Do You Want A Backhoe With That?

[rScotty]

Recently I've read a couple of threads where folks were undecided about whether to add a backhoe to their tractor purchase. Most people don't have a problem with the usefulness of 4wd or FEL, but backhoes seem to be a question. Maybe the experience we've had will help someone decide. Anyway, here's some thoughts from years of working both with and without.

First of all, all tractor work depends on the land. We have about 20 wooded mountainous acres with a creek. So our tractor use isn't for traditional Agricultural chores of plowing, planting, and mowing. Ours tends towards moving dirt, rocks, and trees. Typically it is more like construction where we are building things in the dirt, working on the creek crossing, landscaping, dirt road maintenance, and snow plowing.

For the first 20 years we just had a nifty little compact 4wd with FEL...and folks, with that combination we were simply in Hog Heaven. If you have to have only one tool make it a 4WD with a FEL - and a good 3pt hitch of course. Then one day I got a chance to buy an old 3 pt type backhoe - which we did and used it for the next 15 years. BTW, years later I sold it as is for 90% of what it cost - and the guy was grateful to get it.
From that experience we already knew that our next tractor would have a fully mounted BH with a hydraulic thumb on the bucket. That's the setup we've had now for the last five years....

Just rambling, my opinion that whenever a person can do it, the very best way to find out if you have a use for a tool is to have it handy and see it it gets used. Of course that's all easy to say and difficult to make happen, but a forum like this one is part of the answer to that problem.

What we found is that when we didn't have a backhoe we mostly didn't miss it. Many of the jobs that required digging holes or ditches could be done in some other way or just by hiring someone who did have one. Creativity helps. I even mounted a BH bucket upside down to the FEL and did some ditching that way.

Later when the little 3pt hitch type backhoe came along it surprised us with how much strength it had curling the bucket as well as how limited it was in what it could lift and how far. Particularly in how high it didn't lift! Underpowered and shaky, with limited movement, it was worth having but was basically just another implement.

It was only when I got to use a backhoe that was solidly mounted to the frame and coupled with a hydraulic bucket thumb that it suddenly became a whole different type of tool.
Now that we have a solid BH and thumb it is probably the most useful tool we have maintaining our wooded acres. Just as handy as the front end loader. One day we use the BH thumb to hold logs while we cut them to size and then it stacks them where needed. The next day we are using the BH & thumb to carefully sort and lay rocks in a rock garden. It excels at grabbing and moving things. Particularly if it needs to push some dirt around and then grab something and move it there. Also good for brush, slash, and stumps.

Final thought - It wasn't the backhoe so much as mounting it right and particularly the addition of the hydraulic bucket thumb that made the difference. We found that a tractor with a solidly mounted backhoe and thumb became a whole new & different type of landscaping tool for us.....making it easy to combine strength and a delicate touch.
rScotty

 

[k0ua]

Without a doubt you have a very useful rig there!

James K0UA

 

[Carl_NH]

RScotty,

Good writeup on ultility of a BH..

We were both on the same trip with tractors.. Raised on a farm first tractor plowed, baled and finally we got an FEL with trip bucket to handle manure - that was a big day vs me forking it by hand. Then we got a bigger JD with a hydralic FEL bucket - another nice addition.

Fast foward about 20 years and I get my own Mitsubishi 18HP compact with FEL - did a lot, then got a Kubota L185 DT with FEL and 3 PT BH - I restored the entire unit and loved the BH but mounting was not great so traded to a builder for my barn, and bought the B21 and do everything you refer - rocks, log cutting, transplanting etc.

Would love to have your M59 but cant really justify a bigger machine and hyd Thumb - I have a neighbor with a CAT416 so that chips in if needed.


Carl

 

[jenkinsph]

rScotty,
Nice write up and rig you have there, I will have to consider adding a thumb to mine.

 

[texasjohn]

Superb write up...and photos!

 

[TripleR]

Good write up and puts it in perspective. We have three farms with several hundred acres including about 200 acres of woods. We haven't farmed in over thirty five years; rent it all out, so most of our work is dirt/mowing. If we don't have them hooked to a rotary cutter, they have a box blade. We have an old Case back hoe that hasn't moved out of the shed in years and would take days to dig out and who knows how long to get running again. We keep it because it was a project of my dad and brother, lots of sentimental attachment.

We find it easier and cheaper to rent a back hoe or mini excavator every few years if needed rather than to put one on one of our tractors. So we don't have one not because we don't realize how handy they are, we have just found out we don't really use one. Now others will be entirely different.

