Branson 4020 Hydraulic Problem?

[ronT]

Does anyone else have this problem or is it normal?

I recently had 2 hydraulic hoses blow. One at the control valve and on a different day one near the bucket.(got a oil bath from the one at the bucket /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif) They control the roll on the bucket. I replaced the hoses and now my problem /question is.

Let’s say you are in a tough spot and can’t back up and you want to use the loader bucket to help push you back. Roll bucket back fully, drop to ground and bring bucket forward to lift or push tractor back. Mine wouldn’t move under load. I have to raise loader up some before it will move with hydraulic power. There is little or no power in cylinders until the bucket is vertical with no back tilt.

Dealer said this is normal /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif especially since I have a toothbar on my bucket which changes the angle more. I’m sure it didn’t act this way until after the hoses blew. I also removed the toothbar with no change.

Also 2 of the metal fittings on the hydraulic hoses on each side of the control valve after about an hours use get too hot to touch.

Waiting & waiting for dealer to get back to me. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

Any responses will be appreciated. Thanks

Ron

 

[Big_Lug]

ronT,
Mine also gets very hot on the control valve but I have good rollback. I haven't had any hoses bust or anything.

 

[wallace]

Are the hoses that are getting hot the ones that are connected to the tilt cylinder that won't allow you to rollback under pressure(if your stuck).
If so you have a restriction in the valve and it needs to be looked at, there may be a piece of trash stuck in the port restricting the flow..

 

[ronT]

wallace,

The hoses to loader bucket stay cool. Shown in pic are hoses that get VERY hot. Looks like one to pump and other to transmission.

Not sure if it means anything but also sight glass for fluid level shows full with engine off but after running and warmed up it shows just below low mark. Then returns to full mark with engine off. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Thanks for your reply,
Ron

 

[ronT]

Big_Lug

I'm not superstitious but knock on wood if no hoses blew.

One wasn't so bad but now a second one. Almost afraid to use it now. The overall hydraulics also seem weaker. Maybe it's the pump.

They are going to replace the control valve it looks like. Been out of service for 2 weeks now...waiting, waiting tapping my fingers. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Have a good day.
Ron

 

[SnowRidge]

<font color="blue"> (Not sure if it means anything but also sight glass for fluid level shows full with engine off but after running and warmed up it shows just below low mark. Then returns to full mark with engine off.) </font>

Sounds normal. The 3ph height will make a difference. Check that at both extremes and see if it falls significantly below the low mark when it is running.

 

[SnowRidge]

I don't want to hijack the thread, but who built that toothbar, and how much did it cost?

 

[ronT]

SnowRidge,

Check out this thread, it's been discussed there. Mine was around 450.00 give or take. Toothbar works great...now if only my loader would.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Board/century/Number/386875/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/all/vc/1

Ron

 

[SnowRidge]

Thanks, Ron.

 

[MadReferee]

Those two hoses are the pressure hose from the pump (it connects to the loader valve inlet) and the power beyond hose (it connects back into the circuit which eventually gets to the 3pt). The third hose is the return to tank and will only flow oil when one of the loader cylinders exhausts fluid.

The heat on those hoses is normal especially if you have a high flowing pump. If you are flowing more than 7 gpm thru those 3/8" hoses then the hoses are sized too small.

However, the 90 degree pipe fittings could also be acting as mini-restrictors which could cause heat buildup in the fittings. If you can't get a straight fitting to fit properly I might suggest a JIC fitting which would have a smoother less restrictive 90 degree angle.

 

[ronT]

I checked out a Century tractor and tried the hydraulics. The loader worked great like it should...not like my Branson 4020 does.

I need to have power to the roll cylinders on the bucket when I'm occassionally in a tight spot and need to use the buckets hydraulics to give me a little extra push to back up.

Sorry to have bought the Branson now if this is normal (as I'm being told). Maybe better quality cylinders would work.

Thanks all,
Ron

 

[Zork]

Hi Ron, the last time I used my bucket to help me back out was when my backhoe sub frame got me hung up crossing a wet bog and 4wd wasn't helping. My bucket worked fine then and I usually dont run at full rpm's. I'll have to check agian. When you broke your hoses, were they physically damaged or struck in anyway? My loader, so I'm told has a restrictor in the lowering side of my loader (I dont like) and its there because under full load the loader would drop quickly without it. The loader causes the engine to labor more going down than lifting something up. Please keep us posted.

 

[ronT]

fjb2c

Thanks for your reply.

