Can it pick this up?

[Johnbro]

So I want to be able to pick up a pallet with 2000 lbs of ice melt (in 50lb bags) and stick it in my plow truck. I think in addition to the 2000 lbs of ice melt, plus the weight of the pallet (~20lbs) I'll have to add some sort of simple box around three sides of the pallet to keep the bags from sliding off. so maybe the whole thing might weigh 2200 lbs?

I want to be able to put on some pallet forks and pick up the pallet "box" and put it inside the bed of my F350 just far enough to close the tailgate. Then unload it after the truck is back from a run.

My LA854 specs are rated to lift 1878 lbs at the bucket center and 2489 lbs at the pivot pin. What I don't know is whether this is more than the system can handle with a set of forks like these:http://www.skidsteerexpress.com/cgi-bin/shopper.cgi?preadd=action&key=ATTA1FORKS

It seems like it will be too much weight and the system will go into relief? Perhaps I could jack up the relief valve a bit with a shim and pull it off? The alternative is my wife and I (both well north of 50 YO) will have to load this stuff one bag at a time when there's snow forecast

Any thoughts???

 

[tungularafishcamp]

Johnbro your post got cut off some snot not sure what you were saying about a box. You could always try it and see how it does then lighten the load a bag or 2 at a time until you can. Would beat the heck out of doing the whole thing by hand.

On my little Kubota with hst I can coerce a couple hundred extra lbs out of the fel by tapping the hst peddle of few times in forward, it gives the hydros a bit of a surge to get up a little more. Wouldn't want to do it all the time but it has worked a few times with no ill effects so far.

Rick

 

[Scruffy1]

Hey John, we must be neighbors being Western WA. just a suggestion if your tractor won't pick up the whole load. Have it put on 2 pallets, they don't have to be 50-50 maybe just a few bags on the second pallet will be enough relief to lift the first pallet. Where about are you in WA, not too many places where you need a plow truck....But when we do, boy do we....

 

[crazyal]

Are you loading the bags onto the pallet or does it come that way? I would think you may be OK if you put a few more bags closer to the tractor. Do you have a set of QA forks or the kind that slide onto the bucket? The QA kind will lift more since the load will be closer to the tractor. Instead of a pallet maybe you could make something more of a rectangle shape, again to help keep the weight closer to the tractor.

 

[Argosy]

On the forks the weight will be well past the center of the bucket and more than the tractor can handle. Throw a few bags off a full pallet onto another pallet, see what it will lift. If you raise the empty pallet right beside the full one all you really have to do is slide them across. You might want to consider shrink wrap it will be lighter if you come close to needing a full pallet, might save a trip home for that last bag.

 

[Baby Grand]

If you have a hook on the back of your bucket and can (safely) rig a pair of slings thru the pallet you may be able to lift it, but I'm not sure if you'll be able to get it into the back of your truck. Please tell us you will be doing this on a paved, flat surface.

The idea of breaking the one load down to 2 smaller pallet loads, as Scruffy1 suggested, seems like it would be the best way to go.


-Jim

 

[JoeL4330]

I have an 853, same specs ...I cannot load a 1 ton pallet (wood pellets) onto my F350 ...but I can, just barely off load the full pallet ...FEL is already raised, and I can get a little lift (and, think about it, the truck springs help), so I can get it off, barely ...I cannot curl, however and given the geometry it is a little chancy lowering the pallet since you need to curl up to keep the pallet level...you wouldn't have that problem loading because you would already be curled up at ground level and merely have to uncurl at the truck bed ...but, I am convinced I could not load the pallet and so don't think you can either ...

Best advice above was to partially offload onto a second pallet.

There is one trick I will try next time I have to deal with a pallet of pellets: the pallet is 48x40 and is normally loaded onto my bed the "long" way by the forklift. next time I will ask them to load 48" widthwise, which will get the center of the load 4 inches closer to the pins and might just give me a little extra capacity.

I hadn't thought about trying to fool the pressure valve, but I don't believe I actually vent ...just a tiny bit of lift and no curl. [there is another thread on the board about replacing the loader hydraulic cylinders with higher capacity ones, but that sounds daunting to me.

will be interested in how you make out. incidentally, I looked for the lightest forks I could find that were 48" and rated at 2000 pounds ...Bradco, in my case

 

[Johnbro]

thanks to all for the input. Scruffy, yes we are neighbors, I'm down the road a bit in Duvall. Wife's started a landscape maintenance business and in the winter we focus on snow and ice removal, thus the need to load all the ice melt into the plow truck. If we'd been in the plowing biz two winters ago I'd probably be retired by now

I'll keep you posted on what we do. I think some QA pallet forks are in my future, but it looks like we'll have to break a full pallet down into smaller loads.

