Bringing the draft back ???

fivestring · Apr 23, 2004

"Why not real choices like Bob Kerrey on the Democrat ticket vs Powell on the Republican? Men of principled intelligence." 

1. Average American can't see thru the smoke to tell what the person stands for. So, come primary time, TV exposure, lip service and past family party affiliation are gospel to them.
2. Average American spends too much time in front of the TV. This TV time is usually sitcoms, "reality" shows, talk shows, soaps, etc. Not very educational.
3. Average American has other priorities: sports, dining out, vacations, etc. The election issues aren't important enough to them.
4. Real men don't want the job based on the above.

It's all about power. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

That's my guess.....

Maybe this time, I'll vote for all newcomers.
Although I'd hate to see Nadar as Pres. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

DAP · Apr 23, 2004

( ... Remember how Reagan (in his first term, before his mind faded) used to take his thoughts to the public on TV and radio...so even if you disagreed with him you understood his motives and felt somehow heard? )

Pete ... whoa ... now I'm really confused ... you mean his mind faded AFTER he was elected? But I thought ..... oh, never mind.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

DAP · Apr 23, 2004

( I'm not impressed with Kerry either, and wonder what is it about we Americans where time after time we end up with choices like Bush vs Kerry? )

Don't mistake this for cynicism (and why I am having a political debate is beyond me) but I've come to the conclusion that no man I'd consider smart enough to run this country properly would ever entertain taking the job.

Kinda like groucho's quote: "I'd never join a club that would have me as a member!"

/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

OkeeDon · Apr 23, 2004

One time when the cable was out, and all I could get were broadcast channels, I stumbled across the late night version of the Jerry Springer show. As I watched these idiots, one thought came to me -- "These people can vote!" I've had a better understanding of the process, since.

AndyM · Apr 23, 2004

I'm not impressed with Kerry either, and wonder what is it about we Americans where time after time we end up with choices like Bush vs Kerry? Why not real choices like Bob Kerrey on the Democrat ticket vs Powell on the Republican? Men of principled intelligence. 

Here's what it's all really about...

Each political party's main goal is to have a candidate from their party elected into the Oval Office. The person who ultimately ends up on the ticket on each side is the most electable, but not necessarily the BEST person for the job. The two parties don't care at all if the BEST person gets elected, so long as someone from THEIR party gets in. Each party, along with the media, hypes the most electable people by giving them the most time, and the person who is best for the job is left standing in the shadows with little attention.

I'm going to use Kerry and Dean in my first example.
(By the way, these are just examples. Let's not argue about the specific people in the examples.)
Dr. Dean made one loud obnoxious speach early on and anything he said before or after didn't matter anymore, both to his party or to the media, while John Kerry is a very polished and slick speaker, comes from a rich distiguished family and has a wife with a famous last name. Even though one person may be better at running the country, the other one is better at convincing the voters to elect them into the White House, which is what is more important.

The next example goes back to the 2000 election, with Bush and McCain. Unfortunately for John McCain, he was running against someone with a famous name. Bush got all of the attention, simply because he stood the best chance of defeating the opposition. McCain stood even less of a chance defeating Gore than Bush did. Even though he may have had the brain to run the country, he didn't have the face or the voice or the name to get elected.

That's what it's all about folks. Spend millions of dollars to get elected, and as soon as you get in, you spend the next four years working on getting reelected. Power is more important than the day to day business of running the country.

[Edit] Pete just reminded me about the 1980 Republican primary. The ex Hollywood actor (Reagan) had much more electability than the former representative, senator, and CIA head (Bush I). Qualifications don't matter, only electability.
Just ask Arnold Schwarzenegger and Jesse Ventura. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Boondox · Apr 23, 2004

(

Pete ... whoa ... now I'm really confused ... you mean his mind faded AFTER he was elected? But I thought ..... oh, never mind.

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif )

I don't recall... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Pete

slowrev · Apr 23, 2004

OkeeDon,
If you look at the statistics with the IQ spread, college education, non-literate, etc among the american population you will find that this country is run by the dumbest people because they are in the majority. One of the downfalls of a "democracy". Makes it easier to understand why we wind up with some of the "winners" in public office.

fivestring · Apr 23, 2004

Hank, this will really frost ya....

