Gravel Driveway - reduce/control aggregate movement

[polo1665]

Guess I don't understand why you would've moved away from chip and seal. I had ours done for $1 per square foot, and have now had a subsequent layer put on at the same cost.
Is it an option for you to go back to chip and seal?

 

[paulsharvey]

Guess I don't understand why you would've moved away from chip and seal. I had ours done for $1 per square foot, and have now had a subsequent layer put on at the same cost.
Is it an option for you to go back to chip and seal?

Depending on how much pea rock is on top; I would sweep it into a pile; and add a layer of chip seal on the existing surface (after patching any large holes or settled areas).

 

[ponytug]

FWIW: We had a quote last year for chip and seal, and the contractor pointed out that putting down 2" of asphalt would be cheaper due to lower labor costs. Aggregate pricing and labor costs are quite local in my experience.

All the best,

Peter

 

[ddbackhoe]

FWIW: We had a quote last year for chip and seal, and the contractor pointed out that putting down 2" of asphalt would be cheaper due to lower labor costs. Aggregate pricing and labor costs are quite local in my experience.

All the best,

Peter

Maybe that contractor was only set up for asphalt? Why did they recommend only 2”?

 

[paulsharvey]

Maybe that contractor was only set up for asphalt? Why did they recommend only 2”?

I know this is regional; but in NFLa, most typical county roads are 1.5-2.5" SP-12.5, on 6-10" of rock, on top of 12" stabalized subgrade. The major state roads area normally around 4-4.5" of asphalt on top of 10" base and 12" subgrade. Driveways go from anywhere as thin as 0.75" Sp-9.5 to 1.5". At $150-180/ton for Asphalt; going from 165 #/sy to 220 #/sy is a lot of money. I think people often try to overcome base problems/compaction problems/drainage problems, by adding asphalt... instead of addressing the actually problem.

Lot of county roads are also 6" of base (limerock, or in past sand-clay) and double application chip seal.

 

[ddbackhoe]

I think people often try to overcome base problems/compaction problems/drainage problems, by adding asphalt... instead of addressing the actually problem.

A proper base often costs way more than the top coat. None of the paving contractors (that Ive asked) on my side of the bridge use chip and seal. Quite a few on the other side of the bridge do (and dont cross) IMO, a colored stone chip and seal can be very attractive.

 

[scootr]

We have a mile of community use unpaved road access. Originally it was decomposed granite over natural clay soil. It is unfortunate that when wet clay absorbs any material on top given any traffic. Over the 20 yrs I've maintained this road we have added a few layers. First DG and then crushed concrete. The crushed or recycled concrete is from highway reconstruction etc. This material Packs like concrete and really stays put but the dust epic. This is a problem. I'm hoping to cover it with a few inches DG again as the DG is less dusty.
But it's a bad time to ask the neighbors to chip in. We need a healthier economy.

 

[paulsharvey]

Have you considered just priming and sanding over the crushed concrete? It's not very DIY friendly, but any asphalt contractor would have a tack truck or tack wagon, and a sand spreader truck.

That response was ment for Scooter, not the OP... priming and sanding loose river rock won't do much.

 

[scootr]

Have you considered just priming and sanding over the crushed concrete? It's not very DIY friendly, but any asphalt contractor would have a tack truck or tack wagon, and a sand spreader truck.

That response was ment for Scooter, not the OP... priming and sanding loose river rock won't do much.

I wonder how that would hold up on top of our clay soil. Clay soil expands and contracts as you know. I dream about having it paved - but I'm sure that is just a dream.
Someone explained that the road needs some type of a sheet good laid down prior to the road material. I'm not sure what that material is.

 

[ponytug]

I wonder how that would hold up on top of our clay soil. Clay soil expands and contracts as you know. I dream about having it paved - but I'm sure that is just a dream.
Someone explained that the road needs some type of a sheet good laid down prior to the road material. I'm not sure what that material is.

Clay, or more generally expansive soils, are a big problem for roads. Without a stable base, the life of the road surface is reduced. As we all know, 10-18" of base is not cheap, but it will add to the longevity of the road

The sheet is a geotextile layer, typically a non-woven polyester mat that is put down after grading and compacting your existing road bed. It allows the base (clay) to move without necessarily cracking the chip and seal or asphalt on top of it. You can think of it as a "decoupler" that decouples soil movement from roadbed movement. It also helps reduce water penetration from small cracks in the upper layer.

I think that the only downsides that I am aware of are a) it adds cost, and b) applying it on steep grades requires additional steps to anchor the geotextile so that it doesn't move on the grade.

@ddbackhoe Around here, 2" asphalt is a pretty typical number for a home driveway. (No frost, minimal rainfall) There are of course, subtleties of whether the home owner goes for looks (1/2" aggregate) or strength (3/4" aggregate). For a working farm driveway, around here, it is probably closer to 4" of 3/4", but not necessarily paving the whole driveway, depending on length.

