Hard time with new tractor

[Don87]

Thanks Carl. I over think everything. I am wired to be analytical. Sometimes it is a curse and other times its been a lifesaver. The dealership gave me three weeks to decide. I've sent the oil out to be analyzed to see if indeed I do have a glycol leak. Things will unfold. I am curious on your recommendation for the R4's. I never had a problem with ags in the woods even when I had the old 4 plys tires on as opposed to the 8 ply tires on the JD now. I guess one of the main factors on tire selection should I decide on the new tractor, is what fits in the barn, garage, and shed storage areas. Putting the rops up and down seems like an added act that I do not know how I'll fathom. The JD fits into everything now.

Some on here have had good luck with tying a string to the top of the doorway with a sign hanging on the end of it at eye level that reads "Lower Rops". Sounds silly, but it's effective.

 

[xring100]

Some on here have had good luck with tying a string to the top of the doorway with a sign hanging on the end of it at eye level that reads "Lower Rops"

My buddies dad could have used a similar sign a few years ago that read "remove bicycles" from roof. Good idea

 

[k0ua]

If you find it awkward you should not buy it.

I appreciate the old equipment but I really don't miss any of it. The new stuff makes life so much better and things are way more efficient.

I was thinking the same thing.. If you really do find it awkward to operate right off the bat, I would not buy it. Or do you really thing this is all mental, not ergonomic?

 

[arrow]

I agree if the shoe doesn't fit don't buy it. Did you test drive the competition maybe there is a better fit for you out there. Do you have the same problem with new vehicles. And if so do you adjust okay. If the answer is yes then it might be okay.
I've regretted purchases in the past and i don't ever get over it. Most recently it was a speeco speed pro log splitter from tractor supply. It was a pile fortunately after 6 months of frustration TSC bought it back. The concept was cool but it had to many fundamental design issues.

I did Dave. I guess they all strike me the same. Kioti,Kubota and the 3005 JD. I eliminated tractor after tractor based on their designs. The smaller L series Kubotas have their tie rods in the front of the axle. I'd bend these in my dense woods on the first day. It is essential for me to mount the tractor from either side and where some of these manufacturers place their fel controls, you'd have to be a ferret to get on the right side of the tractor. In the woods I need to be able to mount and dismount from either side as one side may be blocked by a tree or rock or bush. Of course a logging winch would eliminate that but I never had one and I am not about to buy one now as i do not know how much longer I'm going to log. It would have been a wiser decision 30 years ago when they only cost $1800. Just another example of my dumb ***** obstinance thinking they were too expensive then.

 

[arrow]

Or do you really thing this is all mental, not ergonomic?

That James is the million dollar question. I do suppose if this were my first tractor, I wouldn't know any better. I always had a vex as to why everyone was so hepped on the hydrostatics as my gear 750 is like breathing to operate. Now I know why based on my stint on the new tractor.

 

[k0ua]

That James is the million dollar question. I do suppose if this were my first tractor, I wouldn't know any better. I always had a vex as to why everyone was so hepped on the hydrostatics as my gear 750 is like breathing to operate. Now I know why based on my stint on the new tractor.

Can you be specific about what it is about the new tractor that is not easy to operate? Is it just cramped, or the gear selector in wrong place, or what?.. I was worried when it got my Kioti, that I would have trouble with the 2 pedal hydro setup as I was used to the single pedal Kubota operation that I really liked the way it worked. But it took about a day of operation to adapt to it. The operators deck on the Kioti is large and uncluttered, easy to get on and off of either side. I can tell you this though, I look at a Yanmar and drove it for about a minute and gave the keys back to the salesguy, and said sorry, that tractor does not fit me.. Everything seemed cramped and up in my face. I did not like it a bit.

 

[Carl_NH]

HI Arrow,

R1-R4 debate is lengthy as you know and both will work fine, I just prefer R4 around rocks and stumps and a little more ground contact in wet areas.

Then yes, check the heights but I see the 3016 is 81.5" with R4's and the 750 79" assume that's with the ROPS up so not a huge difference.

On ergonomics, it sounds more about change.

 

[arrow]

Can you be specific about what it is about the new tractor that is not easy to operate? Is it just cramped, or the gear selector in wrong place, or what?.. I was worried when it got my Kioti, that I would have trouble with the 2 pedal hydro setup as I was used to the single pedal Kubota operation that I really liked the way it worked. But it took about a day of operation to adapt to it. The operators deck on the Kioti is large and uncluttered, easy to get on and off of either side. I can tell you this though, I look at a Yanmar and drove it for about a minute and gave the keys back to the salesguy, and said sorry, that tractor does not fit me.. Everything seemed cramped and up in my face. I did not like it a bit.