I was just emailed an AP photo of Kerry with Jane Fonda at a anti-war rally.
No surprise there.

My minds definitely made up, now!

Hank_Kimball · Apr 23, 2004

5 String I sent a funny one to your email. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

fivestring · Apr 23, 2004

I liked that.
Ain't it the truth?

I sent one back to yours....

Gatorboy · Apr 23, 2004

I sent my self an email -- oops, I already know that because I've got NEW mail in my email box. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

I guess I didn't need to type it in here afterall.

( sorry guys, I couldn't resist )

Hank_Kimball · Apr 23, 2004

Thats a keeper Gary.
When I have a little more time this weekend I will send you a few more I have.

fivestring · Apr 23, 2004

I thought about you when I sent that. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
It was the only way I could get his e-mail address. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Chuck52 · Apr 23, 2004

Would that be the famous hoax picture, where Fonda's image was pasted into a photo of Kerry sitting at a rally? I believe folks have already made the point that you really have to think for yourself when it comes to what you read in the papers and see on TV....you might want to extend that process a bit.

As to the idea of the ignorant amongst us deciding the fate of the country, I'd ask that we consider the obvious diversity of opinions expressed in this thread, and think about the possibility that we might represent a fair subset of the US population. Differing views may well be the result of ignorance on one side. How sure can we be which side we occupy? I know character assasination and lies are a standard component of the poilical process and have been since the beginning of time, but does it not seem that it has hardened in the recent past? The other candidate must now be not only wrong in his thinking, but actively involved in evil conspiracies to undermine the country. In my view, black and white are rare in nature, while gray is very common.

My best friend recently sent me a poitically oriented joke. He really did think it was funny. I would have no difficulty whatever in finding a representative piece of "humor" which would gravely insult him. He's my friend, so I won't.

Chuck

Boondox · Apr 23, 2004

( Men of principled intelligence? Kerry? Here you have a man that has the environmentalists support,these people who thinks you are the scum of the Earth if you have an SUV.Kerry owns a private jet/is hauled around in SUVS/limos and has 4 or 5 mansions sitting around the country(talk about efficiency).
)

Hank, I realize you're new here, so will simply ask you to go back and reread what I wrote. I'm not slamming your beliefs; in many ways I agree with them. Also please note that I referred to Bob Kerrey and not John Kerry -- they are two different men. I'm talking about the one who left his leg back in the Nam.

We try very hard to keep it civil here at TBN. Please don't escalate things to attack level or this wonderful thread will be shut down by the moderators. We can agree or disagree, but we're not enemies.

Respectfully, Pete

Boondox · Apr 23, 2004

( I sent my self an email -- oops, I already know that because I've got NEW mail in my email box. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

I guess I didn't need to type it in here afterall.

( sorry guys, I couldn't resist ) )

Positively elegant! /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

fivestring · Apr 23, 2004

Photos can be doctored.
Voting records can not. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Boondox · Apr 23, 2004

( I know character assasination and lies are a standard component of the poilical process and have been since the beginning of time, but does it not seem that it has hardened in the recent past? The other candidate must now be not only wrong in his thinking, but actively involved in evil conspiracies to undermine the country. In my view, black and white are rare in nature, while gray is very common )

Chuck, now there's a fundamental truth!!! I was for years an avid listener of talk radio, the conservative stuff. I stopped listening not because I changed my political views, but because all they talked about was how bad and "un-American" the other side was! They say the word "Liberal" like it was some sort of expletive! I haven't heard an original thought on conservative talk shows for years...so I quit listening.

Now I listen to a local progressive. He's pretty liberal, and I disagree with 99% of what he says, but he does his listeners the courtesy of discussing the issues with listeners of all points of view. In the end, nothing is really decided, nobody has changed their mind, but all of us have been educated in how the other side thinks.

I'm not sure where this need to vilify the "other side" comes from. During my Marine Corps days the mantra was, "Do you know what you call a liberal?" Answer: "An American just like you and me." When did we lose that..?

Pete