good source for tractor paint?

[Soundguy]

That $30 is the SALE PRICE...right???...LMAO!!!!

I was actually making a joke.. about my cheap gun.

I plan to retire my old gun to being a junk gun for applying the trailer decking paint. Then get a primer only gun, a regular gun, and a spot/touch up gun.. There are plenty of times I only need to do a few oz of shooting.. It's heck cleaning a quart gun for a 20z shoot.

HVLP guns are becoming of interest now.(to me)

Soundguy

 

[kenmac]

Farm, what size air compressor are you using for your painting ? Last year I upgraded my air compressor to a 7.5 hp 80 gallon tank that puts out 25.5 cfm @175 psi.I needed this much air to operate a glass bead machine that I bought.I also can operate 2 orbital sanders at the same time with this compressor. It's been great not having to wait for your air to build back up.



And again, those are some very nice looking tractors you have painted

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Farm, what size air compressor are you using for your painting ? Last year I upgraded my air compressor to a 7.5 hp 80 gallon tank that puts out 25.5 cfm @175 psi.I needed this much air to operate a glass bead machine that I bought.I also can operate 2 orbital sanders at the same time with this compressor. It's been great not having to wait for your air to build back up.



And again, those are some very nice looking tractors you have painted

Thanks.

I've got an Ingersol Rand, a Campbell Hausfeld, and an old Emglo, of various sizes, but all three small. They were all bought originally to run air nailers used for carpenter work. I'm guessing the IR is maybe 25 gal, 2-1/2hp. and it's the biggest. Plenty for HVLP painting. Gotta go real slow with my sand blaster. I'm old, so slow isn't hard to do.

 

[mark777]

Farmwithjunk,

I somehow missed you attachments...

You can't fool these old eyes even viewing your pix through this old monitor........Great looking tractors and especially the canopy reflecting off of the hood of your Deere. I don't have to be there to know how much time, materials and patience are involved in your work.

Nice job.

Mark

 

[mark777]

I was actually making a joke.. about my cheap gun.
HVLP guns are becoming of interest now.(to me)

Soundguy

Chris, It's difficult to make the transition from siphon to HVLP....at first. Fortunately for me, I was forced to do so nearly 20 years ago, and that's when they weren't so good.

If Partsman2 was around back then, he may remember how much painters and shop owners HATED HVLP! Hated the fact that the industry forced us to change over, hated the EPA and VOC standards that forced us to change over, just hated everything about the funny gun that blew too much materials...and all the time. I finally relented and took it on as a new science.....learned everything I could and never looked back at siphon style guns again.

With HVLP's you will be using 15-20 lbs at the tip (instead of 35-50 lbs with a siphon feed) and your airline feed (CFM) is far less.
Gun distances are further away from your target with HVLP
Fan and material adjustments are far superior to siphon feed
Transfer efficiency is so drastic that after a single pass - it forces you to take much longer periods between flash coats. Which in layman's terms means you have to force yourself to set the gun down, go outside and read a newspaper for a while....and occasionally returning to stick your finger on a piece of masking tape to check tack.
You may also notice that you've mixed too much sprayable material and often throw away 50% (ouch) until you've become familiar of estimating the materials necessary for your paint projects,

I have a box (somewhere) with 12-15 guns, Binks, DeVilbis, Sharpe etc. that I haven't touched in 6 years, we're talking thousands of dollars...all destined to a yard sale I guess.

Anyway...a fellow like you will have mastered it in very little time .

 

[RollTideRam]

Doesn't King Kutter sell a Commercial Yellow Paint? JC

 

[Partsman2]

mark777,

Yes I remember those days all too well. We aren't in a regulated area so it was an uphill battle getting the painters converted but we knew we had to to get the shop owners to quit screaming about the cost of paint. I remember the 1st units that had what I called "the dog". Those were the ones that had their own compressor unit that came with the gun and you had to drag it around the paint booth with you while you sprayed. They were very expensive (I think I remember something like $1500.00). I may have sold one or two of those before the 2nd generation came out that ran off of the shop compressor.

I remember the first demo we did with a HVLP gun. The painter put a big run in the clear coat down the side of the car and we had to help him redo the job. That was with the old original Chromabase clearcoat. The paint materials have come a long way since then and have been geared to work with HVLP technology.

The other big transition was to go away from siphon and change to gravity feed. Once that transition happened is when the savings in materials started making it worthwhile. We now mix in ounces of ready to spray instead of pints or quarts being as with a gravity feed you can use every drop of material in the cup. The painters have finally embraced the technology and the shop owners are delighted! We sell a lot of Devillbis, Sharpe, and some other brands I can't spell.

