Oil & Fuel ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question

   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #1  

kkimura

Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2017
Messages
29
Location
Montesano, WA
Tractor
Kioti ck2610 hst
owner's manual lists hydraulic filter t5710-38031 but no hst filter on page 2-4. At page 7-17, the hst filter is shown by picture with tc20713a labeled on picture. Is that the hst filter p/n? I'd appreciate someone with the ck2610hst giving feedback on replacing the filters at the 50 hr mark and an identification of the replaced filter numbers. thanks
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #2  
No one has answered just yet so I'll jump in. I'm not a ck2610 owner, but I don't believe tc20713a is the part number.

* I believe the HST filter you are looking for is T5855-46531.
* The hydraulic filter is either a T2185-38031 or a T5710-38031.

BUT TO BE CERTAIN,
Shoot your dealer an email, they can clear it up for you pretty quick. I've even had great luck sending corporate an email and getting a technical answer pretty quick, as my local dealer was not as knowledgeable as maybe they should have been.

I'm sure someone who owns one will also chime in and set this straight.
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question
  • Thread Starter
#3  
thank you for your response. I got frustrated and drove to the dealer and pickup the three filters for the 50 hr. service. $77.30 for e6201-32443 (engine), t2185-38031(hydraulic) and t5855-46531(hst). Seemed very reasonable. I was expecting a much higher price on the hydraulic filter ($32.40) and Hst filter (27.99). You were correct on the hst filter no. It's crazy how the owner's manual doesn't list the correct hydraulic and hst filters. Anyway, these numbers should let others' cross reference to other brands.
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #4  
I agree, thats a good price. I know the HST filter on the CK tractors are not quite as ridiculous and the DKse tractors HST filter. But there are cross references now for better options.

As for the CK2610
Engine Filter: Kioti E6201-32443 = Wix 51324
Hydraulic Filter: Kioti T2185-38031 = Wix NA
HST Filter: Kioti T5855-46531 = Wix 51621
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #5  
HOLD ON! Something has changed on the 2017 CK series OR its just the CK2610 that's different and the manual SUCKS.

The HST filters I have seen have spanner nut indents and reports have been that they are extremely hard to remove. The CK2610 does NOT have this filter nor was either difficult to remove...very typical in fact.

And when you remove the passenger side filter with the big seal OD, 2.5 GALLONS of fluid comes out. BE PREPARED.

Also note...the manaul does NOT say to replace the engine oil at 50hr for the CK2610 tier 3 engine. Dealer was wrong...internet is wrong.

The manual says to replace the Transmission and Hydraulic filters at 50hrs (BUT DOE NOT LIST THE Tranmission FILTER NUMBER ANYWHERE)...and strongly believe this is not necessary...in fact its ridiculous.)

And what the **** is the difference on this machine? Hydraulic fluid IS the Transmission fluid. Cause as far as I can find...or not find...there's no seperate system for hydralic's vs transmission on a unit with Hydro drive! So why 2 different filters...and why the piss poor info in the manual!!!

ua0jva7.jpg


mcQRCnL.jpg


YSnbpHE.jpg


wwnzZ5t.jpg


mHHOZo7.jpg



Oil change and filter was super easy...but apparently not actually required at 50hrs.
Lqwe1kW.jpg
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #6  
HOLD ON! Something has changed on the 2017 CK series OR its just the CK2610 that's different and the manual SUCKS.

The HST filters I have seen have spanner nut indents and reports have been that they are extremely hard to remove. The CK2610 does NOT have this filter nor was either difficult to remove...very typical in fact.

And when you remove the passenger side filter with the big seal OD, 2.5 GALLONS of fluid comes out. BE PREPARED.

Also note...the manaul does NOT say to replace the engine oil at 50hr for the CK2610 tier 3 engine. Dealer was wrong...internet is wrong.

The manual says to replace the Transmission and Hydraulic filters at 50hrs (BUT DOE NOT LIST THE Tranmission FILTER NUMBER ANYWHERE)...and strongly believe this is not necessary...in fact its ridiculous.)

And what the **** is the difference on this machine? Hydraulic fluid IS the Transmission fluid. Cause as far as I can find...or not find...there's no seperate system for hydralic's vs transmission on a unit with Hydro drive! So why 2 different filters...and why the piss poor info in the manual!!!

ua0jva7.jpg


mcQRCnL.jpg


YSnbpHE.jpg


wwnzZ5t.jpg


mHHOZo7.jpg



Oil change and filter was super easy...but apparently not actually required at 50hrs.
Lqwe1kW.jpg

Although the fluid is all the same, the HST filter is specific for the HST drive mechanism. It is a much higher pressure filter than the hydraulic filter. If you can find a flow diagram, you'll see that all of the oil is pulled through the one hydraulic filter, then there is a split in the line. One way, there is a gear pump that services your 3 pt hitch, front end loader, etc. The other way, there is a charge pump for the HST as well as the HST filter. The HST filter provides even more filtration for all oil entering the HST mechanism which is more sensitive to dirty oil.

And I understand why it may seem foolish to change filters out with only 50 hours on them, but know there is a lot of casting, manufacturing, and wear in metal debris to consider, with brand new equipment, that can clog filters much faster than in a seasoned machine.
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #7  
Thanks for the reply.

I happen to specialize in sand and investment casting engineering/design for potable water systems. I'm 100% certain the speculation as to why Kioti states to change these two massive hydraulic filters is not due to any sort of manufacturing residue. These systems are far to delicate and tightly toleranced to allow such residue to ever circulate.

I saved the 2 filters but did not bring them home. I'll eventually cut them open to prove my point.

