DIY Bridge

[rScotty]

By his sarcastic remark to my previous post he will not understand your post......

Well, that's sad. Those doglegs at property boundaries are kind of a giveaway. Especially with a road involved. But I didn't know myself until it happened to some locals. It can mean that the creek was moved laterally on one side of the road of the other, and the ditch next to the road makes a convenient path for a low-flow seasonal creek - until the ditch fills in & a few good rains come.
And that can take years...or decades.

About 200 local newcomers to our rural area also bought & built believing that the roads and the stream they saw were the same as they had always been.......oops, not.....

It was never difficult, but now it is easy to look up an address on Google Earth Pro, go up to View, and activate the Historical Imagery slider. That shows what the address once looked like. Images go way back to 1930 in some places. Here we are remote, but still have images to 1980s.
Amazing.
You can bet that I'll be looking at those historical views next time I look at some property.
rScotty

 

[deezler]

Sorry, I somehow missed the pics prior to requesting.

Looks pretty solvable. I'm somewhat envious of your excellent stash of free gravel that you now get to harvest.

My 2c (certainly not an expert) : When you see the water flow get to about as low as it ever gets (summer drought?), start digging with a proper machine. Straighten the flow path back out; dead straight - you might also have to reorient your driveway a little to get a fully perpendicular crossing. Scoop the channel out nice and deep, it's ok if you make a bit of a pond (it'll fill back in if so). But you probably want to carry out some depth a ways downstream as well if the topography supports. Carve the creek bed into the width that you feel comfortable building a bridge over. Well protected (big rock armored at a minimum) bridge abutments/supports with a deck height at least a foot above where you would ever expect to see water. This should let a huge volume of water go smoothly underneath, and if it ever gets high enough to also go around, whatever is then going around should at least be pretty calm flow, compared to the torrent that will be running properly under the bridge in your nice deep creek channel. So the excess flow could then run over your driveway on boths sides without hurting it or preventing travel.

If you do it right, the bridge will look like overkill 99% of the time, and during a flood, you'll say phew!

 

[garymartin63965]

It almost looks like the creek is doglegging at your driveway. I’ve seen people just build a concrete crossing, no pipes. Sometimes those hold up for a fairly long time.

It might end up that we go that route. There are several concrete slabs/low water crossings upstream and downstream that have been there quite awhile. I think just dredging out a lot of the gravel (at my driveway & below) and straightening out the creek will help tremendously.

 

[garymartin63965]

Aerial view sort of shows you didn't pay attention to creek channel over the years and allowed it to dogleg down the road instead of yearly maintenance to keep it where you want it... Water is like electricity it takes path of least resistance.... A little creative tractor work and some layers of coarse gravel and a shallow area where you want the water to flow is simple one day project...

Bridge or culverts or ford is long term solution ....

I haven’t been able to do much maintenance of the creek over the last 20 years. Partly because it is someone else’s property & I have a 30’ wide easement from the county road to where my property begins just east of the creek. We could park our cars/trucks close to the county road and wade the creek or use the four wheeler to go through the woods to get to the highway & then back to our county road. I even walked it a few times because it’s only 2-3 miles. Now the wife and I are retired and worried about getting emergency medical treatment.

 

[garymartin63965]

It sounds like this whole area isn't very much higher than the creek. Again a sketch or map of the drive and creek(s) would be helpful.

Your are right airbiscuit. From the east bank of the creek to the west, on my driveway the ground only drops 25” at its lowest point.

 

[airbiscuit]

So, is this your primary residence now? How many days/year is it currently impassable?

I think people are getting a better idea about your situation, so hopefully comments keep coming in. Maybe post more pics and a few more map views? Maybe one that includes the county road, the easement and your property lines?

 

[Rockbadchild]

If you are going to dig the creek bed for a bridge that's probably fine but for culverts, I would advise against it will only fill back up with sediments and your culvert will end up half full of dirt within a few years...

 

[2manyrocks]

Would your neighbors allow you to straighten the creek bed to get rid of the dog leg?

 

[airbiscuit]

1. So, is this your primary residence now?
2. How many days/year is it currently impassable?
3. Does the stream flow North to South or South to North?
4. In the areal photo, the stream bed is amazingly straight. Was that path created by man or nature?
5. Can you move that dogleg upstream or downstream so the creek flows straight across your driveway?
6. When the water is high across your driveway, is the current still, slow or swift?
7. Can you move your driveway to an upstream or downstream crossing?

Lots of questions I know, but related pieces of the puzzle.

 

[WranglerX]

I haven’t been able to do much maintenance of the creek over the last 20 years. Partly because it is someone else’s property & I have a 30’ wide easement from the county road to where my property begins just east of the creek. We could park our cars/trucks close to the county road and wade the creek or use the four wheeler to go through the woods to get to the highway & then back to our county road. I even walked it a few times because it’s only 2-3 miles. Now the wife and I are retired and worried about getting emergency medical treatment.

Check with "property rights" attorney you may have more permissions/authority to do repair work on easement than you think, and also you might be able to force other property owner to share in costs..... I also have a 40 feet wide 300 feet long easement across my property to 5 acre property behind me, fortunately for me, I own the "back property" also....

