Found a coyote, I think

[MossRoad]

This was my first cat. Got him when I was 26. He lived about 16 years. Had diabetes the last two. Got insulin shots twice a day. Didn't care. I raised him with a Cairn Terrier. Taught him to walk on a leash like the dog. For all intents and purposes, he thought he was a dog. He liked sour cream. That's the dining room table he's holding on to. He was 37" from tip to tail, and could pull food off your plate if you didn't keep an eye on him.

 

[Raspy]

I used to have this philosophical argument (man's superiority) with my dad at the dinner table. It really boiled down to the definition of what 'intelligent' means. If man is doing such great things but not living in harmony with the rest of the animals... then are we so 'superior'? That said, still glad I was born human... and in the USA!

:thumbsup:

 

[Raspy]

Thanks. Sorry about your dog, too. Nice looking pup! :thumbsup:

This cat was pretty darn smart. He figured out that "laser button click noise meant red dot somewhere" in about an hour. I taught him to sit, shake hands, sit up, and high-five in about a week, working just one or two times in the morning and again in the evening, so at the most, about 5 minutes a day for 7 days and he had it. I was working on lie down and roll over when the heart condition surfaced.

I have a very loud 93 Suburban. My wife and daughter said he'd pop his head up and run to the back door and sit on the carpet facing the door about 10 seconds before they could hear me coming down the street. So he was always there waiting for me at the back door. While I'd like to think it was because he liked me, I'm pretty sure he knew it was because "here comes that guy that give me snacks if I do stuff". :laughing:

Great story. :thumbsup:

 

[MossRoad]

Great story. :thumbsup:

Thanks.

So's your coyote story. I've been following it for a long time. :thumbsup:

 

[MossRoad]

This is not a reliable measure of how to act, as Nature can be very cruel.

Last year birds were nesting above my front door. The adult flew into a window and was killed. The chick was no longer being fed and was so distressed it jumped out of the nest and landed on the concrete below. That is when I first noticed it. I hoped another adult would take it in, which of course is foolish. While I was hoping for a result that would never come, that chick suffered and eventually died the next day. I let nature take its course-- but it was not the most humane thing to do. I should not have let nature take its course. I should have dropped a brick on that chick and stopped its suffering.

So, circumstances matter.

On that note, we have peregrine falcons here in town. They had 4 chicks this year. The DNR (or some other group, I can't remember) came to possess a perigrine chick that was orphaned. So they put it in the nest box with the 4 other chicks. The parents didn't care and fed it just like the other 4. So next time you find a baby bird, put it back in its nest if you can. The parents won't care. If one parent dies, the other will try and feed them. We had that one year with the peregrines, too. One adult died. The other kept trying to feed the chicks. Several survived.

My sister in law found a baby dove in her grass about 8 years ago. They watched it for a couple days, and no adults came to it. So they took it in. Bought a bird cage. Fed him. Let him out of the cage. He'd fly around the house and land on their shoulder. Heck, he'd go out on the porch with them and fly back into the house. He had plenty of opportunity to leave, but was imprinted on them, so he stayed. Then HE started laying eggs.... hahaha. Anyhow, the little dudette just died last week. I'm pretty sure that it wasn't stressed and liked being there.

I kind of find it odd that folks that tell you it's best to let nature take its course have no problem hunting or fishing, or eating farm raised beef and chickens, put fertilizer on their lawn, or plant food in their flowers, spray insecticide or use insect repellant, and vaccinate their children from diseases, etc....

It's human compassion to try and assist an injured animal. While it usually doesn't work out well and the animal usually dies, sometimes it works out very well. Animal wildlife rehab can work, too. Especially for adult wild animals. They heal, and want to leave. It's a lot more difficult with baby animals as there's no adult to teach them the way of their species, and it rarely works out to raise baby animals and sucessfully release them.

 

[Raspy]

I kind of find it odd that folks that tell you it's best to let nature take its course have no problem hunting or fishing, or eating farm raised beef and chickens, put fertilizer on their lawn, or plant food in their flowers, spray insecticide or use insect repellant, and vaccinate their children from diseases, etc....

Good points.

And if someone was to use Plowhog's example, they seem to be assuming that the animal will die no matter what you do, so why not just kill it in the name of reducing it's suffering. Taken a step further, we are all going to die, some very soon and some a bit later. Maybe killing everyone would reduce everyone's suffering. Or maybe the example of the bird could be re-interpreted as " we didn't know how to help it, and we didn't really care, so we let it die". The brick might be a more humane solution if you have already decided that reduced suffering is the main goal and you want to achieve it in the most expedient way. Would that treatment also be appropriate for people that lose the ability to care for themselves in some way?

In Sandy's case, we did know how to help her, we did care, so we saved her. Well, we extended her life. I decided that she had value, even though she was unable to help herself in the situation she found herself in. My mother did a lot to extend my life by caring and knowing what to do, and by doing it.

 

[Raspy]

Hey Moss,

The story of your sister's dove reminded me of a great little book about a quail. It lived with people for a long time and had an amazing personality and will. It's called "That Quail, Robert" by Margaret A. Stanger and was first published in 1966. A neighbor gave me a copy as a possible guide for writing about Sandy and I liked it so much I ordered more to share.

 

[MossRoad]

Good points.