I must admit when I see one, I would like to have it, but then look at our full barns, sheds etc. and walk away.

 

[Gary Fowler]

My thanks to Carl_NH for notifying me of the B26 with hydraulic thumb for sale over in Louisiana. Thanks to him, I now own it and could not believe the use I get out of that little tractor. Now I rarely use my 70 HP tractor except for bush hogging and disking and occassionally when I want to move a large quantity of dirt. I have put about 100 hours on it since I bought it in June of this year and only about 6 on my LS. I would not buy another back hoe without the hydraulic thumb it is that handy. I suppose a mechanical thumb would work to an extent, but the hydraulic thumb is so much more useful and never have to get off the tractor to adjust it.

 

[creekbend]

I enjoyed the post. There are times that I could use a BH but those few times don't justify me purchasing one. A friend of mine has an excavator and when I have need for his help, I call him and he helps me out. He times his schedule when he is working nearby. He treats me fairly and my Wife makes his Family a batch of brownies.

 

[rScotty]

RScotty,

Good writeup on ultility of a BH..

We were both on the same trip with tractors.. Raised on a farm first tractor plowed, baled and finally we got an FEL with trip bucket to handle manure - that was a big day vs me forking it by hand. Then we got a bigger JD with a hydralic FEL bucket - another nice addition.

Fast foward about 20 years and I get my own Mitsubishi 18HP compact with FEL - did a lot, then got a Kubota L185 DT with FEL and 3 PT BH - I restored the entire unit and loved the BH but mounting was not great so traded to a builder for my barn, and bought the B21 and do everything you refer - rocks, log cutting, transplanting etc.

Would love to have your M59 but cant really justify a bigger machine and hyd Thumb - I have a neighbor with a CAT416 so that chips in if needed.
Carl

Yep, there are still a few of us guys who grew up around tractors. Nice to be able to share some of what we've learned. I remember converting our old JD530 from a trip bucket to a hydraulic. Here's a picture from ten years ago. Yes, we still have that tractor. It's a keeper. My dad would be perplexed by why we prefer to live rurally on a few acres even when we don't work the land. Come to think about it, I'm not so sure myself...

The M59 is a nifty compromise almost dead center between a full size industrial tractor/loader/backhoe that you see on the construction sites and the more compact home owner machines. Frankly, I've wished it had more reach just about as many times as I've wished it were smaller and lighter.....so they got the compromise right. Part of the reason for that is its very tight turning radius. If I had to replace the M59, I'm not sure if I'd go smaller or larger. Best guess is that it would require one of each.

To my surprise, we've not wished or needed for the M59 to have more power or traction. That's true even though the wintertime use is mainly plowing snow with the front end loader. Be nice if it had a windshield though... .
rScotty

 

[swick1]

I have a backhoe and for a hilly or rocky or wooded property it is very useful. For flat clear land I would rent an excavator as needed.

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

The backhoe is great to have. Even simple things like stripping sod for a new garden or flower bed are much easier with it than the loader. Yes, it is one of those things that you'll find endless uses for if you have it but wouldn't rent one most of the time if you didn't.

I agree completely on the hydraulic thumb. Mine's mechanical right now, better than none but am certainly looking forward to converting it to hydraulic

 

[DennisFolsom]

I agree with rScotty that your need for a backhoe depends on your land and what you intend to do with it. I would add that it also depends on your approach to working on that land, especially whether you have big plans to do a lot in a short time, or whether, like me, you want to do it in small bits as you get the time and energy. Certainly, there are times and circumstances where it makes more sense to rent.

In the year and a third that I've owned my JD 4600 with loader and backhoe, I've used the backhoe for:

Digging out rocks
Digging out stumps
Pulling out a downed tree from the far side of a ditch
Excavating alongside my house foundation to repair a crack
Excavating for and placing concrete piers for both my shed and my deck
Reshaping and improving a ditch
Putting in culverts
Fluffing up an old partially burned brush pile before burning again
Burying a rock deeper that was too big to pull out
Moving rocks to align with the Mrs' landscaping ideas
Pulling out shrubs that the Mrs wanted to get rid of
regrading rough ground​

While it's true that some of these chores could have been done without the backhoe, most would have not been so easy without it.

Most of the above jobs also included the use of the loader. The following are some of the additional jobs I have done with the loader:

Snow removal on my 300 ft driveway and parking areas
Moving and spreading gravel
Moving firewood
Hauling waste wood, stumps and brush to my out-of-sight "rot piles"
Unloading things from the truck or the trailer
Delivering the grill to my new deck
Backdragging fill
Moving a shed
Moving pallets​

I like to operate the backhoe. At this point, I would say that I have at least mid-level skills with it. I also like the fact that it's there whenever I want to use it. On my 19 wooded acres, I'll never run out of work for the tractor, including the backhoe.

