FEL Snowplow

sassafraspete · Jan 3, 2005

That reference picture of the plow on the JD, looks very much like the plow I have made by kasco mfg out of shelbyville In. There is a float mechanism built into the plow, (that bar in the middle running at a 45 degree angle), and also notice the pin toward the front....this locks the plow and keeps if from tilting forward....eg for dirt work.

Also, my experience with shoes and gravel is not good....but works good on pavement. Not sure if it will scratch the drive up though. (I don't have that worry).

Kenny, excellent job and post..... I just hope your boss isn't a TBN member. On the other hand...he probably would understand......

sassafraspete

sassafraspete · Jan 3, 2005

Oh, one other thing.... My shoes are like the ones at your dealers.... and I am thinking about eaither making a much wider foot so it floats on gravel better without digging in, or even thought about attaching a pipe the length of the blade to the shoe uprights and having one continuous shoe.....ends would have to be bent up so as to not dig in.

kennyd · Jan 3, 2005

Thanks for the suggestions Pete, But I have a paved driveway so I hope I will be in good shape as it is.

winchman · Jan 3, 2005

kennyd,

I have an 80" wide truck plow mounted to the bucket of my kubota B2410. I also thought that I would plow using the float position , but quickly found out that steering control was terrible. I had to re-design my mount to the bucket to allow the blade to float up and down independently from the loader boom. The more weight on the front tires, the better your steering will be. If you have time do a search for "How sweeeet" and you will find pictures of Mark in NH's set-up. I would set my plow up like his if I had a quick-attach bucket. Your fabricating and hydraulic plumbing look great.

winchman

mhalla · Jan 3, 2005

Ken, thanks for the posting. lots of good work done on your part.

I recently bought a 60 inch John Deere front blade made for the 1400 and 1500 series front mowers and plan to attach it to the FEL arms on my John Deere 2210.

Several questions.

1) What size and thickness of angle iron did you use across the bottom between the loader arms?

2) What size rectangular tubing did you use for the uprights and across the top?

3) How did you attach the pin to the angle iron? I am refering to the pin that goes through the hole in the loader arm bracket to complete the FEL attachment. It's the same pin that is found on your bucket. Did you just weld the pin to the surface of the angle iron or did you drill a hole in the angle iron to fit the pin and weld a bead to one or both sides?

Thanks again for your timely posting. I was just sizing up the steel I need to make my mount and found the information in your posting to be very valuable.

Mike

cleatus · Jan 3, 2005

Very good job and great thread.

mhalla · Jan 3, 2005

( Kennyd,

Do you plan on plowing with your loader valve in the "float" position? If so, I think you will have problems steering your tractor. My goal would be to have the plow resting on the ground and still have the full weight of the loader boom on my front tires. Maybe I'm missing something in your pictures, but it looks like you have the plow mounted rigid.
I don't mean to be critical. Just want you to be happy with the performance.

winchman
)

Winchman,

Do you know if there is the same problem with front mounted blades that attach to the tractor's frame? Does the down force from the height adjusting cylinder take weight off the front wheels and contribute to steering difficulty?

I am about to build an adapter to use a John Deere 60 inch front blade from a 1500 series mower on my John Deere 2210 and your posting has got me thinking about the need to add some "mechanical float" to the FEL bracket I need to design and build in order to mate the blade to my FEL arms.

Mike

PILOON · Jan 3, 2005

kennyd
Nice work.

Couple of comments----
(I plow with an 8' fisher on a GMC 4 x 4 and also use a MT180D 4x4 tractor)

Your skid shoes--,
I'd suggest that they be allowed to swivel(use a round pipe to fit the square 'socket' with more trailing than leading surface, otherwise you might find that when the plow is angled you will be scoreing the asphalt drive.
Fisher uses round skid plates for that reason.

Also noted that your angle cylinders are attached with bolts from bottom only. I think you will find that they will break or certainly bend. I'd suggest that you add top 'ears' so that the bolts act more like pins with upper and lower support.
My plow uses hardened 3/4" pins and even then I bend them all out of shape.

