bucket size

[Kodiak45]

I just added front remotes to my dk40se and now I'm looking for a 4n1 bucket. It's amazing how expensive those things are. I found a 60" at a great price, but this is 12" smaller than my current bucket. I'm trying to figure out the downsides and upsides to losing 12" of bucket, besides the obvious... capacity, not able to clear tire width with front bucket, less bucket visibility, etc... but it would be more maneuverable and have a little extra lifting capacity for the loss of 12", fit on the trailer better so the forks don't hang off the side near as much, etc.. I guess I'm just looking for anyone with experience and what you have realized with a larger vs smaller bucket.

I have issues with the search link on here sometimes(and now) or else I would try and search, I'm sure I'm not the first who as asked this question.

 

[MESSMAKER]

Unless you move a LOT of material often, I doubt it would make much difference.

 

[NHbotanut]

My tractor had a 50" bucket & I got the WR Long 4in1 bucket. You won't really see much difference in carrying stuff, but the versatility in unbelievable!

You won't regret it.

 

[gladehound]

I have a DS4510HS so basically the exact same size tractor as yours. It came with a 65" bucket. I asked them to switch it out of a wider bucket but they wouldn't do the swap without me paying the entire price of the other bucket. I was getting a really good deal so I just took the 65" bucket. Now to the point. I've put 100 hours on with this bucket and have never even noticed that It is not as wide as the tractor which is ~69.5". It's really nice for the maneuverability in the woods. The only time I've wanted a wider bucket is for clearing snow. You have another bucket that is 72" so I see no reason at all not go get the 60" 4 in 1. If you are in the woods a lot, I think you will really prefer it to a 72" bucket. I have a high volume 72" bucket for snow now but if I take that in the woods I have to drive very carefully compared to with the low volume 65".

 

[TSO]

Personally, I would opt for 72" to cover your tire width. For an extra foot of bucket, you're likely looking at a max weight difference of 100 lbs.

Subsequently, you probably wouldn't lose any actual volume going from the Kioti 72" to that 60" ... Kioti buckets are really small.

 

[IslandTractor]

I have a DK40se and both the standard 72" bucket and a WRLong 60" 4n1. Unless you are moving large amounts of mulch or sand I don't think the actual volume capacity of the bucket makes a whole lot of difference. I rarely have a truly full bucket of material in either bucket so losing 25% or so with the 4n1 isn't a big deal.

The WRLong 4n1 is very well built and I do find a few uses for it but frankly it is a waste of money if you already have a standard bucket and grapple. And, if you don't have a grapple before considering a 4n1 you need to seriously consider what you will be doing with the 4n1 that you could not do much more efficiently with the grapple for much less money.

From my experience, the 4n1 is a Swiss Army knife. Nice to have if you can only have one tool but virtually never the tool of choice. The only time I find my 4n1 truly useful is when I have my backhoe mounted and I am digging either stumps or trenches and need to backfill. The 4n1 makes a TERRIBLE grapple substitute for carrying brush because of the top hinge which means that everything below the object that clamps first between the two jaws will simply fall out of the bucket. It is perfectly fine for picking up precisely one branch but that top branch will prevent the bucket from clamping on anything else and as gravity is your enemy with a 4n1 everything else below that branch will not be secured. A grapple has gravity as a friend as the lower tines hold the load and the upper clamping arm just keeps it from falling forward. I've used standard bucket, standard bucket plus toothbar, standard bucket with rachet rake, grapple and 4n1. The 4n1 is more useful than the standard bucket alone but less productive than any of the others for specific digging, dragging or carrying tasks.

The 4n1 can "bulldoze" but that is a really bad thing to do with a tractor FEL unless you are going very slowly. Much safer to do that sort of work with a box blade. I cannot even remember right now what the fourth function is in a 4n1 but I haven't found it useful (I think they count the ability of the extended front blade to cut when pulled backwards....dangerous to the bucket in my opinion).