 

[leonz]

I would strongly suggest that you cut the load in half as YOU will end up with the nose of the tractor eating gravel due to the the fact that you do not have an over center control valve and the tractors tipping point which is with boom level and the bucket level which is what they are referring to will be past the point of balance with the load.

You will be better off just leaving a pallet in the truck and loading bags in the bucket and doing it that way as the boom and bucket will not be overloaded.

The problem is the pallet any pallet is sticking 3 plus feet over the proper center line and proper lifting arc of the boom-EVEN WITH A CURVED BOOM THE SAME PROBLEM EXISTS.

This makes the boom and bucket 3+ feet longer than it is capable of handling with the proper balance.


The QA pallet forks will cause the same problems for you.

Add some steel mesh frame sides to the bucket to carry the loaders rated capacity and you will have no safety issues and you will live longer.

 

[Scruffy1]

Duvall, ya that's not too far. I wish I had a snowblower for the snow we had 2 yrs ago, I could have paid for it from all the driveways I did. Although they are saying this year is suppose to be a good one too. Good luck with your business and pallet situation.

 

[JoeL4330]

forgot to mention necessity of rear counterweight or implement, but I'm sure you know that...

incidentally, you can split the load onto two pallets and vertically stack the pallets in your bed, ...maybe a piece of tarp over lower pallet to avoid abrasion... and some thought given to the height and stability maybe cargo net/straps

if you customize your second pallet (the one onto which you offload onto), it can be wider than 48", which you would load first and which will add some stability and lower the total load a little.

I don't think it's practical to load two pallets, one behind the other...taking the forward-most back out would involve pulling the pallet toward you 'cause your forks can't reach...

finally, you won't regret a set of QA forks; you'll be surprised how much you use them.

 

[jinman]

My LA854 specs are rated to lift 1878 lbs at the bucket center and 2489 lbs at the pivot pin. What I don't know is whether this is more than the system can handle with a set of forks like these:http://www.skidsteerexpress.com/cgi-bin/shopper.cgi?preadd=action&key=ATTA1FORKS

What are the physical dimensions of the pallets (length/width)? Your forks will probably weigh around 250# and that will be mostly close to the pivot pins. Your load will be centered much further out than the bucket center because your pallet will be 42" to 48". So your load of 2200 lb will be centered out at 21" to 24" and that makes it far more than your loader can lift to the height of a F350 bed. My guess is you may be able to coax it off the ground, but surely not much higher than 6" to 1'. I think you will have to partially unload the pallets to another pallet so that your average weight is somewhere in the 1600# range. You can reduce the loads of three pallets enough to make a fourth pallet and your tractor can handle the load. If you were removing the load from a flatbed and lowering it to the ground, you would probably be okay with enough rear ballast, but raising this load from the ground to your pickup bed will not be something you can do with your loader in my opinion. My loader has similar specs to yours and I would never try this. You need a much bigger tractor to be able to manage the weight of pallet forks and 2200 lb of palletized materials. Our tractors just cannot compete with forklifts.

EDIT: I have once lifted a 1-ton weight by removing my pallet forks and bucket so that only my quick hitch adapter was attached. I made a cradle of chains (you could use straps around a pallet and load) and lifted the load centered at the pivot pins. If you could figure a way to attach the staps to the loader and lift this way, you might get that pallet into your pickup. It will be a challenge for sure.

 

[texasjohn]

I can lift 2800 lbs with my LA 853, but this is right at the limit... I did it as follows.

