EGR failure....

[spruce Deere]

After 6 years and 3 months of near flawless operation, AND out of warranty the XR 3140's egr valve gave it up. Better now while getting ready for the spring get everything done race and not in the middle of the race.

The code S27 F08 made itself known this morning moving some things around with the tractor. So I pulled the tractor in the shop, turned off the key and a screechy, grinding noise eminated from under the hood, and a little later found it's the sound of the failed electrical controlled egr.

I did a little research, read sometimes removing and cleaning it works, but it didn't this time.

Plus side of all this malarkey, I found the obd port behind the bottom kick panel on the drive pedal 'right' side of the dash. Was happy to see it plugged right in to my scan tool. Then learned the dpf is 'severely' plugged.... a symptom of a malfunctioning egr.

Like the tractor, but do not like the pointless emissions forced oppon it, or any brand of any implement at all.

I tell ya, getting the dpf cleaned is nothing 'under 200 clams' compared to the price for a new egr thing $1,300 bucks and some change.

Looks like there is other options though

 

[GS650GL]

The S27 F08 code is EGR position fault. Either the valve is stuck or the position sensor has failed. It doesn't automatically mean your DPF is plugged. S81 F07 means it's plugged, and S81 F0 means DPF overload and needs a regen. S81 F11 means DPF fault triggers reduced torque (Engine derate) which can be caused by any of the above faults. If you try to fix it the right way and replace the EGR valve, it's gonna get really expensive because the original Erae valve was discontinued by the manufacturer. Nothing LS could do but change to a different Kamtech valve, so it has to have a conversion kit installed to be able to install the new valve. And the ECU software would need to be updated as well. Some people have cleaned the EGR valve with limited success. If it fails electrically, (position sensor or H-bridge circuit), there's nothing you can do but replace it. If the EGR valve and piping is shiny and wet inside, the EGR cooler could be leaking coolant into it. You can take the DPF apart and inspect it for plugging if necessary. Possibly consider deleting the system versus having it converted to the new EGR valve. There are people out there that offer it. Sadly, if it would have failed within 5 years, the emission warranty would have covered the new EGR and conversion kit.

 

[spruce Deere]

GS650GL, I pulled the egr from the tractor and cleaned it out, manually moved it open and closed. It really was not that bad. I'm guessing something electrical in the controler of the valve is just gunny bag.

The code did say iirc, short or connection issue. No wires were loose, rubbed or chewed on.

There is Allen bolts that hold the plastic cover on the valve. The two tiny ones on the bottom only back out so far and quit. Without getting straight western with it, it did not want to come apart.

 

[Cycledude]

The screechy grinding noise you describe sounds familiar, my XR 4155 has done that a few times for a few seconds right after starting the engine but so far no codes displayed on the dash and everything seems to work like it’s supposed to.
I had thought the noise was somehow related to cold starts but the other day after was done using it I shut it off before letting it idle for 2 minutes to cool the turbo so I restarted it about 10 seconds later and got the same screechy grinding noise for a few seconds.

 

[GS650GL]

Every time you turn the key off, the EGR valve cycles open and closed 3 times. It's normal to hear a distinct sound when it cycles 3 times, but when it's failing it sometimes makes a loud squealing or screeching sound. This is after turning the key switch off. If it makes noise after startup, that's a different issue. Usually a belt. Inside the EGR valve, there's a linear actuator to open and close it, position sensor, and circuit board. It's not intended to be taken apart and there's nothing you can repair inside anyway. The only thing you can really do is clean the plunger that moves when it opens and closes to try to make it move easier if it's sticking, and hope for the best. There has not been a high success rate by cleaning it, but it's always worth trying.

 

[spruce Deere]

I monkey'd with the egr valve some more this morning, REALLY tried to take it apart but only managed to break off some of the plastic from the housing. I have a game plan I'm putting forth tomorrow besides looking at bank loans to just further this epa mandated junk.....