Plowing with the forward leading corner (or hitting a curb etc) will place awsome loads on that bolt.

Someone talked about 'float problems' and I agree, you need all the wt possible on the front wheels, and even then stearing is difficult.
Good skid shoes may cure that.

What fisher does is stack washers between the shoe and the holder to accomplish the adjustements (They use a 1' rod as shoe 'pole' in a 1 1/8" 'holder'.

Otherwise nice job and good workmanship.

PILOON · Jan 4, 2005

mhalla

If you analize the angles involved and forces, I think you'd rapidly find that a plow attached to 2 'arms' or a rack that was as parallel to the ground as possible would be best.
Example would to have the pivot point for raising/lowering back midway and possibly attached to the lower tractor frame or even the loader sub frame.

I venture to suggest that the best all around installation might be a pair (properly cross braced) of 3" channels that would attach to the rear axel housing.

The natural forces (read heavy snow load) naturally tend to lift the front end off of the ground because of the loader's high pivot point. ie it wants to jack knife the front upwards resulting in a loss of stearing.

On the other hand to turn right angle the plow to the left etc.
(Does kinda dump the snow in all the wrong places however)

Been there done that!

Note I have a MT180D and a GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 with a Fisher 8' plow.
I found that with the tractor I could only push straight forward
so I abandoned tractor plowing in favor of keeping the loader to lower the snowbanks and loading sand etc.
Mind I have a 5' blower on the tractor but still favor the truck as it gets around much faster.

All the folks around here that mount plows on tractors favor using the lowest pivot point possible, even to the extent of bolting plates to the sides of the front tractor frame in order to get a straight line push.
Many even make 3 positions available. One straight line and the others about 1" higher and lower.
The higher one 'digs in' the blade for icy surfaces and the lower one lets the blade 'ride up' to create higher snow piles.

kennyd · Jan 4, 2005

( kennyd,

I have an 80" wide truck plow mounted to the bucket of my kubota B2410. I also thought that I would plow using the float position , but quickly found out that steering control was terrible. I had to re-design my mount to the bucket to allow the blade to float up and down independently from the loader boom. The more weight on the front tires, the better your steering will be. If you have time do a search for "How sweeeet" and you will find pictures of Mark in NH's set-up. I would set my plow up like his if I had a quick-attach bucket. Your fabricating and hydraulic plumbing look great.

winchman )

WinchMan,
Thanks for you concern, I have seen Mark's setup. I guess I will just have to wait till it snows to see how it does. That is why I am not painting it yet, just in case I need to make changes. I will keep you all informed!

kennyd · Jan 4, 2005

( Ken, thanks for the posting. lots of good work done on your part.

I recently bought a 60 inch John Deere front blade made for the 1400 and 1500 series front mowers and plan to attach it to the FEL arms on my John Deere 2210.

Several questions.

1) What size and thickness of angle iron did you use across the bottom between the loader arms?
 The angle is 5/16" thick by 3"x3" 
2) What size rectangular tubing did you use for the uprights and across the top?
 The tubing is 2"x3" box with 3/16" wall

3) How did you attach the pin to the angle iron? I am refering to the pin that goes through the hole in the loader arm bracket to complete the FEL attachment. It's the same pin that is found on your bucket. Did you just weld the pin to the surface of the angle iron or did you drill a hole in the angle iron to fit the pin and weld a bead to one or both sides?
 The angle was drilled, then the pin welded on the back side, If you weld on the pins side, you will have to grind it flat so the angle rests flat on the plate on the FEL. Clear as mud?
See the picture in this POST
 Thanks again for your timely posting. I was just sizing up the steel I need to make my mount and found the information in your posting to be very valuable.

Mike )
 Also, the pins and hooks are available from JD for about $20.00, it saves alot of fabricating time.

kennyd · Jan 4, 2005

( kennyd
Nice work.

