Snowblower Help with 3pt Snowblower

[tobypineo]

Hey folks. Need some help with a used 3pt Snowblower that I just bought. It is a 64" Pronovost Puma model, being powered by a B3200 Kubota. It seems to be in very good shape, not a lot of paint is gone, auger and impeller turned fine when I bought it. Problem is that when I hooked it up and turned it on, the shear bolt on the PTO shaft let go.

I figured out that the impeller was hitting the inside of the drum in a spot, maybe 5" long. I don't remember it doing that when I bought it. I figured I would just let her run for a few minutes to wear away the metal, or perhaps bend the metal of the drum enough to give it clearance.

Well, I ran it for about 5 min and it is still doing it. Why would it do that, especially since it turned fine when I bought it? I winched it off the trailer with my atv when I got home, but it was very slow and controlled. I don't know what else to do besides run it. The impeller shaft has no play in it. The spot that rubs is on the bottom of the drum, so I thought maybe it was sagging down, but I don't think so.

On a side note, changing the gear oil in these is no fun! Had to use a suction gun, as there is no drain....I'm sure I didn't get it all out. Oh well, there isn't much to these blowers, hopefully everything will be fine.

I am traveling for a few days, but look forward to the replies you folks always give...thanks for your help.

Toby

 

[ttstpsvernon]

It is never a good idea to let something run in to make clearance or stop banging.This can put undo stress on your pto system and can cost a lot on money in the end specially if there is a vibration involved. It needs to be pulled apart and fixed no matter what it is -- it could be a bad bearing letting the impeller move out of round when spinning fast.

Like i tell my teenage daughter turning up the radio is not a fix for her car.

 

[leonz]

Hey folks. Need some help with a used 3pt Snowblower that I just bought. It is a 64" Pronovost Puma model, being powered by a B3200 Kubota. It seems to be in very good shape, not a lot of paint is gone, auger and impeller turned fine when I bought it. Problem is that when I hooked it up and turned it on, the shear bolt on the PTO shaft let go.

I figured out that the impeller was hitting the inside of the drum in a spot, maybe 5" long. I don't remember it doing that when I bought it. I figured I would just let her run for a few minutes to wear away the metal, or perhaps bend the metal of the drum enough to give it clearance.

Well, I ran it for about 5 min and it is still doing it. Why would it do that, especially since it turned fine when I bought it? I winched it off the trailer with my atv when I got home, but it was very slow and controlled. I don't know what else to do besides run it. The impeller shaft has no play in it. The spot that rubs is on the bottom of the drum, so I thought maybe it was sagging down, but I don't think so.

On a side note, changing the gear oil in these is no fun! Had to use a suction gun, as there is no drain....I'm sure I didn't get it all out. Oh well, there isn't much to these blowers, hopefully everything will be fine.

I am traveling for a few days, but look forward to the replies you folks always give...thanks for your help.

Toby

Hello Toby,

You have the P620 model with the 1 inch wings apparently,

Now you have to remove the impeller from the gear box shaft to determine the damage incurred as the impeller itself is a balanced impeller, Yes it is Balanced!, if the impeller is damaged it will require balancing once again or actual repalcement as the impeller runs at 540 R.P.M. with high thrust loading when casting snow. This is why the rotor is balanced to maintain a proper orbit and to reduce the wear on the bearings and oil seals to an absolute minimum for the end user.

Depending on your skill and ability it may be better to transport the Snow Caster to a nearby Pronovost Implement dealer to facilitate the needed repairs on the snow caster in the shortest possible time.

The simplest repair would be to purchase a new gearbox and replace the old gear box as the damages you are describing fully indicate a failing gearbox.

You need to to take extremely good care of the P.T.0. shaft and clean the female recieving yoke of the PTO shaft that attaches to the male shaft of the snow casters gearbox as well and be sure to wire brush the splines of the shaft stub to aid in attaching the P.T.O. shaft


Depending on your ability you would need to purchase nylock nuts and new washers for the gear box retaining bolts which attach it to the snow casters weldment that supports the gear box which is attached to rear of the impeller drum as well as new set screws/bolts/nylock nuts/shear pins for the new impeller shaft protruding from the new gearbox and some blue Loctite for the snow caster where needed.