 

[johns_dmax]

My NH Boomer 55 threw up the same error code a while back.
Took it to the only dealer in central OK for repair, its been there since December and still not ready to come home.

They installed the EGR conversion kit and then it wouldn't start. They changed out some other parts from a different machine and got it to run but was pushing way to much fuel through the engine. Last I heard they were going to replace the injectors and try again. Going to call again to see if they had any better luck.

I'm not sure if its related but I had them do some basic maintenance while it was there. Just an oil and filter change, antifreeze flush and fill, and fuel filter change. The fuel filter has been upgraded so it needed a conversion kit also but that shouldn't cause any problems.

OP, hope you have better luck than I have. I had thought about the EGR delete but didn't really want to go down that road.

 

[spruce Deere]

Yikes johns_Dmax!! That's not good. What motor is in your Boomer 55 the LS or the shibura??

I did read the 'upgraded' egr valve requires an ecm reprogramming, Yippy.

I cannot afford this kind failure of pointless epa bolt on garbage every other year or more often than that. Like i said earlier, like the tractor, dispise all this gone to far emissions B.S.

Talked to a caterpillar equipment mechanic that was servicing a dozer we rented last year. He said easily 75%of his service calls are dpf, egr or def emissions relate and thats highly regarded caterpillar equipment. At work, with the newer equipment 'caterpillar' 9 times out of 10 when error codes pop up it's emissions.

The downfall of mankind will be a combination of the EPA and A.I. Watch the terminator movies, take notes and watch them again....

 

[GS650GL]

My NH Boomer 55 threw up the same error code a while back.
Took it to the only dealer in central OK for repair, its been there since December and still not ready to come home.

They installed the EGR conversion kit and then it wouldn't start. They changed out some other parts from a different machine and got it to run but was pushing way to much fuel through the engine. Last I heard they were going to replace the injectors and try again. Going to call again to see if they had any better luck.

I'm not sure if its related but I had them do some basic maintenance while it was there. Just an oil and filter change, antifreeze flush and fill, and fuel filter change. The fuel filter has been upgraded so it needed a conversion kit also but that shouldn't cause any problems.

OP, hope you have better luck than I have. I had thought about the EGR delete but didn't really want to go down that road.

There is a service bulletin about no start after doing the EGR conversion. I can't remember the details, but will try to find it. Update: I found it. The dealer needs to do a EGR reset procedure 4 times. I will make a new post on the details so it shows at the top of this thread.

 

[johns_dmax]

Yikes johns_Dmax!! That's not good. What motor is in your Boomer 55 the LS or the shibura??

I did read the 'upgraded' egr valve requires an ecm reprogramming, Yippy.

I cannot afford this kind failure of pointless epa bolt on garbage every other year or more often than that. Like i said earlier, like the tractor, dispise all this gone to far emissions B.S.

Talked to a caterpillar equipment mechanic that was servicing a dozer we rented last year. He said easily 75%of his service calls are dpf, egr or def emissions relate and thats highly regarded caterpillar equipment. At work, with the newer equipment 'caterpillar' 9 times out of 10 when error codes pop up it's emissions.

The downfall of mankind will be a combination of the EPA and A.I. Watch the terminator movies, take notes and watch them again....

The tractor is a 2017 model and I believe an LS engine.
They replaced the parts, flashed the ECM, and no go.
Good luck on yours

 

[johns_dmax]

There is a service bulletin about no start after doing the EGR conversion. I can't remember the details, but will try to find it.

Thanks that'd help alot.
I would think the dealer would have access to that as well.