Property Easements: Overview

Learn the basics about property easements---what they are, how they work, types of easements, and more.

www.nolo.com

 

[Eagle1]

Forcing other people to share cost that they do not see as beneficial to them makes for friendly neighbors.

 

[2manyrocks]

neighbors who might have been helpful could dig their heels in while money that could have gone to pay for a bridge gets paid to an attorney.

 

[loggin]

Personally I think digging out the driveway and creating a bridge would be best; leaving some extra clearances with regard to length and height. It is likely that the creek may find/erode another path if the restriction at the driveway crossing were to become great enough and that would potentially create a whole new set of problems. I usually try to over-design/build rather than under-design/build. Might cost a little more upfront but typically cheaper and less time consuming in the long run. Would likely also help resale value of the property down the road.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[thebmrust]

While not a popular opinion, getting experts involved will result in significantly more money. But theoretically it will be done right. The first time. (wink wink)

Getting the government involved, could in essence, backfire.

The EPA (or one of the alphabet gangs) could get involved and life changes substantially. Not for the better.

Story Time: (fuzzy recollection) One of the forums I frequent, a guy had permission to grade and re-flow a dry flood plain of sorts on his own property. It was in conjunction with a state/fed road project adjacent or near to his property.

The project ended/cancelled and he was required to stop work then return his property back to original (even though he had prior permission to do the re-grading).

It’s currently in legal limbo. But the work stoppage was absolute. It’s the return to original or ‘fix for the better’ that’s being argued.

So, because it’s a waterway, it’s gonna get ugly once the various departments know you’re doing work.

Story 2: We have family that has unmetered, original water rights from near when the state became a state. They have the right to dredge a section where their irrigation pump sets in place. It’s a protected area off the main river channel (like a protected cove that gets backwater). It gets professionally dredged every 1-3 years. The other years they sometimes do it. Every time, someone reports them. The sheriff, fisheries manager, fish & game dept, and EPA show up. It’s a green pants party. Then they realize the actual location, and leave. But every time there is activity some yahoo upstream driving by calls them in.

Story3: Same family, their neighbors were approached by an alphabet dept sub company. Saying “we’ll dig you a free deep water well”. The trade for sub surface water, was the loss of river water rights AND the loss of surface water rights. Forever. The sub-company hit everyone in the valley. Many took the bait, most did not.

Be careful.

 

[garymartin63965]

Downstream neighbor says I can do anything I need, except cut down a bunch of trees. New upstream neighbor says I can work on it below his water gate as long as I don’t dam up the creek and cause more back up to the creek. His water gate is about 50 feet from my easement line, so that gives me room to get a dozer in there.

Would your neighbors allow you to straighten the creek bed to get rid of the dog leg?

Yes. I can take out the doglegs so the water doesn’t run down the driveway but it will be at a slight angle.

 

[airbiscuit]

If it is possible,it would be best if the stream flow is straight across your driveway, and any direction change (which slows water and deposits sediment) occurred upstream or downstream of your driveway.

 

[garymartin63965]

1. So, is this your primary residence now?
2. How many days/year is it currently impassable?
3. Does the stream flow North to South or South to North?
4. In the areal photo, the stream bed is amazingly straight. Was that path created by man or nature?
5. Can you move that dogleg upstream or downstream so the creek flows straight across your driveway?
6. When the water is high across your driveway, is the current still, slow or swift?
7. Can you move your driveway to an upstream or downstream crossing?

Lots of questions I know, but related pieces of the puzzle.

1. Yes, primary residence.
2. Days / year when it’s not possible varies. There are probably a total of only 4-6 days where we can’t cross it in a 4WD F250. When that happens it’s usually just a day at a time, two at most. There’s probably 6-8 WEEKS a year that we can’t get the cars out. That’s usually a week or two at a time. Last spring/summer was pretty wet here and we probably had to leave the car on the far side of the creek for about 6 weeks.
3&4. Creek flows North to South and was created by nature.
5. Can’t move the dog leg as in only have a 30 easement. Can try and do away with it.
6. The current is usually not so swift that I can’t wade across in chest waders. Only one time that I remember when it was too swift. My wife is 5’9” , 110 pounds & it’s too swift for her at times. If either of us would happen to slip or get knocked down, we’d be in real trouble. Plus we heading into our late 60’s now.
7. The crossing is at the NE corner of my property. The property runs 1320 ft south but the distance between my land and the road increases. I haven’t talked to that property owner about the possibility of moving the easement or selling me a swath of land at my southern border. It would also need a lot of dozing but there’s no dog leg in that area.

 

[airbiscuit]

Those answers are helpful.

Part of the problem is, over the last 20 years, the creek has moved a bit. It used to just flow across the drive after heavy rains. Now water runs and hits my driveway at the east end (bank) of the drive then doglegs west, with half the water turning south after about 30 ft and the rest of the water running down my drive 40-50’ before running south. I have an easement 30 ft wide X about 200 ft to the county road. The creek has another dogleg to the east just after my easement. That property owners has told me that I can have the area dredged to help with the flow.
Thanks for commenting.

Would that property owner let you dredge/move that dogleg upstream (or downstream)?

 

[2manyrocks]

I wonder how that dogleg came to be. The tree line suggests that the creek may have moved in a different path along the trees at one point.

 

[airbiscuit]

I wondered about that as well. It looks like it is back against the treeline farther south.