. I have cannonball track and rollers for my outside sliding doors - they are great. Don't know why but I hadn't though about using them inside...

How big is each stall? Do you have a means to close the door to the outside if you need to keep an animal inside?

Sad to say but I definitely don't clean daily - doubt I could commit to weekly. I tend to be a bit ad-hoc and do it "as required". Seems like a compacted solid floor underneath straw for bedding and absorption is a good solution - certainly seems maintainable. Some of the local equine operations use a lot of peat as well to provide some softer footing and absorption -but that seems a bit pricey to me.

Two suggestions so far on using treated wood along the bottom - I will definitely do that. Good suggestion on the stringers placed to take the abuse at body height - I was wondering how to put something in place for that. Is your south wall metal clad on the exterior with a post frame (as I see in the end wall)?

Nice work on the metal (and wood).

Michael

Thanks, that is some #2 Poplar I picked up at a sawmill that was an over run for a large order. Picked it up for 30 cents a board foot.

Stalls are 12' X 12'. Always heard that was the standard size. I put 4' gates in 2 outside stall doors for when the Vet comes, Farrier, or if I get new critter and want to let them get used to each other for a few days. Picture is of my newest one, my boy Radar from a few years back. Otherwise, they are open all of the time. Too many horror stories of livestock trapped in barn fires. Yet some say a horse will run in a burning barn, because their stall is their safe haven. Hope I never have that put to the test here.

Many around here use pine shavings for bedding, but I spread this manure on the garden. Wood shavings pull Nitrogen out of the soil when it decomposes, and why I use straw. I compost it for a year or so before spreading it on so it's pretty well broken down, makes a good combination or browns & greens required for composting. I turn the pile 3-4 times a year with the loader.

It is a post frame building. I drew up the plans and had the contractor set 4 X 6's 12' O.C., then another at 4' for the doorways. Inside I set poles myself to match the outside walls. Then set a 4 X 6 in the center between outside/inside poles to nail stringers to and give stability to the walls. 10" headers inside to tie it all together, the dropped down with another 2 X 10's to hang the door track from. Yes, outside walls are metal siding. It also has a 6' freestanding overhang out front to act like a porch roof. You can't see the roofline in the pic below but it runs out as far as that wall. Gives good protection for the water fountain too. You can also see the gate closed with mare inside. She likes to gobble down her feed, and run others out of theirs, so one way to fix that...