Farmwithjunk, that is some nice looking work! Have you ever tried any Dupont Centari acrylic enamel or any of Dupont's urethanes (Imron or Chromaone)?

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Farmwithjunk,

I somehow missed you attachments...

You can't fool these old eyes even viewing your pix through this old monitor........Great looking tractors and especially the canopy reflecting off of the hood of your Deere. I don't have to be there to know how much time, materials and patience are involved in your work.

Nice job.

Mark

Thanks!

If there's anything about a painted up old tractor that really bothers me, it's seeing one that looks like it was done in an afternoon. It takes lots of time to prep a tractor for paint. It takes even MORE time to detail one AFTER the paint is done flying. The Deere spent about 3 months in pieces. The Massey has spent even more than that, broken up in to 5 or 6 shorter time periods. (I was still USING it during most of the re-hab) The Ford was a 2-day marathon "throw paint on it even if it's only 1/2 ready" sort of rush job. It shows..... Maybe a GOOD paint job next winter if it turns out to be a good tractor. (Only put about 60 hours on it since buying)




I've painted 16 tractors now. That's spread over 7 years. Each one turns out a little better than the last. That tells a tale of how much EXPERIENCE means to a painter.

I'm still a complete amature at painting. From day one, I've recognized the value of having an "expert" walk me through each and every stage of prep, paint, and CARE of the paint after it's dry. In my case, he's the "counter guy" at a very busy automotive paint store where I buy most of my material. 30 years of dealing with big-time body shops and a few fairly well known custom car/street rod builders has, by process of osmosis, taught him more about product selection than what many experienced painters will know.

Some of the high end paints nowdays come as a "system". Everything, including fillers, primers, reducers, color coats, and even clear coats are matched to work without "bad reactions". I've been guided to the correct reducer (thinner) for climate conditions. Even little things like sandpaper and helping me find a fresh air breathing system to use while painting with hardeners. Kenny has been a lifesaver! (He's got an old Sears SS12 lawn tractor that needs work. I'm going to restore it in return for all his help)

There's a LOT to know about spraying paint. If you go off on your own, learning as you go, there are literally BILLIONS of ways to screw up. (Some can even KILL you....Pay attention to the warnings about hardeners and activators) After 16 tractors, I'm just now getting a handle on how much I DON'T know about the subject.

There's more to know about the product when using high quality paints, but the learning curve for a beginner user isn't much different than the "cheap stuff". Just more expensive...... At least the end results LAST LONGER with better paint.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

With HVLP's you will be using 15-20 lbs at the tip (instead of 35-50 lbs with a siphon feed) and your airline feed (CFM) is far less.
Gun distances are further away from your target with HVLP
Fan and material adjustments are far superior to siphon feed
Transfer efficiency is so drastic that after a single pass - it forces you to take much longer periods between flash coats. Which in layman's terms means you have to force yourself to set the gun down, go outside and read a newspaper for a while....and occasionally returning to stick your finger on a piece of masking tape to check tack.

HVLP guns can put so much paint on in one pass, they will give the impression that they can "one coat" cover anything. Gun technology may be better, but paint still runs if you dump too much on.......Don't ask me how I know that

 

[Soundguy]

I have a question on the hvlp. Is it full time 'material' when the trigger is pulled? I take it there is no 'air' setting on the trigger.. like on a syphon feed.. first part of trigger is air, farther back is material. I hardly ever get a run.. but I've been happy a couple time by being able to 'blow' the run out.. etc.

Soundguy

 

[Sully2]

I have a question on the hvlp. Is it full time 'material' when the trigger is pulled? I take it there is no 'air' setting on the trigger.. like on a syphon feed.. first part of trigger is air, farther back is material. I hardly ever get a run.. but I've been happy a couple time by being able to 'blow' the run out.. etc.

Soundguy

??? I cant remember to tell you the truth. Seems like it worked in the "normal manner" though???

 

[Sully2]

With HVLP's you will be using 15-20 lbs at the tip (instead of 35-50 lbs with a siphon feed) and your airline feed (CFM) is far less.
Gun distances are further away from your target with HVLP
Fan and material adjustments are far superior to siphon feed
Transfer efficiency is so drastic that after a single pass - it forces you to take much longer periods between flash coats. Which in layman's terms means you have to force yourself to set the gun down, go outside and read a newspaper for a while....and occasionally returning to stick your finger on a piece of masking tape to check tack.
You may also notice that you've mixed too much sprayable material and often throw away 50% (ouch) until you've become familiar of estimating the materials necessary for your paint projects,

Ive just got 3 ( different sizes) of the El Cheapo HF HVLP guns ( Its cheaper to buy a new gun on sale than it is parts for one!!) I was reading thru the manual here to see about Soundguy's question on the "2 stage trigger" thingy...and notice the instructions sated that consumption was 3 CFM at a MAX of 50 PSI. A guy could almost run that off a bicycle pump!!...LOL Their junk...but do a decent job suprizingly!