Bottom line: if you like Swiss Army knives rather than real tools you will be happy with a 4n1. Otherwise get the real tools first. The exception to that statement is for someone who is trailering a tractor and cannot take multiple implements with him to do a job. 4n1s make perfect sense for a general contractor for example.

 

[hunt4570]

I have a DK40se and both the standard 72" bucket and a WRLong 60" 4n1. Unless you are moving large amounts of mulch or sand I don't think the actual volume capacity of the bucket makes a whole lot of difference. I rarely have a truly full bucket of material in either bucket so losing 25% or so with the 4n1 isn't a big deal.

The WRLong 4n1 is very well built and I do find a few uses for it but frankly it is a waste of money if you already have a standard bucket and grapple. And, if you don't have a grapple before considering a 4n1 you need to seriously consider what you will be doing with the 4n1 that you could not do much more efficiently with the grapple for much less money.

From my experience, the 4n1 is a Swiss Army knife. Nice to have if you can only have one tool but virtually never the tool of choice. The only time I find my 4n1 truly useful is when I have my backhoe mounted and I am digging either stumps or trenches and need to backfill. The 4n1 makes a TERRIBLE grapple substitute for carrying brush because of the top hinge which means that everything below the object that clamps first between the two jaws will simply fall out of the bucket. It is perfectly fine for picking up precisely one branch but that top branch will prevent the bucket from clamping on anything else and as gravity is your enemy with a 4n1 everything else below that branch will not be secured. A grapple has gravity as a friend as the lower tines hold the load and the upper clamping arm just keeps it from falling forward. I've used standard bucket, standard bucket plus toothbar, standard bucket with rachet rake, grapple and 4n1. The 4n1 is more useful than the standard bucket alone but less productive than any of the others for specific digging, dragging or carrying tasks.

The 4n1 can "bulldoze" but that is a really bad thing to do with a tractor FEL unless you are going very slowly. Much safer to do that sort of work with a box blade. I cannot even remember right now what the fourth function is in a 4n1 but I haven't found it useful (I think they count the ability of the extended front blade to cut when pulled backwards....dangerous to the bucket in my opinion).

Bottom line: if you like Swiss Army knives rather than real tools you will be happy with a 4n1. Otherwise get the real tools first. The exception to that statement is for someone who is trailering a tractor and cannot take multiple implements with him to do a job. 4n1s make perfect sense for a general contractor for example.

I am going to have to agree with IT here, I bought my tractor with a Long 4N1 and a standard bucket. Used it for a few months and the 4n1 never really got much use.. kinda like that jack of all trades, master of none. I didn't think it did all that well at anything really. I traded it for a Grapple... Oh what a GREAT trade!!! With a bucket and a grapple you can do anything the 4n1 ever dreamed of and more.... LOTS more, and quite a bit more efficiently also.

My thoughts... skip the 4n1 and get a grapple instead!

 

[FatTire]

The WRLong 4n1 is very well built and I do find a few uses for it but frankly it is a waste of money if you already have a standard bucket and grapple. And, if you don't have a grapple before considering a 4n1 you need to seriously consider what you will be doing with the 4n1 that you could not do much more efficiently with the grapple for much less money.

.

This is refreshing. Quite often people defend whatever it is they purchased, regardless if it turned out to be a good tool. Hats off to Island Tractor.

 

[Kodiak45]

In my mind, a grapple seems to be only good at one thing, moving brush or logs or maybe digging roots and stumps if it were capable. If I were clearing land, then a grapple seems sensible. A 4n1 bucket can do anything a standard bucket can do and just as well.... right? One of the first projects I have is tearing down an old barb wire fence that has a combination of metal and wooden posts. In my mind a 4n1 bucket that can clamp down on the posts and pull them straight up without bending the metal ones, then pile it up and dig a hole and grab the pile and bury it all with the same bucket. I'm not arguing, but I am just trying to think of how much brush and trees I might clear and while it's a few, it sure isn't that much. Call me lazy, but changing buckets sounds like a pain, especially if you have to drive across the property and grab your grapple (no pun intended) and then go back to wherever you were and move the tree or brush that was in the way. By no means is changing buckets like changing 3pt implements, but I hate getting off the tractor unless it's a necessity. If I can get a 4n1 bucket for 1200 vs a wicked grapple for 2000..... and the 4n1 bucket has teeth, which my factory bucket does not have.

