Hay sled demand?

[Joe Batt]

So here's my Engineer's Cap input: Fundamentally, your sled is too narrow to remain stable if & when turning will be needed for maneuvering. Assuming a 3' c.g height for the bales, the sled should be about 6' WIDE to safely transport a product to be purchased by retail customers and avoid product litigation (if that's where you are going with this). ...

Assuming the bale didn't slide off of the sled first and that the sled will not slide sideways, wouldn't 6' wide track allow you to pull 1G in the turn before rolling over? My tractor doesn't go that fast.

Why is a sled with a 4' track that puts the CG at 3' less stable than a hay wagon with a 7' track that puts the cg at 6'? The low CG should greatly increase the stability of the implement.

I'm missing something with the analysis, because it seems intuitively obvious to me that leaving the bales on the ground (or within inches) is more stable than lifting them onto a hay wagon that has wheels and no brakes.

 

[Joe Batt]

... you need wide 'runners' to support the expected weight ...

It looks like 5 PSI is a good goal for ground pressure. So, very roughly 4,000 lbs / 5PSI = is 800 square inches. So a minimum of a 67" track 6" wide on each side.. though I'd want the skids in the corners, so 4 36" skids each 6" wide (or shorter and wider). Is that what you are imagining?

 

[5030]

Why not just buy a commercially made bale carrier?

 

[Torvy]

Assuming the bale didn't slide off of the sled first and that the sled will not slide sideways, wouldn't 6' wide track allow you to pull 1G in the turn before rolling over? My tractor doesn't go that fast.

Why is a sled with a 4' track that puts the CG at 3' less stable than a hay wagon with a 7' track that puts the cg at 6'? The low CG should greatly increase the stability of the implement.

I'm missing something with the analysis, because it seems intuitively obvious to me that leaving the bales on the ground (or within inches) is more stable than lifting them onto a hay wagon that has wheels and no brakes.

Because you are not using drag in your intuitive calculations. While it would be true that a taller sled would be less stable, it is not necessarily so with a hay wagon. Modern trailers give you the ability to keep the load low and have significantly less drag.

If this was truly a better option, the professional hay farmers would already be using them. Even if the risk was equal, the drag means you are using more diesel to do the same work. I know my full time farming family members look for every edge to keep costs down.

 

[zzvyb6]

Assuming the bale didn't slide off of the sled first and that the sled will not slide sideways, wouldn't 6' wide track allow you to pull 1G in the turn before rolling over? My tractor doesn't go that fast.

Why is a sled with a 4' track that puts the CG at 3' less stable than a hay wagon with a 7' track that puts the cg at 6'? The low CG should greatly increase the stability of the implement.

I'm missing something with the analysis, because it seems intuitively obvious to me that leaving the bales on the ground (or within inches) is more stable than lifting them onto a hay wagon that has wheels and no brakes.

The sled doesn't have to be 6' wide, just wider outriggers to contain any sudden dynamic turn.
Tractors have tires which don't support a great amount of sideforce (by design intent). Your sled has rails that will 'trip' your load. Same reason a car will roll over on a wet, grassy field.

You have to understand the theory of "Forseeable Misuse". Designing it for the brightest, most careful user (probably yourself) is actually the idealization of your concept. YOU understand it's shortcomings and limitations. I would bet that someone else will try to drive it down a public road, sparks flying and hot metal starting a shoulder grass fire. Don't think this is funny. Its a sad situation I often faced working the auto industry. Wait until a drunk takes his kids for a ride and 1 falls off and run over.

 

[zzvyb6]

It looks like 5 PSI is a good goal for ground pressure. So, very roughly 4,000 lbs / 5PSI = is 800 square inches. So a minimum of a 67" track 6" wide on each side.. though I'd want the skids in the corners, so 4 36" skids each 6" wide (or shorter and wider). Is that what you are imagining?

This is where you drop the math and cut up some snow skiis and run a few tests. Under the umbrella of a recent harvest, what skid area best suits the process ? And don't forget the side traction lumps to keep it from hitting you going down hill. Plus the skids will help save your crop when running over it.

 

[zzvyb6]

It looks like 5 PSI is a good goal for ground pressure. So, very roughly 4,000 lbs / 5PSI = is 800 square inches. So a minimum of a 67" track 6" wide on each side.. though I'd want the skids in the corners, so 4 36" skids each 6" wide (or shorter and wider). Is that what you are imagining?

Would consider hinged sections, maybe 2 per bale or even 1. This floats the load, less damage to ground. add extra flats as needed, maybe a bit more tractive power, much easier to store: just fold it up .

 

[ultrarunner]

I found out - in a most serious way - a small tractor is not equipped to do a large job. A farm wagon - heavily loaded with pine trees - does well being pulled on flat ground. It's a real nightmare - almost becoming lethal - when you have to pull it down slope. It happened to me - once. It was almost a fatal experience - to learn a valuable lesson.

My small family farmer
friends in Alpine regions have brakes on their wagons… including parking because nothing is flat and just parking an unhitched wagon often requires parking brakes…

 

[JimRB]

What is your tractor? I move 4x6 round bales of Bermuda or rye or fescue with a JD 870 2wd. I have a hay spear for the back. A hay spear for the front loader. An 870 is not a huge tractor. It prefers moving hay that has been curing a few months versus fresh cut. The rear spear of course does not care, the front spear is a bit more fussy. I stack 2 tall in the barn that has a smooth concrete floor. Of course the rounds are kept as low to the ground. When I am pulling out of the bed of my 2500 or off the trailer, I get the bales close to the ground ASAP.

Towing anything with the chain 2 feet above the rear axle is a rollover waiting to happen. My owners manual says tow using the drawbar which is below the rear axle where it has almost zero chance of flipping the tractor.