Calling all dog behaviorists

[coachgrd]

Hello all.

Not sure If I posted this but we lost our golden retriever Bailey in January when we had to put her down. We always thought how nice it would be for her to have had a buddy to pal around with. Recently I heard about a litter of Goldens locally here in town and we got two males which are now 8 weeks old. Sadly I am no longer the love of my wife's life. These little guys are great so far and while they do have their accidents, the house breaking seems to be going well.

I do have a question for all the wise folk here in Rural Living. These two brothers love to play rough. They seem to trade off and on who will be the aggressor. How much of this rough play to I allow? They do let each other know when the other has gone too far. Should I let them police themselves as far as this play goes?

Finally, I'm curious what interesting things you been able to get your dogs to do over the years. We're trying to teach these two little guys to jingle a bell hung from the door when they want to go out rather than barking at the door and it seems to be working remarkably well so far...while they don't ring it on their own, they do know that when they hear it, they are going out. We'll keep working on it. How about all of you...any great things you've taught your dogs?

On a related note, if I can find a video of Patches the horse, I'll post a link. You will simply not believe what this horse can do.
Here it is: YouTube - Patches the Coolest Horse

Thanks in advance,
Gary

 

[Tororider]

I'm no Dog Whisperer but I figure as long as they aren't tearing each other apart, its just rough-housing. They will figure out their pack order.

When I was a kid, I was able to get my dog to play dead with no words, I would just make a pretend gun with my hand, drop the hammer (move my thumb), and he would fall over "dead". I was a teenager so I thought it was cool.

 

[DarinRay]

Yeah I too am NO dog whisperer but can add that we bought a brother and sister (both fixed of course now ). They are 10 months old now and still have there growling and carrying on but NO real damage. I hate the sound of it because they sound wild and scary and a terrible sight really. Sometimes I do step in and break it up. This is all part of knowing how hard to bite and not cause harm I have been told. The best thing is that they are each other's buddies for life and would get 2 as pups again for sure. Double the work but double the pleasure too. Have to admit though we haven't really tried any extensive training like I do hear about. Guess I am just lazy or too busy. hmmmm

Darin

 

[ToadHill]

I have 2 Bassets and while one is 10 months old and the other is 8 years old, they still play at fighting every day, no one gets hurt and after a few minutes I step in and let them know who is the leader of the pack. They get the idea right away and both go off in different directions. I don't think it's anything to worry about they just have to re-establish the pecking order now and then.

 

[RonMar]

That is normal behavior, and from what I under stand an important development tool to learn limits and when they are hurting one another. I think they will mostly grow out of it.

Our yellow lab Sadie rings bells hanging on the door to go outside. We mainly did this as she didn't find her voice untill she was probably 9 months old. She picked it up in about 2-3 days what the bells were for. If you are crate training, as I am sure you are aware, as soon as they come out of the crate, they go right outside to build that routine. For Sadie, this meant a brief stop in front of the door. There I would pick up her paw and ring the bells with her paw, give lots of praise and open the door for her to go out. She took right to it and still does it. She does the basics sit, stay, heel, playdead, loadup, ect(all said as a single word). I have trained quite a few dogs over the years, but have never tried it with two. You may need to schedule some separate time to train each individually to avoid distraction. The biggest thing is consistency and timing on your part. If you are consistent, the dog quickly learns how to learn, then a new skill is the work of a few half hour sessions or less.

Have fun, they grow up so quick...

 

[CurlyDave]

When we took our second female yellow lab to obedience training (the first one was trained at a different school), there was a handout that went over specific characteristics of various breeds.

About the first thing on it was that retrievers (all the different kinds) love to roughhouse right on up to full body slams. Ours are now 5 & 6 and still sometimes get into that mode of play.

I suspect that males are more prone to roughhouse, and young ones more so than old ones.

We never had a problem with injuries. The dogs seemed to know how far to go.

Just sit back and watch in amazement.

 

[schmism]

let them play as rough as they want as long as its play.

watch the behavior. A tucked tail is always a give away that someone isnt having fun. My 2 labs play ROUGH, when they bite ate each others fir around there neck and shake it hurts just to watch, but waggy tails and no wimpering means its all in fun.

Also, dont be afraid to get in there. As pack leader there is no better time to assert your dominance than to get in the middle of a rough housing play and become the aggressor yourself. pinning both, chasing them around etc.

Just about anything can be taught with positive reinforcement.

at the top of my list is
-dont jump up on people
-dont run in/out the door while im walking through (they will either go ahead with a comand, or follow behind naturally)
-proper leash behavor

a huge one which is one of the most difficult.
recall. Nothing better than a dog that recalls.

personally ive never saw the point in the "stupid" tricks. play dead, roll over, walk on 2 legs....

you want to show me something, recall your dog off a rabbit/squirrel/cat/duck chase 1.5 seconds into it. or drop a stake trimming on the floor, give a "leave it" command and have the dog ignore it (till you say)

mine dont nuisance bark (or bark much period) nor whine (although i did have a whiner which took some doing to break)

 

[riptides]

Interesting that someone comments they grow out of it. I think they never grow out of play mode.