1. had the dealer install a shim to raise the relief valve pressure to a tad over max specifications (it was substantially below spec initially)... I convinced the mechanic that I was extremely careful thus since he didn't have a slimmer shim he left it at just over max spec PSI. This was mandatory, without it I could not lift off the ground.
2. I removed the bucket and used chains to attach to my load thru the center brace pipe, thus bringing the load BEHIND the QA pivot point and removing weight from the FEL.
3. Put an additional 1000 lbs on my box blade for rear ballast...critical else you will nose dive when lifting the weight.
4. filled my front tires to exactly max PSI...critical since all the weight is on the front tires...if low, they will roll off the rim.
5. Make sure the QA is curled all the way toward the driver.

with all the above, i can lift 2800 lbs about 1 foot off the ground before the relief valve pops. Further, it is possible to get a tad more height if you try lifting and SIMULTANEOUSLY have someone put upward pressure on the load...although the relief valve will hiss, you can get a few more inches this way depending on strength of the person lifting. The hydraulics will hold the load at the height achieved when you let up.

My net...you are at the limit of what is doable, but by being clever you may be able to do it...let us know how it works out.

Try all the above tricks, then off load a bag at at time until you are there.

Good luck!!

 

[JoeL4330]

Get a foot off the ground? You would only be shy about 3 feet to slide a load into my F350 ...and hoisting with a chain? the chain would have to be as high as the pallet load is, plus the four feet to the bed ...how high can your loader lift (and, how would you feel with a ton that high up?

There is, of course, another alternative: build a loading dock and get the tractor up even with the bed ...I believe that with my 853 (same specs as I recall) I could just manage to slide the pallet in and out ...the dock would have to be about 7 feet wide (tractor wheel width with some maneuver) and have a pallet landing space of 4 ft plus the height of your tailgate (which you could take off, of course, to make the job easier) so, say 6 ft plus the length of your tractor lengthwise and, as mentioned, 7 ft wide...all quite doable if you have the space (in the right place), the fill (or a natural hillside you can cut into, ditto a place you can approach with the truck) and some HD landscape timbers.

You might find uses for it after the snow season is long gone.

 

[crazyal]

If you have access to a welder and some other tools I bet you could make a couple pieces of pipe you could slide through the slots for the forks in the pallet. You then could attach a chain on each end of each pipe to make a sling. Like others have said if you don't have the bucket or forks on the tractor and just run the chains up to the QA and you should be able to lift the pallet.

 

[texasjohn]

Johnbro.... try the crazyal sling scheme along with my suggestions....this creates the least weight up front allowing for maximum actual payload weight. Don't underestimate the benefit of getting hydraulic moved to maximum spec pressure....there are numerous reports of shipping from the factory with settings below spec, and it makes a REAL difference in your lifting capacity which is only noticed when seeking to operate on the edge of what is possible.

Worst case, I predict you will only have to offload one or two bags to do the lift. We're beyond the range of what can be calculated....it's determined specifically by your particular tractor, it's relief valve setting, position of load to be lifted, height you need to lift to, and weight of FEL attachment to pick up the load and exact weight to be lifted.

By the way... it cost me only $35 to get the relief valve checked and shim inserted at the dealer, plus my time and cost to trailer tractor to dealer.

 

[Johnbro]

As always, this forum is great! Thanks to all for the very useful input.

My takeaway is that 2000 lbs on a pallet is too much to safely transport and load on my truck. Therefore I might as well split my loads--I might be able to get my dealer to split one pallet across two (1000 lbs each) which should be easy to load. I have to be extra conservative because no, we don't have a flat level place to do this but I'm an old fart so I'm way past the "watch this!" stage of my life.

the alternative (which sounds better and better) is to have them put a pallet load in the truck, re-install the tailgate spreader, and just leave it in there until we run out. Even if I'm only loading and unloading over the side of the bed using a pallet is better than the bucket--we already ran a "test" unloading half a load (20 bags) into the bucket and then stacking those from the bucket. the tractor handled the load fine (1000 lbs) but the bolts securing the digging bar were a real threat to tearing the bags. I don't want to remove the digging bar all the time (I use the loader a lot) so pallet forks would be handy. Think I'll get them. Question is, 42" 48" or 60" ?? any experiences out there?

 

[Fxfymn]

I have 48" on a much smaller tractor than yours. Never wished they were longer.

Once you buy them you will wonder how you ever lived without them. I use the pallet forks equipped with a home made grapple for 90% of what I do with the tractor.

 

[tungularafishcamp]

I also use mine 90% of the time. I went with 48 which are perfect most of the time. Only time I need longer is loading/unloading pots and it was easy enough to build an extension for that.

Rick

 

[KubotainNH]

I made my pallet forks, they really add to the usefulness of having a loader. There's tons of posts on here about making them, which bucket mounted ones work best and how to fix them so they don't slide around too much.