 

[Partsman2]

Soundguy,

The trigger still works the same. Half way back is air only and all the way is fluid. You can still blow the run off the edge. I've done it many times myself.

 

[Soundguy]

Thanks for the info. That was going to be part of the defiding factor. Like I say.. I don't get many runs.. but when i do.. if i am carfull.. i can usually blow it out.

Soundguy

 

[Sully2]

Soundguy,

The trigger still works the same. Half way back is air only and all the way is fluid. You can still blow the run off the edge. I've done it many times myself.

I thought it was "normal"...but just couldnt remember?? Duhhh!...lol

 

[mark777]

Thanks for the info. That was going to be part of the defiding factor. Like I say.. I don't get many runs.. but when i do.. if i am carfull.. i can usually blow it out.

Soundguy

You will find that the features and mechanics of both styles of guns work almost identical. The gravity fed (cup on top) gun will put out more material and that is probably the single, biggest adjustment one has to learn. Other than that they maintain the three basic adjustments....Fan, Material and Air pressure.

Something I learned and try to pass on to those interested in NEVER (or 99% of the time) having another run is your top coat, base coat and, or clears is a simple but bullet proof method:
(Partsman2 probably knows this one as well)

(1) After mixing, reducing etc and ready to shoot your first coat, mask about 4' of 18" solvent proof masking paper to a flat horizontal surface (shop wall, door or even dust free plywood). Make your final gun adjustments on a corner of that paper, and finally make one long, even pass on the same paper....and then proceed to paint your project with the first flash coat. (2) Set your gun down, disconnect air hose and leave your booth. Force yourself to stay away at least 15 minutes (@ 72°). (3) Re-enter and stick your finger on the paper...you're checking to see if the material is wet, stringy or tacky like the back of masking tape...which is the ideal time to re-coat the project. (4) And very important, Make Another Single Pass on the same piece of paper before you proceed to your project.
Repeat as necessary.
Folks, I tried to pass the wisdom, which I learned from the grand master, to all of my students at the beginning of each I-CAR class...It does indeed add on more step to the painting cycle...but it may very well be the last agonizing and frustrating 'run' you ever have.

God I love talking paint ......sure hope I'm not boaring anyone.

 

[Soundguy]

Hey.. I may not be so dumb after all.

i keep a section of thin sheet metal that I use to test paint on. Every time i mix a new cup.. I hit a piece of that metal first...

Soundguy

(1) After mixing, reducing etc and ready to shoot your first coat, mask about 4' of 18" solvent proof masking paper to a flat horizontal surface (shop wall, door or even dust free plywood). Make your final gun adjustments on a corner of that paper, and finally make one long, even pass on the same paper....and then proceed to paint your project with the first flash coat. (2) Set your gun down, disconnect air hose and leave your booth. Force yourself to stay away at least 15 minutes (@ 72°). (3) Re-enter and stick your finger on the paper...you're checking to see if the material is wet, stringy or tacky like the back of masking tape...which is the ideal time to re-coat the project. (4) And very important, Make Another Single Pass on the same piece of paper before you proceed to your project.
Repeat as necessary.
Folks, I tried to pass the wisdom, which I learned from the grand master, to all of my students at the beginning of each I-CAR class...It does indeed add on more step to the painting cycle...but it may very well be the last agonizing and frustrating 'run' you ever have.

God I love talking paint ......sure hope I'm not boaring anyone.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Hey.. I may not be so dumb after all.

Soundguy

MUST NOT SAY IT...............

Hard to pass on an opening like that one!

 

[Sully2]

God I love talking paint ......sure hope I'm not boaring anyone.

For what its worth...I'M LISTENING!!!....

 

[Partsman2]

Mark777 - I think you are saying that your purpose for making the gun pass on the masking paper is so that you can tell when you're ready to lay down another coat. When painting cars there is usually plenty of masking paper on the car to do this test with. Most guys will make a regular gun pass on an adjacent piece of masking paper while they're painting the panel for this same purpose. Of course it's always a good idea to make a test spray on a scrap piece to make sure your gun settings are correct before painting the piece your wanting to make look pretty.

And BTW you will not bore me. I lived and breathed developing the paint end of the business for my company for 14 years. 4 years ago I put someone else in charge of running that company and went to work for another company. I definitely miss the paint business although it is cut throat competitive. Maybe that's why I like it so much!