And if someone was to use Plowhog's example, they seem to be assuming that the animal will die no matter what you do, so why not just kill it in the name of reducing it's suffering. Taken a step further, we are all going to die, some very soon and some a bit later. Maybe killing everyone would reduce everyone's suffering. Or maybe the example of the bird could be re-interpreted as " we didn't know how to help it, and we didn't really care, so we let it die". The brick might be a more humane solution if you have already decided that reduced suffering is the main goal and you want to achieve it in the most expedient way. Would that treatment also be appropriate for people that lose the ability to care for themselves in some way?

In Sandy's case, we did know how to help her, we did care, so we saved her. Well, we extended her life. I decided that she had value, even though she was unable to help herself in the situation she found herself in. My mother did a lot to extend my life by caring and knowing what to do, and by doing it.

When my dad was dying of congestive heart failure due to amyloidosis that was brought on by his multiple myeloma cancer, he was laying there in his hospital bed drowning in his own fluids, suffering badly. I told him "Dad, if you were my dog, I'd have put you down a few weeks ago." He laughed hard, which, of course, made him cough hard, which, of course, made me cry hard. He said "It isn't that bad yet." And that was his decision. An animal can't tell you when it is or isn't too bad yet, so you gotta do the best you can.

 

[Rock Crawler]

Really cool read. Love the story! I am a dog guy, as I bet a lot here are.

What I find funny is some of your descriptions and likeness to domestic dogs that suggests that there are for sure still wild traits in your Yote, yet there are many things about your yote that remind me of my Angel. Angel is what I call a free range dog, I'm not one for teaching tricks or dominating a dog. Angel lives as she wants, always has. If she wants in the house, she comes in. If she wants out, we open the door and she leaves to do whatever she does. She is barely able to be on a leash, if leashed, she pulls until she nearly gags herself unconscious. A leash is a very rare event and is somewhat traumatic for her. It sounds like your yote hated the lease in similar fashion. Angel knows her name and knows a handful of common 1 word commands such as UP, BALL, SLEEP, FOOD, EASY, DOWN and a few more. But one thing about a free range dog is that they do not COME, STAY or pretty much do anything that is not of their current desire. Angel will come when she dang well pleases, and not a moment sooner. I bet Angel would have gotten along famously with your yote! They could have laughed together at the idiot humans trying to yell out ignored commands!

Had I been in your situation, I really feel that I would tried hard to keep that yote around as a free dog and let it live with us in whatever way it desired. If wanted in to sleep on the bed, fine. If it wanted out to disappear into the woods for hours, fine. Angel does it that way, she controls her life for the most part. We feed her, love her and let her do her thing.

Maybe the big difference between a truly wild dog and an unstructured domestic dog like mine is that if ANYONE goes outside and Angel is within earshot, she will come and be around. She is typically always within a couple hundred feet of me when I am out, she likes to lay half asleep and watch me working from under some shaded brush or a tree. And another difference may be that my domestic dog does often annoy me for physical attention. She will come to me or my wife and insist that she get rubbed, I suppose your wild dog put on more distance as it matured.

My dog is constant barker as well when she out making her security rounds, we have just under 15 acres that adjoin just over 2000 acres, and she pretty much knows our property area and the limits of it. She runs that property line many times a day and often at night, my suspicion is that she patrols what she feels is her domain and pushes back any wildlife that may want to try and come here. We do not have to worry about coons, rabbits or any other rodents because she kills them all if they are discovered.

I really would love to get a chance to experience some of the things that you were able to. Man, you sure had one **** of a unique chance to learn there, and it sounds as if you really did make the most of it!

Awesome!

 

[Raspy]

Rock,

That is a great report and it sounds very much like Sandy.

I often thought of her as some distant cousin that had come to visit. Sometimes we'd spend the day together and sometimes she'd do her own thing all day. I never trained her beyond a few very basic things, such as to wear a collar, some walking on a a leash, "UP" into the truck. She would come to me in the morning every time with a nice greeting, but during the day she would just look up as to say "I'm over here". While traveling she would get out of the truck to pee when we stopped and I opened the door, and then come back when I caller her. As you mentioned, calling her had mixed results and worked mainly if she got something out of it.

"Free range dog" is an excellent description as Sandy was not fenced in and spent most nights out in her den. But she did not patrol a large area and never at night as far as we could tell. Her territory was mainly about 200' around the house. She often wanted to come in, but as time went on the cat was really afraid of her. To reduce stress, we left Sandy mostly out at night.

She did not bark, like a regular dog and the yipping, or singing that coyotes are famous for wasn't displayed often. I have a video clip of her yipping, or singing at full volume with her head pointed straight up. Blasting her message out to the world. It is so funny. I used the sound clip for a phone ring for years and every time my phone would ring in a public place, somebody would look around fearfully to see the coyote that must be right behind them. Very funny! The constant singing they do in the night seems like a group dynamic thing while out running together. We tried practicing howling with her, but it scared her so we stopped. Howling and barking are different than singing. Growling while playing with me and play biting went on constantly. I growled at her and she growled at me as we went at it. I had mixed feelings about allowing her to bite like that because if she really got scared or felt trapped, she might just tear a big chunk out. But she never got aggressive, with the exception of warning us not to take away her road-kill rabbits. Once we gave one to her, it was hers and that was that. All of our interaction with her was a negotiation and not a trap. She was very cautious and I did not want to scare her or bring on the flight response. The trust that developed was touching. But some trickery was always evident too. Like hiding food. Then she would take her long naps in her den where she felt completely safe.