 

[IslandTractor]

1) An excellent grapple can be had from Everything Attachments for about $1500+/- including delivery.
2) yes, a 4n1 can do the post pulling project you have in mind and would allow you to avoid getting off the tractor.
3) a simple post pulling device attached to your standard bucket with a chain would also work but would involve hopping off and on. $20 is is cheap though. Amazon.com : Metal T-Post Puller : Patio, Lawn & Garden

I don't mean to say that there is no role for a 4n1, it is after all a Swiss Army knife. If you had the option of getting a $1000 credit from Kioti to deliver the tractor/FEL without a standard bucket then it would make a lot of sense to invest that $1000 plus whatever extra to get a good 4n1. I just don't see the 4n1 as a terribly effective tool given it's cost unless you are truly stuck with a single FEL attachment.

$1200 for a 4n1 is pretty cheap unless it is used and in decent condition. I'd be concerned about manufacturing quality if that is a new 4n1 for $1200. I got mine used but a new 60" WRLong is over $2000.

 

[big bubba]

the consensus here seems to go wide as possible. advice well taken. in my own case, i went with a narrower ft. bucket because i did not want extension beyond the front wheels that might catch a fence post, tree, or other. it could be a safety issue to say the least. but many here will advocate wider than that...just measure how much beyond your ft. wheels the 72" will go & use your judgement. how much gained, how much will put you at risk when you're moving quick & not necessarily paying full attention. just a thought erring to caution....

 

[Kodiak45]

The 4n1 is used and appears to be in decent shape. 1500 for a grapple isn't bad. I didn't look too in depth as all I saw was about 2000. The post puller would salvage the posts, but I'm more concerned with cleaning up the debris than saving posts, honestly.

 

[IslandTractor]

So long as you are happy knowing the pros and cons I certainly wouldn't advise against a 4n1. I do use mine on occasion and it is handy. My point was only that it is about the least cost effective tool I own in terms of purchase price new versus utility. And, many people think it substitutes for a grapple which it very clearly does not. For someone who has a particular project that requires some light duty grappling/grabbing, a decent bucket and occasional need to "bulldoze" gently it is fine. Again, just like a Swiss Army knife.

 

[dfkrug]

I guess I'm just looking for anyone with experience and what you have realized
with a larger vs smaller bucket.

I love my 60" Long 4n1 on my CK30. For the DK40, a 72" would be appropriate, but not wider, IMO. These
things are heavy and expensive, prob $3K for a 72". The wider you go, the more beefy you have to make
a 4n1, to compensate for the extreme hydraulic forces.

As for the utility of a 4n1, it is not the greatest grapple, but it does grapple large rocks well, centered. And,
for pulling saplings it works great, with the 2 sharp jaws. A conventional 2 top-jawed grapple bkt will not do as
well with big single rocks, and you can not really grab a 4" standing tree trunk very well with most any grapple.

The biggest value of a 4-in-1 is in loose material handling. No other implement works better.

 

[IslandTractor]

A conventional 2 top-jawed grapple bkt will not do as
well with big single rocks, and you can not really grab a 4" standing tree trunk very well with most any grapple.

How about these examples to show that a grapple can manage big single rocks and tree trunks. As far as standing 4" tree trunks, just knock'em over, stick the grapple underneath and pop'em out. Which of these tasks can be done with a 4n1???

 

[mikeharold]

I have a DK40se and both the standard 72" bucket and a WRLong 60" 4n1. Unless you are moving large amounts of mulch or sand I don't think the actual volume capacity of the bucket makes a whole lot of difference. I rarely have a truly full bucket of material in either bucket so losing 25% or so with the 4n1 isn't a big deal.