You cannot afford to run the snow caster in its current condition as is scraping the impeller drum and will lead to a much more expensive failure.
_________________________________________________________________
Pronovost or not at all!!!:thumbsup::licking::drool:

 

[GPintheMitten]

Does each impeller wing hit the drum or just 1 or 2?

If all 3 rub to the same extent, then the shafts and bearings may be ok.

On the very used blower I bought all 3 rubbed very little. I used an angle grinder to remove about 1/16 inch from each. I took the chute off and was able to access them from the chute opening at the top of the drum.

There is no wobble on mine.

I agree however that the bearings and shaft must be straight and the fan needs to be balanced.

 

[bubbacuse77]

any chance your PTO is too long and you are pushing against the blower when you lower or raise the 3pt? My friend had this problem last year and damaged his PTO shaft internally on his NH Boomer. Cost him a pretty penny to fix and guess who was over blowing his driveway while his was in the shop?

 

[tobypineo]

Geez, you guys are talking about some pretty major repairs! I'm wondering why all was well when I looked at the blower, I could turn it by hand easily...The PTO being too long is something I will look into.

 

[GPintheMitten]

Geez, you guys are talking about some pretty major repairs! I'm wondering why all was well when I looked at the blower, I could turn it by hand easily...The PTO being too long is something I will look into.

I'm not. Did you check out what I suggested? You may have just dinged the drum sheet metal. My fix took about 10 minutes.

 

[Jerry/MT]

Hey folks. Need some help with a used 3pt Snowblower that I just bought. It is a 64" Pronovost Puma model, being powered by a B3200 Kubota. It seems to be in very good shape, not a lot of paint is gone, auger and impeller turned fine when I bought it. Problem is that when I hooked it up and turned it on, the shear bolt on the PTO shaft let go.

I figured out that the impeller was hitting the inside of the drum in a spot, maybe 5" long. I don't remember it doing that when I bought it. I figured I would just let her run for a few minutes to wear away the metal, or perhaps bend the metal of the drum enough to give it clearance.

Well, I ran it for about 5 min and it is still doing it. Why would it do that, especially since it turned fine when I bought it? I winched it off the trailer with my atv when I got home, but it was very slow and controlled. I don't know what else to do besides run it. The impeller shaft has no play in it. The spot that rubs is on the bottom of the drum, so I thought maybe it was sagging down, but I don't think so.

On a side note, changing the gear oil in these is no fun! Had to use a suction gun, as there is no drain....I'm sure I didn't get it all out. Oh well, there isn't much to these blowers, hopefully everything will be fine.

I am traveling for a few days, but look forward to the replies you folks always give...thanks for your help.

Toby

There are a few things I would check.

Make sure that whatever is used to retain the impeller is tightened to spec. The impeller should be keyed to the gearbox output shaft and retained by a bolt that holds it on the shaft. If the bolt is tight, loosen it and make sure the key isn't sheared.

Make sure that whatever holds the gear box in the frame is tightened per spec.

If the first items are good, check the impellers radial run out. Try to lift it up and down and left to right. Use a bar to pry it if you can't get to it any other way. If you find a a lot of runout, then the bearings maybe damaged, Check with the manufacturer to find out the allowable runout.

If the runout is good, then the impeller housing isn't concentric to the impeller shaft, indicating some sort of damage to the support frame for the gearbox or a bent output shaft. try to put a dial indicator on the edge of the impeller through the impeller housing exit to the chute and rotate the impeller to see if there is a bent shaft. If the shaft isn't bent then the impeller housing is bent due to some structural damage to the frame, or the gear box support stucture is bent.

 

[tobypineo]

Hey folks, I'm actually in Helsinki on business right now, so I haven't had a chance to look into your recommendations. But I do appreciate them, and will be looking into them when I get back in about a week. Keep any other ideas coming! I am intrigued at this point with the bent drum idea and the long pto shaft idea, there just wasn't enough opportunity to do damage during transport after I bought the thing, I don't see how anyway....thanks for the replies thus far...Toby

 

[rambler]

There are a few things I would check.

Make sure that whatever is used to retain the impeller is tightened to spec. The impeller should be keyed to the gearbox output shaft and retained by a bolt that holds it on the shaft. If the bolt is tight, loosen it and make sure the key isn't sheared.

