Diesel emissions

[Corkpuller]

What year did the change in emissions for tractors with >25hp come about?

The DPF and all the flashing warning lights, buzzers and what not, that tell me how to run my tractor.

Thanks

 

[Oldoak]

I don't know about all manufacturers, but I believe Kubota started with Tier 4 standards beginning 2015.

 

[jaydee325]

Your question is not easily answered. See the LINK from the EPA website. You will have to convert HP to kW. Don't forget to read the notes. That will really make it clear....(NOT!):confused2:

What year did the change in emissions for tractors with >25hp come about?

The DPF and all the flashing warning lights, buzzers and what not, that tell me how to run my tractor.

Thanks

 

[ruffdog]

I sure like the smokeless train engines and excavating equipment they build now.:thumbsup:

 

[Corkpuller]

My goal is to find out, what were the last year model Deere's and Kubota's in the 30-40hp range,,,,
that breathed on their own,
prior to this DPF age.

 

[Corkpuller]

I appreciate your input Mr Jeff, but I have no clue what the **** you just said.

I thought there would be a simple answer.

Like this here >>>>>>> in 2012 or 20?? all engines over 25hp require a bunch of EPA crap.

 

[Corkpuller]

In other words
What year model Deere and Kubota 30-40 hp in the used market be available without the REGEN DPF compliance stuff. ??

I understand year model tractors are unlike vehicles but, there has to be a year model for each brand that did and did not comply to the current emissions

 

[Wagtail]

My goal is to find out, what were the last year model Deere's and Kubota's in the 30-40hp range,,,,
that breathed on their own,
prior to this DPF age.

2014 was the last model year for JD prior to Tier IV implementation. I would imagine it would've been the same for Kubota.

 

[mcfarmall]

I sure like the smokeless train engines and excavating equipment they build now.:thumbsup:

I don't.

 

[rScotty]

My goal is to find out, what were the last year model Deere's and Kubota's in the 30-40hp range,,,,
that breathed on their own,
prior to this DPF age.

Before the DPF age tractor diesels still didn't exactly breath very well on their own. Starting about 2008, Kubota used EGR technology and parts to reburn the exhaust fumes in a lot of their tractors so that they could meet an loophole in the emission standard called "Tier IV Interm". Tier IV Interm reduced the nitrous oxides allowed in the exhaust but overlooked the resulting increased soot and particle production. Not good for motors, and made the diesel smoke even thicker. Some of those had terrible exhaust fumes, but technically they did meet the letter of the emission law.

So you have to go back at least 10 years to get to a place where engine efficiency was more important than emission control.
If that is your goal, look for something without EGR as well as without DPF. But you may not like the fumes very much.
luck,
rScotty

 

[chim]

For Kubota, I'm pretty certain the models identified as XX60 were the first to have DPF and regen. I had been looking for a slightly larger replacement for a B7500 and bought my L3200 in 2012 to avoid the Final Tier IV stuff.

 

[rScotty]

So is your L3200 an EGR type? EGR is less complex than DPF...less stuff to go wrong and less expensive. But also arguably not as good for engine longevity.

Both systems would seem to be fairly easy to disconnect.

So if you don't like emission controls and it really does seem to be a bother for some folks, then why not just disconnect the EGR and DPF systems? I understand that the air belongs to us all, but really....what's the difference between doing that and allowing them to buy an older machine with a pre-emissions control engine?
rScotty

 

[ruffdog]

Here is a very good site explaining the Tier 1-4 timeline for different products:

Emission Standards: USA: Nonroad Diesel Engines

 

[Milo]

......So you have to go back at least 10 years to get to a place where engine efficiency was more important than emission control.
If that is your goal, look for something without EGR as well as without DPF. But you may not like the fumes very much.
luck,
rScotty

And I would think the fact those engines were not designed to run on today's ultra low sulphur fuel could also be a negative.

 

[Oldoak]

Getting back to the original question:

For Kubota, I'm pretty certain the models identified as XX60 were the first to have DPF and regen. I had been looking for a slightly larger replacement for a B7500 and bought my L3200 in 2012 to avoid the Final Tier IV stuff.

I believe you are correct. The Kubota XX60 series appeared on the market in 2015.

Only time will tell if the emissions system will be problematic on my new Kubota L5060 GST which I purchased just this past Spring.

[Both systems would seem to be fairly easy to disconnect.

So if you don't like emission controls and it really does seem to be a bother for some folks, then why not just disconnect the EGR and DPF systems?/QUOTE]

I don't think it is quite as simple as that.

 

[Jstpssng]

And I would think the fact those engines were not designed to run on today's ultra low sulphur fuel could also be a negative.

I never found that to be a problem, and my 1984 L275 certainly had no emmision controls. What I did notice was that it smoked a lot less with the new low sulfur fuel. As for fuel economy, my old tractor burned just two quarts of diesel per operating hour. My Tier 4 2015 L3301 with 6 more hp also burns just the same amount.

 

[Corkpuller]

Ahh yeah, the ole EGR valve.
They could be a pain in the butt on the vehicles when they first came if I remember right.

All good info, thanks fellers!

 

[rScotty]

And I would think the fact those engines were not designed to run on today's ultra low sulphur fuel could also be a negative.

I would have thought so too. But So far that is turning out to not to be the problem it was initially thought to be. If there are changes in the engine construction or alloys the knowledge hasn't reached the tech literature - or at least I haven't seen it....which makes me think that any engine alloy changes were minor if at all. And yet there doesn't seem to be a lubricity problem with the ULSD fuel.

My guess is that the diesel refiners are adding lubricity back into the fuel to replace that inadvertently removed when the sulphur is extracted to make the fuel ULSD. They would almost have to do so to protect their fuel market share with the big users like truckers and heavy equipment.
Either that, or else it may be that everyone is adding some lubericant additive themselves. Most of the tractor and pickup guys I know use additives at least part of the time.
rScotty

 

[ruffdog]

Doosan's tier4 with no DPF:

http://www.doosanequipment.eu/doosa...ns-stageiv/doosan-solutions-egr-dpc-scr.page?

 

[Geotech]

Mahindra is doing it without dpf flters.