Couple of comments----
(I plow with an 8' fisher on a GMC 4 x 4 and also use a MT180D 4x4 tractor)

Your skid shoes--,
I'd suggest that they be allowed to swivel(use a round pipe to fit the square 'socket' with more trailing than leading surface, otherwise you might find that when the plow is angled you will be scoreing the asphalt drive.
Fisher uses round skid plates for that reason.
 Thats a good thought, I agree that the skid may need to be redesigned, it was late, we were tired and just needed to get done. 
Also noted that your angle cylinders are attached with bolts from bottom only. I think you will find that they will break or certainly bend. I'd suggest that you add top 'ears' so that the bolts act more like pins with upper and lower support.
My plow uses hardened 3/4" pins and even then I bend them all out of shape.
 There is a tab on top, it was part of the origanal A-Frame,look closely ate the "side view of plumbing" post. 
Plowing with the forward leading corner (or hitting a curb etc) will place awsome loads on that bolt.

Someone talked about 'float problems' and I agree, you need all the wt possible on the front wheels, and even then stearing is difficult.
Good skid shoes may cure that.

What fisher does is stack washers between the shoe and the holder to accomplish the adjustements (They use a 1' rod as shoe 'pole' in a 1 1/8" 'holder'.
 Yes, I have seen that, Meyer's does the same, I just did not have access to them when I built it.
Otherwise nice job and good workmanship.
Thank you. )

gbirky · Jan 4, 2005

mhalla,
Take a look at this thread where I describe how I mounted a JD 54" hydraulic front blade to my Yanmar YM1301D tractor. I also have some information on my web page.

No snow yet this year - more like 55 deg F and raining today. Figures, I guess its because I now have insurance - see attached photo.

PILOON · Jan 5, 2005

gbirky

Had a look at your detailed pics. Kinda like the plow 'quick attach' setup.

Noted that your geometry gives you a fairly 'straightline' push.
Do you find that you have adaquate steering control?
The answer interests me as my MT180D is about in the same size catagory as your Yanmar.

I have been thinking of adding mounting so as to be able to use my truck blade on the Mitsubishi in case I need to have a backup.(I have snapped the odd axle on the truck from time to time)
Mind you the truck blade is 8' wide and the Mitshubishi only 4' wide. Might be a bit of overkill for the MT.

I might attempt a jurry rigging for a fast test just to see if all I do is spin the wheels.
Might work as I have chains and rear tires are filled as well as a 5ft blower mounted on the 3pt.

gbirky · Jan 6, 2005

The blade is from a JD317 which my Dad owns. I took a look at the 317 mounting height and just recreated it with the mounting bracket for my YM1301D. So it should perform as is did on the 317. I just did all this work in the fall, and we haven't had a flake of snow yet (49 deg F and raining today). The only thing I have done is to use it as a dozer blade in some loose dirt I had tilled up. It seemed to work quite well for that. I'll let you know how it works in snow once I have tried it out.

kennyd · Jan 9, 2005

Ok guys, Thank for all your kind words and suggestions.
The skid shoes have been bugging me, and I need some advice...
I saw these Iron Caster Wheels at TSC and I thought they might work great. I was thinking the 3" ones.
I could mount them to the shoes I already have,would be good for the asphalt drive I have, and do OK in gravel should the need arise(side job).

Need more thoughts and advise from the experts please... /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Tevi · Jan 9, 2005

I think the air filled caster would be better.I think it would roll on gravel better and be less likely to jam up with a rock

kennyd · Jan 11, 2005

( The skid shoes have been bugging me, and I need some advice...
I saw these Iron Caster Wheels at TSC and I thought they might work great. I was thinking the 3" ones.
I could mount them to the shoes I already have,would be good for the asphalt drive I have, and do OK in gravel should the need arise(side job).
)

No more opinions from the TBN Collective?
/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

ronjhall · Jan 11, 2005

No more opinions from the TBN Collective? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif
You have to be kidding? /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
Why else would you start a thread on TBN?
IMHO I do not think the Sintered metal casters will hold up. Look at using a round shaft and allow your original skid shoes to swivel. This is a proven design that is on most commercial snow blades.

PineRidge · Jan 11, 2005

Kenny it's been our experience that TSC is a bit higher in pricing on casters. We did a bit of research when we built our backhoe dolly. Try this search at Surplus Center to compare casters

TC-40D SS web pictures click here