Well first off is the single joystick. Mine currently has two levers and I can control them like I operate my hand. Not so with the single joystick. Seems to be a fine line of curl and boom lift that I can't get the hang of. My shifter is in the middle of the tractor and very fast to shuttle between first and reverse or 5th and reverse. The new one is on the left of the steering wheel and can shuttle no matter what gear your in. Being right handed, I'm a little ham fisted doing this with my left hand when before I had my left hand on the steering wheel and snapping between forward and reverse with my right hand which was much more natural for me. My accelerator pedal is just below the brake pedals so you could easily pivot your heel from brake to accelerator. The new one you have to pick up your foot entirely as the accelerator pedal is about a foot behind the brakes. Right now I cannot see myself inching into a pallet with forks or backing toward a stem between tightly growing trees on the new beast as I have not developed a feel and do not know if I ever will or if I'll get used to it. I told the proprietor of the dealership I should have never got on his tractor. He laughed and said "I know, after you drive one everybody wants one" I said "no, I wanted the tractor before I drove it and now I'm not so sure" His smile turned upside down with a puzzled look upon his face. The only things the new tractor has over the old one is it is much stronger and you can actually climb off of it instead of leaping off like you need to do on the JD and of course it has up to date parts offerings. Perhaps i simply need to bite the bullet and just do it. 28 years ago I paid $9350 for the JD. He is offering me 7K for it plus a discount of 3K, plus filling tires, plus giving me a choice of ags or the upsized industrials (43x20) instead of the 15.9's so for 10K out of pocket, I have a brand new tractor or almost what I paid for the JD 28 years ago. The deal alone is worth taking even if I don't like the 3016 right now..

 

[Xfaxman]

Well first off is the single joystick. Mine currently has two levers and I can control them like I operate my hand. Not so with the single joystick. Seems to be a fine line of curl and boom lift that I can't get the hang of. My shifter is in the middle of the tractor and very fast to shuttle between first and reverse or 5th and reverse. The new one is on the left of the steering wheel and can shuttle no matter what gear your in. Being right handed, I'm a little ham fisted doing this with my left hand when before I had my left hand on the steering wheel and snapping between forward and reverse with my right hand which was much more natural for me. My accelerator pedal is just below the brake pedals so you could easily pivot your heel from brake to accelerator. The new one you have to pick up your foot entirely as the accelerator pedal is about a foot behind the brakes. Right now I cannot see myself inching into a pallet with forks or backing toward a stem between tightly growing trees on the new beast as I have not developed a feel and do not know if I ever will or if I'll get used to it. I told the proprietor of the dealership I should have never got on his tractor. He laughed and said "I know, after you drive one everybody wants one" I said "no, I wanted the tractor before I drove it and now I'm not so sure" His smile turned upside down with a puzzled look upon his face. The only things the new tractor has over the old one is it is much stronger and you can actually climb off of it instead of leaping off like you need to do on the JD and of course it has up to date parts offerings. Perhaps i simply need to bite the bullet and just do it. ......

Yep, I say just do it! I was 69 years old when I got my first shuttle shift, with the lever on the left of the steering wheel. it didn't take long to adjust from the center shift. The bad thing is since I drive the Bobcats more than my truck, when I want to back the truck out of the garage, I pull back on the shuttle lever and it just sits there with the left turn signal flashing!

 

[k0ua]

Well first off is the single joystick. Mine currently has two levers and I can control them like I operate my hand. Not so with the single joystick. Seems to be a fine line of curl and boom lift that I can't get the hang of. My shifter is in the middle of the tractor and very fast to shuttle between first and reverse or 5th and reverse. The new one is on the left of the steering wheel and can shuttle no matter what gear your in. Being right handed, I'm a little ham fisted doing this with my left hand when before I had my left hand on the steering wheel and snapping between forward and reverse with my right hand which was much more natural for me. My accelerator pedal is just below the brake pedals so you could easily pivot your heel from brake to accelerator. The new one you have to pick up your foot entirely as the accelerator pedal is about a foot behind the brakes. Right now I cannot see myself inching into a pallet with forks or backing toward a stem between tightly growing trees on the new beast as I have not developed a feel and do not know if I ever will or if I'll get used to it. I told the proprietor of the dealership I should have never got on his tractor. He laughed and said "I know, after you drive one everybody wants one" I said "no, I wanted the tractor before I drove it and now I'm not so sure" His smile turned upside down with a puzzled look upon his face. The only things the new tractor has over the old one is it is much stronger and you can actually climb off of it instead of leaping off like you need to do on the JD and of course it has up to date parts offerings. Perhaps i simply need to bite the bullet and just do it. 28 years ago I paid $9350 for the JD. He is offering me 7K for it plus a discount of 3K, plus filling tires, plus giving me a choice of ags or the upsized industrials (43x20) instead of the 15.9's so for 10K out of pocket, I have a brand new tractor or almost what I paid for the JD 28 years ago. The deal alone is worth taking even if I don't like the 3016 right now..

