Blame game

[/pine]

Let's not overlook the fact that former Vice President Dick Cheney recommended the exemption through his power as chair of President Bush's Energy Task Force.

Well (no pun intended)...can you imagine how the media would be reporting the issue if it had happened under the GWB administration? unfortunately for obama it is his administration that granted the exemptiom and since the disaster happened under his watch he's responsible...

 

[CDsdad]

Eleven men lost their lives on that rig and should not be forgotten in the rush to get the leak stopped. The families of those 11 men are suffering the highest loss of anyone. I think we haven't heard enough about them.

Thank You!

 

[Sigarms]

BP has already stated that it was BPs oil and responsibility and they will pick up the cleanup tab, but they did not cause the explosion.

Please don't tell me you're naive enough to beleive that.

 

[Redneck in training]

In this post you started
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/related-topics/171689-prc.html
you want jobs to stay in the U.S.

Well, here's oil production jobs in the U.S. Which way you want it?
Did you even hear what they think caused the explosion?
Did you here that BP was contracting out the work on the rig? The work was being done by the operating procedures of the drilling company, not BP.
BP has already stated that it was BPs oil and responsibility and they will pick up the cleanup tab, but they did not cause the explosion.

Some way BP caused the accident. The reason they contracted it out is not better experience of the drilling company but the lowest cost. The lowest cost often means old equipment and unskilled people.
I work for Oil and Gas as a vendor and see this all the time. I call it the lowest bidder syndrome. Fortunately for me the more they screw it up the more money I make.

 

[dave1949]

Well (no pun intended)...can you imagine how the media would be reporting the issue if it had happened under the GWB administration? unfortunately for obama it is his administration that granted the exemptiom and since the disaster happened under his watch he's responsible...

Thank you CDsdad for the inside info on BOPS. As usual on TBN, somebody has been there and done that - and is willing to share the knowledge.

What difference would it really have made if BP had not been granted the environmental review waiver? Eventually, there would have been an accident of this type on an off-shore rig, one that cannot be contained, or where the safety devices fail. That is a given since nothing is perfect as was already pointed out.

The review would have prevented none of that. If the reviews were to be taken seriously, no off-shore drilling would be permitted since everybody knows there will be real environmental disaster eventually. We are rolling the environmental dice on every one of these platforms, it's a risk that we pretend is acceptable given our dependence on oil.

We need to cure our addiction to oil, it's that simple.
Dave.

 

[tulenutn2o]

2Many. Exactly. I wish when I was growing up, being a crook was so profitable......but I was raised better than that. I was taught that the harder you work, he rewards will follow. Well, I thinks the rewards were STOLEN! I seem to work harder and harder- and there's always some politician, lawmaker, agency, whatever, with there hand out grabbing more of my money. How do you teach a son or daughter the virtues of hard work=better life, when it doesn't seem to be playing out that way. I told my wife many years ago, that our generation is the first that will not have it as well as our parents did..(My mother was a stay at home mom before the phrase was coined-I call her MOM! My wife and I work, basically-2 jobs each.I'll be lucky if I still am not working after I'm 6' under. Politicians keep piling more debt on our children all the time. I hate to say it, but I think this once great country is going down the path to extinction. Every other empire in history has failed. Is our government so arrogant to think that it can't happen to us?

 

[crusty 1]

Guy,s I guess I should have known better but I didn,t want to start who,s adm. stuff.Bottum line lives were lost,we use oil even though I think this may get people thinking about the true costs of using it,my grand kids will get stuck with the bill.As usual the oil companies made there deals with congress and are only going to be liable for a small part of the cost from what I,v seen.On top of my grand kids picking up the tab we don,t yet know about the eco damage thats being done thats my concern.I hope that it will be ok but we really don,t know.We,v been lied to for so long that I,m honestly at a loss for who I believe about anything any more.All I see is THE FAT cATS PLAY,WE PAY.worriedgranpa

 

[rekees4300]

Well (no pun intended)...can you imagine how the media would be reporting the issue if it had happened under the GWB administration? unfortunately for obama it is his administration that granted the exemptiom and since the disaster happened under his watch he's responsible...

There's plenty of blame to go around that's for sure. It is Obama's responsibility to get the disaster cleaned up but I just can not accept that he is responsible for causing it. The real root cause is 6,800,000,000 humans that need to consume Earth's resources to survive. As those resources become scarcer they become increasingly more difficult to harvest. Thus the need to drill oil wells in mile deep water.

 

[MossRoad]

There's plenty of blame to go around that's for sure. It is Obama's responsibility to get the disaster cleaned up but I just can not accept that he is responsible for causing it. The real root cause is 6,800,000,000 humans that need to consume Earth's resources to survive. As those resources become scarcer they become increasingly more difficult to harvest. Thus the need to drill oil wells in mile deep water.

If they'd open up drilling closer to shore they wouldn't have to go a mile deep.

 

[crusty 1]

agreed bird,but what a huge mess for everyone.I,m old enough it won,t matter for me, so I may have to get shrimp from China.Just very concerened about the outcome for the little ones.I hope all will be ok.Dave

 

[rekees4300]

"get shrimp from China"
Now that's a scary thought since they have exported toxic toys, drywall and dog food not to mention 1,000s of Walmarts full of junk?