Two of ours, brother and sister, both over 110 pounds go at it quite often.
Usually one hears teeth snapping together, I guess their sign of "play". But man, when they come together it is like two suma wrestlers. The female turns her fur up and looks like a horror movie dog. Kind of makes her look bigger! Unreal.

I try and stay out of their way, I have been knocked over just by a brush against me.

Teach basic commands so any friend can control them - down, sit, back, no, good. Reward accordingly. Enjoy.

-Mike Z.

 

[riptides]

you want to show me something, recall your dog off a rabbit/squirrel/cat/duck chase 1.5 seconds into it. or drop a stake trimming on the floor, give a "leave it" command and have the dog ignore it (till you say)

mine dont nuisance bark (or bark much period) nor whine (although i did have a whiner which took some doing to break)

Excellent points.

Good typo!
Mine tear into "wood" all the time. I never taught them that.

-Mike Z.

 

[Blagadan]

I second the idea of you getting involved with their play. I do it all the time with my two goldens. The oldest is a male, 14 years old and he still manages to play even though he is really slowing down these days. The younger female, 2 years old, is the real fun one. She loves a good wrestle. I always let her win a few rounds to keep her confidence up. She will get her teeth around my wrist and bite down, but not hard. If I say "ouch" she stops instantly and licks me to death as a kind of "sorry boss"!!
She body slams the older dog because she knows she is stronger than him. If he has the toy, she will run at him and WHACK into him, full side on body slam (I'm sure she has seen WWF some where). He drops the toy and she picks it up triumphantly... I cant get her out of this habit no matter how I try..
The older male loves a tugging match. He'll bring up a toy and tease me. Say a tennisball... He'll have it on the tip of his mouth as he approaches me, almost as if he is about to offer it up to me. As I put my hand out to get it, he'll take it in deep in his mouth and wait for me to try get it... tug of war begins!! If I say drop he does let go instantly but I rarely ask him to drop, no fun in that is there!!

As for your dogs and their fighting, I personally would step in straight away to stop them. You are the pack leader. You tell them what is right and wrong... I treat mine like I do the kids, I wouldnt let the kids fight, same goes for the dogs.

Good luck!!

 

[MossRoad]

....Finally, I'm curious what interesting things you been able to get your dogs to do over the years. We're trying to teach these two little guys to jingle a bell hung from the door when they want to go out rather than barking at the door and it seems to be working remarkably well so far...while they don't ring it on their own, they do know that when they hear it, they are going out. We'll keep working on it. How about all of you...any great things you've taught your dogs?....
Gary

When I was a kid we had a dog. When he would come inside the house, we would say "Wet Feet!". He'd plop down on the floor and hold his legs up for us to wipe off his paws. Then we'd hand him the rag and tell him "Take it to the laundry" and he'd take it to the laundry room and drop it on the floor in front of the washing machine then meet us in the kitchen for his treat.

If you held up one, two or three fingers he would bark that many times. If you held up four, he would bark until told to stop.

Here's some other commands he would respond to:
sit
sit up (beg)
shake hands
other paw (left handed shake)
lay down
roll over
other way (roll the other way)
dead dog
dead dogs don't wag their tails (he'd stop)
dead dogs don't have their eyes open (he'd close them)
up (he'd stand on his back legs)
where's name?( he'd find any family member in the house)
go see name! (he'd go hang out with that family member and leave you alone for a while)
get the paper (he'd meet the paper boy at the end of the driveway and bring the papter back)
take it to name (he'd take whatever you put in his mouth to who ever you told him)
WARN EM!! and snap your finger and point at someone (he'd show his teeth, growl real low and scare the bajeebers out of that person).

He could also climb ladders, jump over stuff, etc....

Funny thing was, we got him from the pound when he was about 2 years old. The people gave him up because they said he couldn't be trained!

R.I.P. Skippy! Good dog!

 

[DarinRay]

Speaking of training them to do tricks how did you stop the whinning? My 2 will whine when I come home or when people come over. Big babies!

darin

let them play as rough as they want as long as its play.

watch the behavior. A tucked tail is always a give away that someone isnt having fun. My 2 labs play ROUGH, when they bite ate each others fir around there neck and shake it hurts just to watch, but waggy tails and no wimpering means its all in fun.

Also, dont be afraid to get in there. As pack leader there is no better time to assert your dominance than to get in the middle of a rough housing play and become the aggressor yourself. pinning both, chasing them around etc.