The deal sounds good, I started on 2 sticks too. for the FEL I was good at using it.. I would NEVER go back to 2 stick.. 1 stick is SO much better. you right hand belongs on the joystick, not shifting gears.. These things have been carefully thought out. through generations of tractors, and generations of operators. Advancements have been made.. I know.. I have owned 5 tractors in 20+ years. Each generation is better than the last one. I have "adapted and overcame" Sure when I changed to a different system, there is some time to relearn and adapt to it.. That is normal for everyone. If 2 stick loaders were better than 1 stick, loaders, all of the loader controls would be 2 stick.. But they are not. I cant vouch for the 3016, or how good of a tractor it is how ergonomic I would find it. But I can tell you this. Its Modern Ergonomics are thought out to fit the maximum number of people to do work in the fastest and easiest manner. As for shuttle, If I wanted one, and I don't I would want it right where you mentioned it was put. I am an unabashed promoter of the hydrostat equipped tractor for the the vast majority of operators. Everyone has their own thoughts, and Ideas, and that is the way it should be.. but you have now heard mine Good Luck in what ever you decide to do..:thumbsup:

James K0UA

 

[crazyal]

My neighbor came up with a mini excavator to do some underground power lines. He asked me to help figuring I had a backhoe. I couldn't get the hang of it and after a half day we switches jobs and he took over. My Case has a 3 lever set up and it's second nature to me now that I have nearly 1000 hours of using it. Anything different and I'm worse than someone with no experience at all. But I'm guessing that it'll pass, I just need more seat time. With enough time I bet it would become second nature. The fact is that a 2 stick backhoe/ excavator is more common than the 3 stick that Case uses on some of their equipment.

The single lever control and shuttle on the left are standards. Chances are you will have to learn them sooner or later as what you have now is not something you find on a new tractor. Sooner you start the sooner it'll become the new second nature. If it was brakes on the right vs left or a two pedal vs one HST set up then I would say look at a different brand but that's not the case.

 

[94BULLITT]

Well first off is the single joystick. Mine currently has two levers and I can control them like I operate my hand. Not so with the single joystick. Seems to be a fine line of curl and boom lift that I can't get the hang of. My shifter is in the middle of the tractor and very fast to shuttle between first and reverse or 5th and reverse. The new one is on the left of the steering wheel and can shuttle no matter what gear your in. Being right handed, I'm a little ham fisted doing this with my left hand when before I had my left hand on the steering wheel and snapping between forward and reverse with my right hand which was much more natural for me. My accelerator pedal is just below the brake pedals so you could easily pivot your heel from brake to accelerator. The new one you have to pick up your foot entirely as the accelerator pedal is about a foot behind the brakes. Right now I cannot see myself inching into a pallet with forks or backing toward a stem between tightly growing trees on the new beast as I have not developed a feel and do not know if I ever will or if I'll get used to it. I told the proprietor of the dealership I should have never got on his tractor. He laughed and said "I know, after you drive one everybody wants one" I said "no, I wanted the tractor before I drove it and now I'm not so sure" His smile turned upside down with a puzzled look upon his face. The only things the new tractor has over the old one is it is much stronger and you can actually climb off of it instead of leaping off like you need to do on the JD and of course it has up to date parts offerings. Perhaps i simply need to bite the bullet and just do it. 28 years ago I paid $9350 for the JD. He is offering me 7K for it plus a discount of 3K, plus filling tires, plus giving me a choice of ags or the upsized industrials (43x20) instead of the 15.9's so for 10K out of pocket, I have a brand new tractor or almost what I paid for the JD 28 years ago. The deal alone is worth taking even if I don't like the 3016 right now..

Have you thought about a hydro tractor. That would eliminate the problem with the gear shifter and foot throttle? You will like the loader joystick after you get used to it. It sounds like the dealer is treating you good.