"If they'd open up drilling closer to shore they wouldn't have to go a mile deep."
Doubt the folks in Santa Barbara would agree.

--------------------------------------------------------------------
May 12, 2010: 2:35 PM ET


NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- BP knew of problems with an offshore well hours before it exploded last month, spilling millions of gallons of oil into the Gulf of Mexico, a House committee chairman said Wednesday.

Rep. Henry Waxman, D-Calif., said the oil company told the Energy and Commerce subcommittee on oversight privately that the well failed a key pressure test just hours before it exploded on April 20.

The test indicated pressure was building up in the well, which could indicate oil or gas was seeping in and could lead to an explosion, said Waxman.

"Yet it appears the companies did not suspend operations, and now 11 workers are dead and the Gulf faces an environmental catastrophe," he said, asking why work wasn't stopped on the well.

 

[CDsdad]

Some way BP caused the accident. The reason they contracted it out is not better experience of the drilling company but the lowest cost. The lowest cost often means old equipment and unskilled people.
I work for Oil and Gas as a vendor and see this all the time. I call it the lowest bidder syndrome. Fortunately for me the more they screw it up the more money I make.

You are partially correct, but mostly wrong. I will ask this question first. Have you ever set foot offshore for more than a week? If you did and you think we're often unskilled and the equipment is old, please don't go back to those rigs or platforms, and you shouldn't do business with that company, it makes you look bad and endangers your life. A good businessman doesn't need bad customers.

You got one thing 1/2 right. It is cheaper for BP to contract their drilling than to build and maintain their own rigs. But, BP also does not have on their payroll people capable of running a rig. I never cared for Transocean's upper management when I worked for them in the '90s, but they have the best iron and best skilled people in the world to drill an exploratory well for commercially producable hydrocarbons. They have over 40 rigs running in water depths greater than 3000'. I know this because I've been on rigs owned by Ensco, Pride, Rowan, Nabors, H&P, Diamond, and yes, Transocean. Transocean is head and shoulders above them all.

Did you know any of the "unskilled" people on the Horizon? I have personally worked with some of the guys that died on the Deepwater Horizon. They were professional. They were humans and imperfect like we all are, but they were professional, so don't speak about things or people you don't know.

As far as the lowest bidder syndrome, do you think that is isolated to the oil and gas industry. Does your company buy from the highest bidder?

 

[arrow]

Since you have the experience CD , what is the general consensus of guys drilling for oil of how oil got in the earth in the first place.

 

[crusty 1]

I,m sorry I didn,t want the current in fighting to start haven,t we had enough of that?We are all Americans,hopefully civil to each other.I,v been around long enough to know that no one is always right and no one is always wrong.I claim NO party because niether cares about us only to further fatten thier own wallets and its at the kids expense.We should have been off oil long ago,for 100 plus years we,ve been stuck,aren,t we smarter than that?I,m done ain,t got but a few years left so makes no difference to me,but I,ll stand up for my grand babies till that time.We owe them better than this.Dave

 

[arrow]

Crusty, I'm not sure but I do not think there has been nary a post in this entire forum that if the subject kept going that the post would not turn beligerant by someone. I think its a "cyber" thing. Some of the toughest guys I know and worked with who in a physical confrontation could literally collapse the side of their opponents skull with one punch, were also the most polite and respectful toward people. You got it right. There may be thought differences but hardly any warrant some of the denegrating responses found at this site. Just about anything can be explained in a civil and gentlemanly manner. There is nothing you need to be sorry for.

 

[CDsdad]

Since you have the experience CD , what is the general consensus of guys drilling for oil of how oil got in the earth in the first place.

The industry accepted and scientific explanation as told to me firsthand by a petrophysicist for a MAJOR oil company. Organic matter decaying over time under temperature and pressure.

Whatever your definition of organic matter may be, the above should fit it.

The working man's view. God in His infinite wisdom put it there, by whatever means humans may or may not understand and the same for His reasons. That's what most folks I know believe.

 

[2manyrocks]

I was thinking of two older gentlemen today that totally disagreed about a matter without being personally disagreeable to each other. One of them passed several years ago, but the other I believe is still living.

 

[CDsdad]

If any of my comments have been rude or offending to anyone, I apologize. I'm not trying to take up for BP, Transocean, or Halliburton, as those are the 3 names in the news about the spill.

If I've been diligent to the point of being offensive about defending the crews aboard the Deepwater Horizon, I apologize for being offensive, but not for my diligence. Understand that one of the deceased was more than a former co-worker, he was my friend. We swapped e-mails of family pictures and good-natured barbs about one anothers sports allegiances. I still even have him in my e-mail contacts. Maybe I should quit commenting because it hits so close to home.

I know there are other members and visitors on here that work offshore or on land in the oil and gas industry. All I ask is for everyone to please remember the guys that did not and did get off the Horizon. Some of the survivors I've spoken with were almost to the point of feeling guilty they survived, because they couldn't rescue their friends and coworkers from an inferno. These people were not cold-blooded executives in business suits with an eye on the dividend per share. They were people just like a lot of us on here with hopes, dreams, families, and plans for the future. Sorry if I've gone on too long. Thanks.