The WRLong 4n1 is very well built and I do find a few uses for it but frankly it is a waste of money if you already have a standard bucket and grapple. And, if you don't have a grapple before considering a 4n1 you need to seriously consider what you will be doing with the 4n1 that you could not do much more efficiently with the grapple for much less money.

From my experience, the 4n1 is a Swiss Army knife. Nice to have if you can only have one tool but virtually never the tool of choice. The only time I find my 4n1 truly useful is when I have my backhoe mounted and I am digging either stumps or trenches and need to backfill. The 4n1 makes a TERRIBLE grapple substitute for carrying brush because of the top hinge which means that everything below the object that clamps first between the two jaws will simply fall out of the bucket. It is perfectly fine for picking up precisely one branch but that top branch will prevent the bucket from clamping on anything else and as gravity is your enemy with a 4n1 everything else below that branch will not be secured. A grapple has gravity as a friend as the lower tines hold the load and the upper clamping arm just keeps it from falling forward. I've used standard bucket, standard bucket plus toothbar, standard bucket with rachet rake, grapple and 4n1. The 4n1 is more useful than the standard bucket alone but less productive than any of the others for specific digging, dragging or carrying tasks.

The 4n1 can "bulldoze" but that is a really bad thing to do with a tractor FEL unless you are going very slowly. Much safer to do that sort of work with a box blade. I cannot even remember right now what the fourth function is in a 4n1 but I haven't found it useful (I think they count the ability of the extended front blade to cut when pulled backwards....dangerous to the bucket in my opinion).

Bottom line: if you like Swiss Army knives rather than real tools you will be happy with a 4n1. Otherwise get the real tools first. The exception to that statement is for someone who is trailering a tractor and cannot take multiple implements with him to do a job. 4n1s make perfect sense for a general contractor for example.

I learned how to use and have only used a 4in1 on a Bobcat skid steer and compared to a standard bucket there is no comparison. You're right, a 4in1 IS a swiss army knife, it can do many things and do them well. I think it's a matter of being taught how to use the tool properly. A grapple has it's place for sure and is a very useful implement, but you can't pick up the last bit of a pile of dirt, sand,ect with it, and you can't open a grapple up and scrape down the dirt. I do agree that they aren't great for bulldosing. Of course there are plenty of people that say you can't do fine grading with a skid steer, but the guy I learned from does it as fast or faster and as good or better than anyone I have ever seen with a skip and drag(it does have to be a track unit).Again, I think it's all in knowing how to use a particular tool and I was taught how to use a 4in1 and they are extremely versatile. They do take a while to get the hang of though.

 

[Kodiak45]

Another factor that I forgot to mention is that my current bucket does not have a tooth bar, and those things are fairly expensive and considering the 4n1 I'm looking at already has a tooth bar is a huge bonus. The fact that I only carry a leatherman instead of a pocket knife, pliers, screwdrivers, and etc is what I'm hoping the 4n1 will serve as and the Swiss army knife is an awesome analogy.

 

[Kodiak45]

Another question for kioti owners. Has anybody had an issue with pairing up with skid steer style bucket mounts? I need to measure, but I was just curious if anybody has seen any compatibility issues

 

[IslandTractor]

Another question for kioti owners. Has anybody had an issue with pairing up with skid steer style bucket mounts? I need to measure, but I was just curious if anybody has seen any compatibility issues

I haven't had any trouble mounting generic skid steer implements to my DK40se. The standard DK40se bucket however is a narrower mount than most skidsteers (go figure) so it might be hard to mount the Kioti bucket onto a skid steer.

 

[KubotaToy]

I had a four in one for about a year after I bought a root grapple, never installed it again, finally sold it. I found it to a compromise in most areas I worked which was clearing land, brush handling, moving dirt, and it was heavier than either the bucket or grapple. Grapple spends 95% of the time on the my L45 now.

That being said if I could only have one attachment, it would be a 4in1, it will do a lot but just not as fast as a specific tool for a job.