 

[ctadds]

The S27 F08 code is EGR position fault. Either the valve is stuck or the position sensor has failed. It doesn't automatically mean your DPF is plugged. S81 F07 means it's plugged, and S81 F0 means DPF overload and needs a regen. S81 F11 means DPF fault triggers reduced torque (Engine derate) which can be caused by any of the above faults. If you try to fix it the right way and replace the EGR valve, it's gonna get really expensive because the original Erae valve was discontinued by the manufacturer. Nothing LS could do but change to a different Kamtech valve, so it has to have a conversion kit installed to be able to install the new valve. And the ECU software would need to be updated as well. Some people have cleaned the EGR valve with limited success. If it fails electrically, (position sensor or H-bridge circuit), there's nothing you can do but replace it. If the EGR valve and piping is shiny and wet inside, the EGR cooler could be leaking coolant into it. You can take the DPF apart and inspect it for plugging if necessary. Possibly consider deleting the system versus having it converted to the new EGR valve. There are people out there that offer it. Sadly, if it would have failed within 5 years, the emission warranty would have covered the new EGR and conversion kit.

Is there a source or manual that explains what all of these S and F codes mean? I have not been able to find one.

 

[Eagle1]

Is there a source or manual that explains what all of these S and F codes mean? I have not been able to find one.

Try here
https://tractorbynet.com/forums/thr...g-3135h-and-others-are-in-this-thread.495552/

 

[ctadds]

I went through that, but didn't see any service codes.

It is a nice manual though, so thanks.

 

[Eagle1]

I went through that, but didn't see any service codes.

It is a nice manual though, so thanks.

I have had the NH workmaster manual on line but dropped that server.
I just put a couple of manuals in ZIP format online. I know the codes are in section 55 of the NH Workmaster manual. Same machine as the 31xx LS tractor.
LS XG3135H.zip

Hope it helps.

 

[ctadds]

Great, thanks

 

[GS650GL]

Is there a source or manual that explains what all of these S and F codes mean? I have not been able to find one.

I posted a fault code list in this forum in the past, but can't find where it is, so here it is again. Doesn't tell the diagnostic steps, but at least you will know what the codes mean.

 

[GS650GL]

There is a service bulletin about no start after doing the EGR conversion. I can't remember the details, but will try to find it. Update: I found it. The dealer needs to do a EGR reset procedure 4 times. I will make a new post on the details so it shows at the top of this thread.

My NH Boomer 55 threw up the same error code a while back.
Took it to the only dealer in central OK for repair, its been there since December and still not ready to come home.

They installed the EGR conversion kit and then it wouldn't start. They changed out some other parts from a different machine and got it to run but was pushing way to much fuel through the engine. Last I heard they were going to replace the injectors and try again. Going to call again to see if they had any better luck.

I'm not sure if its related but I had them do some basic maintenance while it was there. Just an oil and filter change, antifreeze flush and fill, and fuel filter change. The fuel filter has been upgraded so it needed a conversion kit also but that shouldn't cause any problems.

OP, hope you have better luck than I have. I had thought about the EGR delete but didn't really want to go down that road.

I finally found the information on no start after doing the EGR conversion. After doing the conversion, the ECU has to have new software loaded into it from the dealer's laptop service tool, and they also need to do a EGR valve reset which tells the ECU that the EGR valve has been replaced. I knew that part, but couldn't remember the fix for no start after doing that. They need to do the reset 4 times and turn the key switch off and wait a minute between each reset. If they don't do it 4 times, the ECU can improperly read the EGR valve open and closed values, so it won't let the engine start. It needs to see a closed value of 124 and an open value of 821. The dealer can see these values when doing a EGR test where they can command the EGR valve open and closed with the service tool. Doing the reset 4 times allows the ECU to learn the new values of the new valve and fixes that issue. Also while doing the conversion, the fuel filter housing must be removed while the manifold is being replaced. If the filter assembly is allowed to hang by the fuel lines unsupported, it can turn sideways or upside down and get airlocked and also get sediment in the primer check valves. This would make it nearly impossible to get the system primed and get all air out when everything is reassembled. Hope this helps

 

[Eagle1]

They need to do the reset 4 times and turn the key switch off and wait a minute between each reset. If they don't do it 4 times, the ECU can improperly read the EGR valve open and closed values, so it won't let the engine start. I

This is the reason techs hate engineers.....