All the best,

Peter

 

[Mark N]

A number of different approaches are discussed here. I'm a novice with our gravel driveway (moved here ~1 year ago). Can someone give me a *rough* comparison of costs? I realize costs are highly local, but it would be really useful to me have some idea of relative costs (e.g., asphalt 3x crusher run, etc.).

I'm asking both because my 20 year old ~200 ft. driveway could use some work, and because I've started working on a community gravel road that sounds like it matches scootr's situation to a tee.

Thanks!

 

[polo1665]

My drive is a quarter mile long and ten feet wide. Chip and seal was around 11k, paving quote came in at 30k and I didn't trust it.
This is in NE Ohio.

 

[Omega Woods]

A number of different approaches are discussed here. I'm a novice with our gravel driveway (moved here ~1 year ago). Can someone give me a *rough* comparison of costs? I realize costs are highly local, but it would be really useful to me have some idea of relative costs (e.g., asphalt 3x crusher run, etc.).

I'm asking both because my 20 year old ~200 ft. driveway could use some work, and because I've started working on a community gravel road that sounds like it matches scootr's situation to a tee.

Thanks!

Where are you, roughly?

 

[Mark N]

Should have stated that -- north-central Virginia.

 

[paulsharvey]

I wonder how that would hold up on top of our clay soil. Clay soil expands and contracts as you know. I dream about having it paved - but I'm sure that is just a dream.
Someone explained that the road needs some type of a sheet good laid down prior to the road material. I'm not sure what that material is.

So, there are two types of sheet good, neither of which area used my FDOT much any more; 1st type is a poly grid placed between subgrade and base, thinj overly strong snow fence; 2nd type; they called it ARMY mat, Asphalt Rubber Membrane something, basically a like a heavy rubber-tar sprayed on a fabric, with fine granite screenings spread into hot rubber-asphalt spray, between base and asphalt. That's from before my time, think they did that into the early 80s,

 

[paulsharvey]

Someone brought up material cost; so I can give you material only, rough, North Florida numbers, without trucking;
Ball-Field Clay/sand clay $5/ton at the pit
Limerock base $10+/ton, at the mine
Crushed concrete $15+/ton at the crusher
Asphalt Millings $30/ton straight from the milling machine; more like $40/ton a a pile at the asphalt plant; and Many won't vendor due to aggregate shortages
Superpave asphalt; Sp-12.5 or SP-9.5; about $120-150+/ton at the plant,
3000 PSI concrete, $165+/cubic yard, plus fuel/environmental charges, delivered


Edit: for anyone wondering how many tons to cover X area at Y deep; most of the materials will run 100#/sy/1" of compacted thickness, roughly; asphalt is more like 111#/sy/in.

 

[Mark N]

Someone brought up material cost; so I can give you material only, rough, North Florida numbers, without trucking;
Ball-Field Clay/sand clay $5/ton at the pit
Limerock base $10+/ton, at the mine
Crushed concrete $15+/ton at the crusher
Asphalt Millings $30/ton straight from the milling machine; more like $40/ton a a pile at the asphalt plant; and Many won't vendor due to aggregate shortages
Superpave asphalt; Sp-12.5 or SP-9.5; about $120-150+/ton at the plant,
3000 PSI concrete, $165+/cubic yard, plus fuel/environmental charges, delivered


Edit: for anyone wondering how many tons to cover X area at Y deep; most of the materials will run 100#/sy/1" of compacted thickness, roughly; asphalt is more like 111#/sy/in.

Excellent -- thanks!

 

[paulsharvey]

I would be curious what other regions' prices are like, even though it will be hard to compare, with different names/different ways things are billed (ie are you paying for trucking and material as a single load price, ect).

 

[paulsharvey]

Attached are some more local prices.

That Hot mix-recycle, I dont know what the recycle percentage is; but $100/ton is less then I expected. That limerock base is very high, as it's hauled from Ocala, and stockpiled in Jacksonville, so it's already been handled twice, and trucked 75 miles

Note: those are all FOB prices; forget the actually words its stands for but the easy way to think of it is Freight On Buyer

.

 

[ddbackhoe]

Someone brought up material cost; so I can give you material only, rough, North Florida numbers, without trucking;
Ball-Field Clay/sand clay $5/ton at the pit
Limerock base $10+/ton, at the mine
Crushed concrete $15+/ton at the crusher
Asphalt Millings $30/ton straight from the milling machine; more like $40/ton a a pile at the asphalt plant; and Many won't vendor due to aggregate shortages
Superpave asphalt; Sp-12.5 or SP-9.5; about $120-150+/ton at the plant,
3000 PSI concrete, $165+/cubic yard, plus fuel/environmental charges, delivered


Edit: for anyone wondering how many tons to cover X area at Y deep; most of the materials will run 100#/sy/1" of compacted thickness, roughly; asphalt is more like 111#/sy/in.

Clay/sand clay $20/ton
blue stone, various aggregate sizes $45/ton
Crushed concrete $25/ton at the crusher
Asphalt Millings $15/ton straight from the milling machine; $20/ton double grind
asphalt about $150/ton
3000 PSI concrete, $195+/cubic yard

except for concrete, all p/u prices