Make sure that whatever holds the gear box in the frame is tightened per spec.

If the first items are good, check the impellers radial run out. Try to lift it up and down and left to right. Use a bar to pry it if you can't get to it any other way. If you find a a lot of runout, then the bearings maybe damaged, Check with the manufacturer to find out the allowable runout.

If the runout is good, then the impeller housing isn't concentric to the impeller shaft, indicating some sort of damage to the support frame for the gearbox or a bent output shaft. try to put a dial indicator on the edge of the impeller through the impeller housing exit to the chute and rotate the impeller to see if there is a bent shaft. If the shaft isn't bent then the impeller housing is bent due to some structural damage to the frame, or the gear box support stucture is bent.

Very good checklist. Only other thing is the bottom of the blower got dented while being unloaded, the bottom tin under the fan came up a bit? Otherwise has to be one of these things.

A too long pto shaft will bend something somewhere, either inside your tractor, or on the blower - those are covered in this checklist too, bent/broken frame or gearbox mount...

--->Paul

 

[Hooked_on_HP]

When you get back home, post some pics. We can tell a lot more by seeing the rub.
Bill

 

[tobypineo]

Will do on the pics, thanks a lot folks.
Toby

 

[koopster]

Call Doug Beach at AEBI New England. He is in Alstead, NH, just across the river from Bellows Falls, VT. They are great to deal wit hand are used to the Pronovosts.

Wouldn't go any other place. They handle some big units as well as lighter Pumas.

603-835-2600:thumbsup:

 

[PILOON]

While pics will help, I have a gut feeling that his problem may be as simple as wacking the area outwards where the blade/s are rubbing with a sledge.
At 550 rpm the balancing is not very critical and from his description of gear box it is not leaking hence it should be good.
S
PTO shaft adjustment MUST be checked as no 2 tractors have the same rear end geometry
Those blowers are easy and simple to maintain as all wear parts are available over the counter at any bearing shop.
If his PTO shaft is too long it could place enough side torque to cause the impeller blade/s to rub on the drum.

 

[reggiejr]

Im also guessing it is the pto shaft is too long.This is a very good how to video on how to check/make the pto shaft the correct length.I had to cut like 4" off my blower pto shaft for my tractor before i could use it.[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vBFJcvs5SE&feature=player_embedded]How to Measure and Cut a Tractor PTO Shaft - YouTube[/ame]

 

[tobypineo]

Sorry I was so long getting back to you guys. Thanks for the help. Those of you saying the pto shaft was too long are the winners! Bent the frame where the gearbox is mounted, shimmed up rear bolts with a washer, and good to go.

I didn't double check pto length when I brought her home. Lesson learned. Thanks again to all.

Toby

 

[psdx]

...did you shorten the PTO shaft to prevent a future event?

 

[Cantoo]

Aren't you glad you didn't follow some of the advice given? Gotta sort thru it all and file it for what it's worth. I always try to look for the simpliest things first and it's amazing how many times it is an easy (cheap) fix. My blower is old as the hills but works good, I hit crap with it once in awhile and the sledge seems to fix it. When it's done I'll buy another used one.

 

[tobypineo]

Yes, I shortened the shaft now. Thanks.

On another note, I'm not too impressed with the blower yet. We have had a few small storms, nothing more than 3", so I'm hoping there just hasn't been enough snow to push the snow out yet.

Even when I blow a windrow, the blower doesn't send it very far. I had a front blower on a BX2230 for 5 years, and it was much more powerful than this.

There isn't much in the way of variables here though, the clearance at the bottom of the drum is very minimal....I have a 32 hp tractor with 23 hp at the pto...I would have thought that it would blow it all much further...not impressed.

Thanks again folks.

 

[reggiejr]

Have you checked both of your sheer pins that could be messing you up.
Also with everthing off turn the auger by hand to make sure everything is turning freely.
If we ever get some real snow it may work better putting more snow through it.I would think the smaller impeller size of your old blower would maybe pick up snow better for those baby storms better but for the big storms the new blower should definitely out preform it.
Also be sure your running at the proper engine rpm's to get your pto up to 540 rpm.