 

[arrow]

The deal sounds good, I started on 2 sticks too. for the FEL I was good at using it.. I would NEVER go back to 2 stick.. 1 stick is SO much better. you right hand belongs on the joystick, not shifting gears.. These things have been carefully thought out. through generations of tractors, and generations of operators. Advancements have been made.. I know.. I have owned 5 tractors in 20+ years. Each generation is better than the last one. I have "adapted and overcame" Sure when I changed to a different system, there is some time to relearn and adapt to it.. That is normal for everyone. If 2 stick loaders were better than 1 stick, loaders, all of the loader controls would be 2 stick.. But they are not. I cant vouch for the 3016, or how good of a tractor it is how ergonomic I would find it. But I can tell you this. Its Modern Ergonomics are thought out to fit the maximum number of people to do work in the fastest and easiest manner. As for shuttle, If I wanted one, and I don't I would want it right where you mentioned it was put. I am an unabashed promoter of the hydrostat equipped tractor for the the vast majority of operators. Everyone has their own thoughts, and Ideas, and that is the way it should be.. but you have now heard mine Good Luck in what ever you decide to do..:thumbsup:

James K0UA

Before this I had a hard time giving credence to all the accolades for hydro. Now I am more of a believer. When everyone got rid of the shift levers in the middle and reduced humps on floor space, they had to put controls somewhere. We gave up tripping all over shift levers for smoother floors but for me, I mitigated this by simply doing leaping dismounts off the tractor. One time however after doing this wearing snow pacs and my foot hitting the shift lever while dismounting, the below happened. Clearly what motivates design change has some give and take to it. This leads me to another point. Primarily , tractoring for me is logging and snow removal. As you can see, there is nothing under the John Deere to get hung up in the woods. When they put the fel stick on the fender for the 3016, they routed hydraulic lines under the tractor to get to the valve block for the loader. I have a concern these would get ripped right out because of our thick underbrush. Don't know if this set up has deterred anyone else who uses their tractor as I do on ground with so many obstructions? (you can see in this picture the awkward placement of the accelerator pedal. You sort of have to twist your foot and pinky toe the pedal) If the darn thing wasn't a thousand bucks extra, I'd get the hydro.

 

[94BULLITT]

A thousand bucks over a thousand hours is a dollar a hour.

 

[xring100]

Well it sounds like you've picked out the best tractor for your needs. I would have less reservations about your purchase knowing this

 

[Xfaxman]

.............. If the darn thing wasn't a thousand bucks extra, I'd get the hydro.

How does driving the hydro feel? It might be worth more than a thousand bucks extra. I know I will never go back to a clutch and gear transmission.

See if the dealer will do a Demo at your place.

 

[Carl_NH]

Arrow,

As others have said, get the hydro, $1000 is worth it alone in resale value, let alone ease of use for you for many more years.

Also, in the picture of your tilted JD750, what the heck is that felled tree doing in the foreground, it appears to be hanging in mid air!

Carl

 

[k0ua]

If the darn thing wasn't a thousand bucks extra, I'd get the hydro.

Well I see others have weighed in with their opinions.. but I was going to say, go drive one for a while, and come back here and tell us how much you hate it. The reason I am such a hydro promoter is because I actually believe in what I am "shoveling". I don't make a dime when anyone chooses a Hydro over something else. I just believe in "most" situations a cut owner will be better served with a hydro tractor.

James K0UA

 

[arrow]

Arrow,

As others have said, get the hydro, $1000 is worth it alone in resale value, let alone ease of use for you for many more years.

Also, in the picture of your tilted JD750, what the heck is that felled tree doing in the foreground, it appears to be hanging in mid air!

Carl

Hi Carl. That was a trick I learned along time ago in my tree felling days as a logger. There was a concern that the tree was tall enough to tap the house with its crown.What i did was purposely aim for a hang up atop the tree next to it with the idea that I was going to just cozy up to it with the JD and pull it off its stump. As you can see, I got delayed a bit by the tractor wishing to take a nap on its side. Of course it was alot easier when you had a skidder waiting with a 20 ton winch which would just sort of pull the tree in any direction you wanted. In the woods, we preserved and protected many an ancient stone wall built in the 18th century with this technique. We would then undercut and section the tree until the tree stem swung to the other side of the wall without touching it. The technique works for other uses as well if you don't have a skidder.

 

[arrow]

Well I see others have weighed in with their opinions.. but I was going to say, go drive one for a while, and come back here and tell us how much you hate it. The reason I am such a hydro promoter is because I actually believe in what I am "shoveling". I don't make a dime when anyone chooses a Hydro over something else. I just believe in "most" situations a cut owner will be better served with a hydro tractor.

James K0UA

My next step. A couple of years ago a Kubota dealership actually let me try one for an afternoon at my place. I can't tell you how much I hated it with that treadle design. Mahindra uses a forward foot peddle and a smaller heel peddle in back of it. Why they didn't put the two pedals right next to each other escapes me at the moment.