I could have bought a new smaller tractor with loader for what I paid for my 2001 JD 4600 with loader and backhoe. I'm glad I bought a size or two larger than I started shopping for. I'm extra glad that I held out for a deal on a machine with a hoe.

Your mileage may vary, but for me, the hoe makes the tractor much more useful.

 

[swick1]

Your mileage may vary, but for me, the hoe makes the tractor much more useful.

That's true. You now have a dirt digger and a dirt hauler. You can dig with a loader but a hoe is easier on the machine and will cut through hard ground.

 

[Carl_NH]

Yep, there are still a few of us guys who grew up around tractors. Nice to be able to share some of what we've learned. I remember converting our old JD530 from a trip bucket to a hydraulic. Here's a picture from ten years ago. Yes, we still have that tractor. It's a keeper. My dad would be perplexed by why we prefer to live rurally on a few acres even when we don't work the land. Come to think about it, I'm not so sure myself...

The M59 is a nifty compromise almost dead center between a full size industrial tractor/loader/backhoe that you see on the construction sites and the more compact home owner machines. Frankly, I've wished it had more reach just about as many times as I've wished it were smaller and lighter.....so they got the compromise right. Part of the reason for that is its very tight turning radius. If I had to replace the M59, I'm not sure if I'd go smaller or larger. Best guess is that it would require one of each.

To my surprise, we've not wished or needed for the M59 to have more power or traction. That's true even though the wintertime use is mainly plowing snow with the front end loader. Be nice if it had a windshield though... .
rScotty

Nice 530 and in great conditon too - it's nice you still have it and I am sure your dad appreciates it.

The first JD we had was a 420 that got the trip FEL loader, then we upgraded to a 1020 with a better FEL and hydraulic bucket.

I sometimes wonder if they are watching us and shaking their heads..

Carl

 

[txdon]

I loved my backhoe the other month when I came home at dark with a large water leak in the hard black land field. It just takes a few minutes to dig a deep diversionary hole next to the leak so you do not have to work in the mud and you do not contaminate your water line.

 

[leveled]

i have a MX 5100 what do I need to do I want one. That thing looks pretty sturdy.

 

[rmk700]

Nice TLB rScotty!

Very useful implemment. Use my BH alot. Heard/read horror stories about how difficult it can be to remove the BH so I finally decided to give it a try and wow...Kubota's design is great even on my ole L35. Had it off in a just few minutes and back on in a few.

 

[tractchores]

I get decent use out of my BH, but it's deceiving because it gets jobs done so fast it doesn't feel like I use it a ton, but by hand the job would have taken 10x longer and in many cases not been possible. I find myself constantly switching between my BH and the 3pt hitch during jobs. Its great to read about what others use the BH for, I'm always finding new uses. I'm using mine mostly for rock moving / removal, moving things with the thumb, building stone walls, cleaning drainage ditches and of course digging.

One question for you others using BH's, I saw someone mention transplanting. How do you do that with a BH? I've got a number of small trees (6' high) that I need to move, but haven't figured out a safe way to do it with the BH without damaging the trees trunk. Would love any suggestions.

 

[swick1]

I moved a tree once by digging around the roots and underneath the bottom about two feet. I used a strap around the trunk and moved it with the loader. The tree was about 10-12 ft high with a 6-8 inch trunk. The roots were banging my front end and the loader was raised to about 5ft

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

One question for you others using BH's, I saw someone mention transplanting. How do you do that with a BH? I've got a number of small trees (6' high) that I need to move, but haven't figured out a safe way to do it with the BH without damaging the trees trunk. Would love any suggestions.

It depends if it's evergreen or deciduous. A lot harder to do with evergreen due to the branch structure. You need a bucket big enough to fit the root ball - or mostly fit at least. Trench both sides of the root ball and cut into the ground on the close side to free it but leave the dirt in front. Tuck the boom up close to the trunk on the far side, dig in and scoop the ball up against the dirt left on the close side. If you have a helper available, you can get them to pull the tree to the side while you do the final scoop & lift. I've moved 12' ash trees without issue with this method using a 24" bucket.

Another option is if you have a lot of trees to do, get a second bucket cut the pin mounts off, move them to the edge of the bucket and weld them back on. This will give you an off-center bucket and be able to reach around the tree easier.