When my hoses blew…nothing hit them, no physical contact to the hoses with anything. I was filling in some holes & ruts. One blew a hole in the hose about 1 inch beyond the connector the other blew the hose completely out of the connector which gave me an oil shower.(I no longer squeak though /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif )

I’m sure the bucket worked prior to the hoses blowing. But as the weeks go on…was I dreaming?…don’t think so. Also my lifting capacity noticeably diminished. They did replace my control valve and no hoses blew yet and lifting is better but still no hydraulic power on the curl back. (could it be the pump or cylinders?)

That would be Great if you could check yours again and let me know…I’d greatly appreciate it.

A good way to test it(in case I didn’t explain it right before) is to uncurl your bucket so the opening is towards the ground in a dumping position. Lower the loader and put some pressure on the ground and or brakes on, then curl bucket back towards normal position which should move tractor backwards or at least raise front end. Mine is dead in the water, nothing, just pump straining. I have to raise loader until NO strain is against it before it will move.

On mine…the engine labors more going up but drops quickly down, so no problem there with mine.

Thanks & have a good day.
Ron

 

[Zork]

Ron, not that I like it, but supposedly Branson has incorporated a restrictor in the return line of the loader to prevent RAPID drop under load. With that said, if yours labors going up WITHOUT a load, your lines might be switched. As far as your hoses, I would believe that since they blew so close to the connectors, WITHOUT ANY PHYSICAL DAMAGE, I would suspect connector installation methods and not worry about using it. The hoses are 3120 psi if I remember correctly. I am also a veteran at using my bucket to get me out of areas that would require a winch /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif. I will check my system and do some heavy work with it hopefully this week. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif It is a good little tractor with lots of promise for the money.

 

[ronT]

fjb2c,

Your hoses are 3120 psi? Mine are 2610 psi. The replacement hoses are 4000 psi.

If yours are 3120 psi I'm wondering if my loader might be a BL10 instead of a BL20 if thats possible. It has a BL20 sticker on the loader but it looks identical to a BL10 that I've seen pictured on the internet. It doesn't look like a BL20 I've seen pics of. For example "sassafraspete" who has posted pics of his Branson 4020. His loader is heavier looking than mine. His has 2 cross supports on the arms...I have 1.

Just trying to get a handle on what's going on here.
Thanks again for all replys.

Ron

 

[Zork]

Yeah, he has the newer mount type specifically from the center of the tractor. Mine has 2 cross members at the bucket but is supported from the center and the front grill. His is easier to service the engine, mine has more protection I think. I'll check to make sure about my hose psi, I know the bucket is 3120 but not sure about the loader itself. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[ronT]

fjb2c,

You are right...I looked again...hoses on loader are 3120 psi but the hoses from control valve to loader are 2610. I had one of each blow.

Pic I posted was of my tractor...not the other gentlemens.

Have a good day
Ron

 

[rameye]

Ront,

Just to add to your confusion.. I have a Zetor/century with an HL50 loader. I have full power on rollback. This is how I pop my boulders out of the ground.
I set the bucket fulldown, move the teeth againts the rock, set the brake and curl it up..."pop it goes"
Also the hL50 doesn't appear to have a restrictor for going down. If you pull the control hard she'll drop lock a rock.

Something just doesn't sound right, blowing hoses and all. Sounds like a safety issue that Branson should be aware of!

By rights your pressure should bypass well before reaching the breaking strenght of the hoses....right?

good luck ..let us know

 

[sassafraspete]

Hi Ron, Franz, and others.....
I have been reading your thread with interest Ron. I have been too busy picking tomatoes and corn and other garden goodies lately, and have sort of neglected the ole tractor. I do know that on mine, I have the older restrictor orafice, which allows the bucket to drop quickly. This is only an issue when I am picking up a large item and trying to sit it down gently...eg like the time I picked up my tiller from the back of my pickup, then set it down. I have a newer orafice but I have never taken the time to put it on. (I like the quick drop on an empty bucket). Any how, I haven't been in too many tight spots where I had to walk my tractor out with the bucket curl...so I guess I will have to get it out some time and make a point of playing with that. Maybe I will get some time this weekend to check it out. I am asuming all the other hydraulic functions are working ok for you? I can't imagine blowing 2 hoses.

pete

 

[MadReferee]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Your hoses are 3120 psi? Mine are 2610 psi. The replacement hoses are 4000 psi.)</font>

Sounds like you got 1-wire hoses. You should really have 2-wire hoses which is what the 4000 psi hoses probably are. They are much more durable.