One filter might be under slight pressure and the other a slight vacuum may be both see pressure. But I'm also 100% certain neither of these are high pressure filters in terms of being special or unlike other standard filters like the filters with spanner wrench fittings and thick walls. Not only are they missing features for tightening and securing, but they are thin metal like all the rest. And most importantly, much too large to hold any significant pressure.

So really, we have no idea what's behind Kioti's specs and I still find it incredibly odd there are two filters for the same fluid.



What I really want to get out there is that when removing the transmission filter 2.5 gallons of fluid dropped. This really pissed me off because I was not prepared for it. Not prepared for that much to come out...nor enough to refill the system. Had I known this ahead of time, I would not have changed either filter until 200 hours when the oil and oil filter are called to be replaces.
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question
  • Thread Starter
#8  
I agree, the manual appears to be a cut and paste over an older ck model. Look closely at the tractor used for illustration and you will see a tractor configuration for a different model. Little things like the location of the main hydraulic drain or the secondary engine oil fill port. There are similar threads on this site for changing the hydraulic fluid. People have suggested hooking the shop vac to the hydraulic fill port to plugging a vent hole to reduce the oil loss from changing the filters. The maintenance schedule only calls for filter changes after 50 hours and 200 hours. Fluid change is called for at 400 hours and thereafter it doesn't specify a fluid change! The frustration is the manual maintenance schedule must be interpreted and adjusted upon reading the maintenance code text. The text specifies a filter change every 200 hours and fluid change if it is contaminated (?) or the transmission is repaired. Also if you change the fluid, it recommends the filters be replaced. What could be clearer?
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #9  
Thanks for the reply.

I happen to specialize in sand and investment casting engineering/design for potable water systems. I'm 100% certain the speculation as to why Kioti states to change these two massive hydraulic filters is not due to any sort of manufacturing residue. These systems are far to delicate and tightly toleranced to allow such residue to ever circulate.

I saved the 2 filters but did not bring them home. I'll eventually cut them open to prove my point.

One filter might be under slight pressure and the other a slight vacuum may be both see pressure. But I'm also 100% certain neither of these are high pressure filters in terms of being special or unlike other standard filters like the filters with spanner wrench fittings and thick walls. Not only are they missing features for tightening and securing, but they are thin metal like all the rest. And most importantly, much too large to hold any significant pressure.

So really, we have no idea what's behind Kioti's specs and I still find it incredibly odd there are two filters for the same fluid.



What I really want to get out there is that when removing the transmission filter 2.5 gallons of fluid dropped. This really pissed me off because I was not prepared for it. Not prepared for that much to come out...nor enough to refill the system. Had I known this ahead of time, I would not have changed either filter until 200 hours when the oil and oil filter are called to be replaces.

I know the HST filter of the DKse tractors see 255psi, though the HST itself sees around 5000psi. The DKse's HST filter has a much thicker shell than the one you are showing for the ck2610 HST.

But regardless of pressure, the reason for two filters is to provide better protection of the HST by itself, as the filter is placed just before entry to the HST. After that first suction filter there are many places the oil must travel. Many places it could pick up debris before it finds its way to the HST. An example would be the power steering unit (in the DKse series). If the power steering pump were to fail, the next stop for the oil is the HST. Without the dedicated HST filter, the HST would also be destroyed. For the CK tractor, it could be a charge pump failure that would destroy the HST, if not for the dedicated HST filter. After a power steering pump, or charge pump failure, the suction filter can do nothing to save the HST.


Speaking about first oil changes, most folks who carry out a lot of heavy machinery maintenance can tell you how trashy oil can look at the first 50 hours of any new equipment. I know my kiotis oil looked opaque in color, with a teaspoon worth of grit mixed in on that first 50 hour change. Its never look that bad since. Most likely was sitting in the bottom of the sump, having been flushed out of every port and too heavy to be sucked up. But beyond the items that have fallen out of suspension, there are elements in the oil that are not filtered out, that can be just as bad for lubricated equipment. Anything less than 11 micron, (or whatever filter is being used, this is the DKse filter mesh) will continue to build within the oil as the hours go by. Same goes for any foreign chemicals that can get into the oil. The quality of oil is far more than a particulate count.

Its great to see you mention opening up your filters, I would encourage anyone to do the same. People can learn a lot about their equipment this way. If you have easy access to a lathe, it makes the job very quick, clean, and painless. But a hacksaw works fine. I was please to find out that kioti filters were built well on the inside with metal end caps and bypass valves, but I think many would be shocked at the trash they may find that it's picked up. Lots of metal and grit, the media completely gray from metal powder. Same goes for engines, you wouldn't believe the amount of metal powder that gathers on a magnetic drain plug in a freshly rebuilt iron block engine from all of the new parts mating together. The entire transmission of a tractor is no different. The last thing you want, is a filter full and bypassing on the original oil. A filter change at 50 hours can help prevent this. After the initial 50 hour change or so, the filters are never as compromised, and look much better internally.

I know all equipment and automotive companies make a lot of money on service, but I don't think its a waste for the consumer to do the 50hr. Especially when there are cheaper, and possibly even better brands, like Wix you have mentioned, or Donaldson out there with x-references to factory filters.


But there are far worse things one can do to equipment than skip the first 50hr filter/oil change. I just like rambling on about the subject of operation and maintenance.

I understand your frustration with loosing all that oil too, as a proper manual could have prevented that.

There is no acceptable excuse for the crap manuals provided by Daedong USA.
 
   / ck2610 hst hydraulic and hst filter question #10  
I know this is an old thread but I just found the same confusion with the manual for my 2017 CK2610HST. Another member pointed out this thread. Now I know which filters I need.

This brings me to another question I hope someone can answer: The manual calls for 5.8 Gallons of Hydraulic Fluid. I have to assume that is enough to cover both the hydraulic and HST functions (same reservoir) but just want to be sure.
Thanks
 

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