Just about anything can be taught with positive reinforcement.

at the top of my list is
-dont jump up on people
-dont run in/out the door while im walking through (they will either go ahead with a comand, or follow behind naturally)
-proper leash behavor

a huge one which is one of the most difficult.
recall. Nothing better than a dog that recalls.

personally ive never saw the point in the "stupid" tricks. play dead, roll over, walk on 2 legs....

you want to show me something, recall your dog off a rabbit/squirrel/cat/duck chase 1.5 seconds into it. or drop a stake trimming on the floor, give a "leave it" command and have the dog ignore it (till you say)

mine dont nuisance bark (or bark much period) nor whine (although i did have a whiner which took some doing to break)

 

[riptides]

When I was a kid we had a dog.

R.I.P. Skippy! Good dog!

Smart dog, smarter owners.

Got two of mine dead stopped on commands during "I see rabbit, I am dog" quest.

Now if I can get them to stop biting through chain link, all will be well. I actually have a portion of a dog pen, with two chain link barriers.

Strong dogs, weak owner.

-Mike Z.

 

[kenmac]

About all I can get mine to do is. He will come when I call him to eat Of, course , I don't have alot of time to spend with him

 

[MossRoad]

Smart dog, smarter owners.

Got two of mine dead stopped on commands during "I see rabbit, I am dog" quest.

Now if I can get them to stop biting through chain link, all will be well. I actually have a portion of a dog pen, with two chain link barriers.

Strong dogs, weak owner.

-Mike Z.

We've had some not-too-smart ones, too! A border collie mix that was as dumb as a box of rocks. Really lovable dog, but about the only tricks she knew was how to wag her tail and drool on your Sunday clothes.

I did have one dog that knew most obediance coommands, plus shake hands and stuff. But his best trick was if you looked at him and yelled "SNEEZE!" he'd wind up a big old sneeze and blow snot all over your shoes. Sometimes he'd sneeze so hard he'd hit his nose on the floor and sneeze a coulple times more. Once he was done sneezing, he'd start barking until you told him to stop. We found out about the sneeze trick when I was trying to teach him to speak (bark on command). He mastered speak! pretty fast, but I found that if you waited an hour or so, walked up to him and told him to speak!, he'd sneeze first, then start barking. Soooo, instead of saying speak! I'd just say sneeze! It was a cool trick, before the days of video cameras. I was going to take him to Letterman for Stupid Pet Tricks, but by then he was too old to travel. He lived a good 14 years with that sneezing thing. Must have had sinus trouble or allergies or something. Best dog I ever had.

R.I.P. Dog. Bless you.

 

[dmccarty]

Speaking of training them to do tricks how did you stop the whinning? My 2 will whine when I come home or when people come over. Big babies!

darin

Try ignoring them when you come home. Kelly is the Uber Whiner. She was that way when I picked her from the litter. She would whine all of the time. Sometimes this was good like when she wanted outside but often just a pain.

One day I came home and ignored her when she created me. Told her to go lay down. After I got done doing what needed to be done I want to her and said hello. She pretty much stopped whining. When she would meet me at the door and whine I would responsed to her by petting her. Thus she learned that whining got her attention. I ignorned the whinning and it went away.



Whish I had done this years ago.

But poor old Kelly is on her last legs. Surprised she has lasted this long but she won't last much longer. I think she was that one extraordinarly dog one might be lucky to get in life. She would recall when chasing deer, dogs, cats, squirrals and the meter reader.

GREAT dog.

Later,
Dan

 

[DarinRay]

Thank you for this information. Now the female is starting to whine. Oh boy! Got to nip this in the butt fast. I will have to try to ingnore them like you mentioned.

We had a heck of a dog that seemed like a timex watch.. Just kept ticking. He was going strong but then slowed some and wasn't much later he left us for the "Rainbow Bridge". Holy crap it's been over 1.5 years and it's still hard talking about it.

Darin

 

[sunspot]

My wife and I have a couple of PBVG's that are brother and sister. When they play/fight, they hip slam each other. Funniest darn thing to see.

PBVG=Petit Basset Griffon Vend馥n

 

[VABlue]

Training retreivers is about the easiest thing you can do in only 20 minutes day! But start now, while they are pups, and you teach them to learn. Just like a kid, they can absorb information easier and quicker when they're young. Not so many bad habits to unlearn!

I recommend reading 'Water Dog' from Richard Wolters. Its easy to read and understand, and will help you get basic obedience into them quickly. That said, ignore his age timelines and advance as quickly as your dogs learn. Getting a well behaved canine citizen is actually pretty easy... If you are willing to put in the little time EACH DAY that it requires.

 

[davitk]

My son plays basketball with "Cosmo", I came outside and they were playing.... don't know who taught whom.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=CbTH34RTevo

The dog does his business on command, "hurry up", runs to the hay field (we never clean up ), before he comes in we tell him to "dance", spins in circles on the door mat to wipe his feet.

We also have a 13 year old Shepherd mix, he still mixes it up regularlly with 2 year old Cosmo; top dog has not yet been estabished.